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Trump Administration using Federal Disability law to disenfranchise minority voters

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posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 01:47 PM
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originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: Wayfarer

Which was started by the obama administration, and settled WITHOUT CLOSING THE POLLING PLACES by the trump administration.



Shortly before the 2016 election, the DOJ sent representatives to visit Navajo Nation chapter houses that serve as polling locations in Coconino County and found that almost none were ADA-compliant. The Trump DOJ took on the work and Coconino County eventually settled instead of closing any of its polls, agreeing to “provide an accessible voting program, including a program that is accessible to persons with mobility or vision disabilities and accessible polling places at accessible sites,” according to settlement documents.


So this practice was ok in 2016 before the election, but now it is vile?



Your article states "The Trump DOJ took on the work..." so, uh, I hate to tell you this, but that means the Trump DOJ took on the work. Ironically they settled with the Navajo nation. Wonder why they're not keen on settling on this....


You see?

and there we have it.

Obama started it, trump settled it.

Trump = racist, Obama = good guy


Oh look, another logical fallacy kids, this time in class we'll be learning about causal fallacies, in which Grambler will try and imply that because the voting rights act was gutting in 2013 and protections against financial discrimination in voting were limited, the DOJ under Obama are actually the ones committing the heinous act now under Trump's administration.


You see how you cant even remain consitent from post to post?

I thought this OP was about shutting down polling stations, not the voting rights act?

So when i discuss why that act was bad for outlawing voter ID, I am committing a fallacy and not discussing what you want.

But in your very next post you say its not about that Obama started the process to shut down these places, is that overturning the voting rights act was terrible.

As it stands, arguing that it was run of the mill for obama to target minority polls to close uner the ADA, but racist for trump to do so is hypocrisy.


The voting rights act is not only mentioned in my OP, I even link an article with hard data detailing its gutting and effect on total polling stations nationwide. It is as directly applicable to this discussion as something can be.

You are committing high-school level fallacies by making silly false equivalencies, or causal fallacies in an attempt to get at me, derail the discussion, shift the discussion into an area you feel more comfortable debating, or merely because you want to be a troll (which I actually don't believe).

I absolutely assert overturning the voting rights act was terrible, and repeatedly have claimed the fact that Obama's DOJ was enforcing the ADA is tantamount to nothing more than procedural (unless you can show me a case where Obama's DOJ went after polling locations using the ADA as a means of closing heavily conservative areas/sites down without recourse).

Obama's DOJ wasn't pushing for the closing of the polling locations, Trump's is.




posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 01:51 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer

I gave reasons why overturning the act was good, because it is absurd and racist toi make the argument that blacks are incapable of getting ID, and you said I was evil and committing fallacies for discussing that.

Again, you can keep saying the word fallacy, but the big one is saying trump following in Obamas foot steps and shutting down polling stations that dont follow the ADA makes him a racist.

That is as ridiculous as me saying this story should be democrats mad that trump wants disabled people in minority areas to be able to vote.

The fcat that you think its racist for trump to do the same thing Obama was doing shows yoou are being a hypocrite.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 01:56 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer

Thank you!

Surely someone of your immense intelligence can realize it doesnt affect all the "poor people", or that polling stations are hours away from each other.

They bussed enough of them last election to get the majority vote, so whats your beef exactly?



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:00 PM
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originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Wayfarer

I gave reasons why overturning the act was good, because it is absurd and racist toi make the argument that blacks are incapable of getting ID, and you said I was evil and committing fallacies for discussing that.

Again, you can keep saying the word fallacy, but the big one is saying trump following in Obamas foot steps and shutting down polling stations that dont follow the ADA makes him a racist.

That is as ridiculous as me saying this story should be democrats mad that trump wants disabled people in minority areas to be able to vote.

The fcat that you think its racist for trump to do the same thing Obama was doing shows you are being a hypocrite.


Because I never said nor was the OP about blacks being incapable of getting ID. That's something you brought into the debate as a logical fallacy.

Trump isn't following in Obama's footsteps, he's taking it one step further. You are the one continuously asserting that I've claimed Trump is doing exactly what Obama did, which I patently haven't said.

The only ridiculous thing is the fact that I have to keep explaining this to you over and over and over again in the same thread.

I have at several points in this discussion outlined the difference between Obama's DOJ in this regard and Trumps, so the fact that you view them as entirely equivalent after I've stated the contrary implies it is you who are either acting disingenuous in this debate by willfully misrepresenting/misquoting me, or a critical inability to absorb contrary information to what you have already made up your mind on.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:01 PM
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originally posted by: Butterfinger
a reply to: Wayfarer

Thank you!

Surely someone of your immense intelligence can realize it doesnt affect all the "poor people", or that polling stations are hours away from each other.

They bussed enough of them last election to get the majority vote, so whats your beef exactly?


Uh, you do realize there is more than one election than the presidential one, right?.......



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:05 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer

Yeah, they get bussed around to different districts in the state.

Take a look at the vote tallies in the last round, can you honestly say they lost because the "poor black folks" didnt get to vote?



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:12 PM
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originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: Devino

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Deetermined

Yeah I live in a rural mostly white area in PA.

I know people that have to drive half an hour to vote. Even further to get to a DMV to get an ID! And the dmv is only open one day a week!

Damn these anti white racist voting laws!
If you have to pay for ID to vote then it is unconstitutional. I would think it likewise if it were extraordinarily difficult to get an ID like drive hours to a DMV that is closed 6 days a week, but that's just my opinion. It's not a black/white thing. It's a constitutional thing, always has been.


every voter ID bill I have heard about offers free state issues ID's for any and all who would need them. The argument was that Black folks weren't able to navigate to the places to get the free ID. In reality, needing an ID to vote hampers the ability to fudge votes, and cheat.
There is an argument that it does make it more difficult for some, and possible extremely difficult for a few, to vote which is considered a voter suppression tactic. Personally I don't have a problem with voter ID laws so long as they aren't disenfranchising voters.

No need to "fudge" the vote tallies when we have electronic vote machines that are so easily hackable. Georgia has the right idea concerning this.
Lawsuit tries to force Georgia to use paper ballots in 2018 elections



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:12 PM
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originally posted by: Butterfinger
a reply to: Wayfarer

Yeah, they get bussed around to different districts in the state.

Take a look at the vote tallies in the last round, can you honestly say they lost because the "poor black folks" didnt get to vote?



My reference is aimed at other races than just the presidential race (senate, gubernatorial, etc). Is the system working perfectly when I have to buss poor folks to their polling locations an hour away as the designed manner of our nations voting system? Rich folks have polling locations in their neighborhood clubhouse, and the poors have to drive 40 miles to the nearest Methodist church.....is no different then having a cost associated with voting. Sure, the cost is inconsequential to the rich and burdensome to the poor, but its fair right?



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:20 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer

You are implying trump is racist for doing this, and somehow saying the repeal of the voting rights act is what you want to talk about.

That act said voter ID was illegal because it was racist.

That is dumb, and assumes blacks are inferior to others, and cant accomplish the simple task of getting ID's

I know that is dumb and racist because as a poor guy who lives in a poor rural white area, that has to drive about 30 minutes to the dmv, where there is basically no public transportation, and that dmv is only open for ID's one day a week, my area too would have been affected by the same claims.

And there are many places just like this

And yet no one assumed we were incapable of getting id, hence why they said it was too hurt black people.

I chose top reject that racist way of thinking, because I feel black people are every bit as capable and competent as me.

So the ACT you wanted to talk about, and said overturning was a racist thing to do; I also wanted to talk about that because I think the act itself was racist.

In other words, just like how it was ok for Obama to investigate minority polling places under ADA but its racist for trump, you are being hypocritical, and want to talk about the ACy when you want, but dont want anyone to support repealing it.

You want to call people who overturned it racist, but want to call anyone who says supporting it racist evil and not being on topic.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:24 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer


Then they have 70 or so days to pass compliance.

My point is, they buss anyway, so whatever. Absentee ballots are an option, the DNC can start a campaign to educate those they think cant figure it out?



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:26 PM
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originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Wayfarer

You are implying trump is racist for doing this, and somehow saying the repeal of the voting rights act is what you want to talk about.

That act said voter ID was illegal because it was racist.

That is dumb, and assumes blacks are inferior to others, and cant accomplish the simple task of getting ID's

I know that is dumb and racist because as a poor guy who lives in a poor rural white area, that has to drive about 30 minutes to the dmv, where there is basically no public transportation, and that dmv is only open for ID's one day a week, my area too would have been affected by the same claims.

And there are many places just like this

And yet no one assumed we were incapable of getting id, hence why they said it was too hurt black people.

I chose top reject that racist way of thinking, because I feel black people are every bit as capable and competent as me.

So the ACT you wanted to talk about, and said overturning was a racist thing to do; I also wanted to talk about that because I think the act itself was racist.

In other words, just like how it was ok for Obama to investigate minority polling places under ADA but its racist for trump, you are being hypocritical, and want to talk about the ACy when you want, but dont want anyone to support repealing it.

You want to call people who overturned it racist, but want to call anyone who says supporting it racist evil and not being on topic.




Listen dude, I'm not saying you are racist and I don't think you are racist, so you don't need to prove to me or anyone else here that you're not. If I've made you feel that way somehow I'm sorry. You deserve the benefit of the doubt.


I think you are mistaken about the portion of the voting rights act I'm referring to. I'm referencing it specifically to bring light to the issue of polling locations closing nationwide, and in the case of the OP correlating with the trend in Georgia to reduce them coincidentally in low income areas. The voter ID portions are indeed part of it, but not directly what I'm referencing or relevant to the closure of polling locations.

I have implied that I believe Trump's organization (now enforcing without recourse the ADA as a means not of getting polling locations fixed and up to speck, but rather close them down) smacks of either racism or downright malicious will to defraud voters of their right for the sole purpose of affecting future elections.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:29 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer

IMO it is "vile" for any in government to attempt to stop any eligible voter from voting.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:31 PM
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originally posted by: Butterfinger
a reply to: Wayfarer


Then they have 70 or so days to pass compliance.

My point is, they buss anyway, so whatever. Absentee ballots are an option, the DNC can start a campaign to educate those they think cant figure it out?




But it sounds like your arguing because the left figured out a way to empower minority voters to get around the roadblocks set up to prevent them from voting, that everything is working splendidly.

The 70 day compliance window doesn't magically make an impoverished township will the funds necessary to comply into existence. Its not a recourse to correct, its a mirage, and the actual effect is understood by Trump and companies targeted enforcement in almost exclusively minority/left leaning areas.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:34 PM
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originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: Wayfarer

IMO it is "vile" for any in government to attempt to stop any eligible voter from voting.


I agree 100%

I want all voters to vote effortlessly. All Republican voters, all Democrat voters, all Libertarian/Constitutionalist/Communist/etc voters as well. Anyone who wants to vote.

The post above by Butterfinger re: Absentee Ballots is something I actually support. Paper trails are great, and Absentee ballots are one manner of making voting fair/easy for everyone.

I want the parties in power to have won by an accurate vote number of all the folks that want to vote, and not because they prevented their opponents constituents from voting.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:37 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer

I dont care if you call me racist, but I dont think you did.

You did call me "evil" though.

The act was bad, it should have been overturned.

I think saying trump is racist for this is beyond hyperbole, just like saying the democrats against trump here hate disable people voting

I dont disgaree that I would like every body to have as ease of access voting as possible, with an easily obtained ID.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:40 PM
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originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Wayfarer

I dont care if you call me racist, but I dont think you did.

You did call me "evil" though.

The act was bad, it should have been overturned.

I think saying trump is racist for this is beyond hyperbole, just like saying the democrats against trump here hate disable people voting

I dont disgaree that I would like every body to have as ease of access voting as possible, with an easily obtained ID.



I shouldn't have implied you were evil, and there isn't an excuse for that. So I'm genuinely sorry I lashed out like that.
edit on 34pm18fpmThu, 23 Aug 2018 14:41:56 -0500America/ChicagoThu, 23 Aug 2018 14:41:56 -0500 by Wayfarer because: change of heart



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:41 PM
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On a side note (or maybe on topic depending on how you look at it), our disabled persons laws or so dumb.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:44 PM
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originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Wayfarer

I dont care if you call me racist, but I dont think you did.

You did call me "evil" though.

The act was bad, it should have been overturned.

I think saying trump is racist for this is beyond hyperbole, just like saying the democrats against trump here hate disable people voting

I dont disgaree that I would like every body to have as ease of access voting as possible, with an easily obtained ID.



I shouldn't have implied you were evil, and there isn't an excuse for that. So I'm genuinely sorry I lashed out like that.


Oh no, dont apologize!

Its all in good fun, I dont mind at all!

I didnt take it like you meant it seriously, and it certainly didnt hurt my feelings, so dont worry about it.

Now with the niceties out of the way...

I'm right and you are wrong!



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:49 PM
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originally posted by: SecretsoftheBlueApples
You do realize Jim Crow laws were institutionalized by the Democratic Party right? Otherwise, it's funny how a long standing law, which these places have ignored for years, and now being enforced, is spun towards preventing minorities from voting. Handicap folks are a minority, and the Hypocrisy in your post is self evident to anyone with a lick of common sense. It's okay though, the Democrats are busy scrubbing the updated Cemetery lists to update their voting rolls. It all they got LEFT...

Here's a Jam which will articulate their strategy...

Turn the Bass up on this one...
youtu.be...

"Straight Hustlas Caught Up in The Whirlwind..."


a reply to: Wayfarer

.


I just have one thing to say to you... ROFLMAO Nice shot, right between the eyes. I'm having a hard time figuring out how enforcement of the ADA is targeted at anyone other than the people who have ignored it as well. Just an FYI I'm disabled myself and am happy to hear that someone is finally doing something about it.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:51 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer

This is nothing new, and its not that they found a loop hole rather its is because they have a loop hole and use it to the hilt. I'm ok with this, its legal-ish.

They can and do, so that's their way to get around it. The DNC loves their base enough to pour money into this, they wouldn't have spent over a billion for Hillary. They can do it but wont because squeaky wheels always get the grease.



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