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Alabama officer shot, killed sovereign citizen; video released

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posted on Aug, 17 2018 @ 02:06 PM
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I see a future ware it will save your life
to just shoot ANY cop that stops you.
or you will end up dead!

because soon the cops will just shoot YOU!
So what would you do with a
jumpy cop that puts his hand on his gun?
or will you shoot as he takes his gun out?
good job I am in the UK.




posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 05:04 AM
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a reply to: SlapMonkey

He seemed to be resisting big time. Doesn't warrant lethal shooting...poor children

If police stepped back I'm sure the guy would have just stood there?



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 07:36 AM
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a reply to: SlapMonkey

O didn't want to say this earlier but your right they didnt control the situation. And i blame her she runs around not knowing what to do as the other two are wrestling. I wonder if a male officer just would have powered in there to help the other officer and would the outcome been the same? I know in that situation 2 people should have been able to restrain him. He was half the size of the one officer and skinny as a rail.



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 07:45 AM
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originally posted by: Bramble Iceshimmer Shut up, obey


never.



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 07:48 AM
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originally posted by: buddha
I see a future ware it will save your life
to just shoot ANY cop that stops you.
or you will end up dead!

because soon the cops will just shoot YOU!
So what would you do with a
jumpy cop that puts his hand on his gun?
or will you shoot as he takes his gun out?
good job I am in the UK.


I see a future where your behind bars for murder. Just the fact you even think this way shows they disarmed the UK for a good reason.



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 08:28 AM
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originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: buddha
I see a future ware it will save your life
to just shoot ANY cop that stops you.
or you will end up dead!

because soon the cops will just shoot YOU!
So what would you do with a
jumpy cop that puts his hand on his gun?
or will you shoot as he takes his gun out?
good job I am in the UK.


I see a future where your behind bars for murder. Just the fact you even think this way shows they disarmed the UK for a good reason.


i see a future present where the world's #1 superpower has the most law enforcement charged with murder yearly than any other advanced nations...



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 10:39 AM
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originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: carewemust
And police are upset by how little respect they get from the public...the people who pay their salaries.



People will say he shouldn't have resisted ,sometimes when you know you are right you just cant help yourself. but the cops should not have intervened at all it was none of their business and they were just looking for trouble.

They are responsible from start to finish IMO.


Other than the victim moving a bit while at the car I didn't see why the Officer yelled at him . He didn't walk even toward them until the cop yelled at him and he stayed at the car then. Weird stuff and just as bad as any stop in the MSM involving minorities killed by a LEO.

This guy wasn't a threat in that video but the female officer implied he was earlier so the male officer probably thought he should act. Still this didn't look worthy of a bullet in front of the man's kids no less.



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 10:41 AM
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originally posted by: Grimpachi
Force escalation.

A US citizen is 54 times more likely to be killed by police than a terrorist.


I hope that isn't true. But we probably know better without googling it.



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 10:46 AM
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originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: carewemust
I think he really didn't have a driver's license, which is why he didn't/wouldn't show one to the shelter employee.

When the police asked to see his D.L., the resistance started.



I dont think he did either.
But His wife was in the drivers seat so he does not have to have one. He claims he is/was a sovereign citizen and doesnt need one. If teh wife is driving he doesnt.


I didn't know the wife was driving. Anyway, these police dashcams are crap... Nowadays you should be able to see more details. Important in cases like this, especially.

Overall, the police body and dash cameras are increasing the public's distrust of local law enforcement, and potentially putting them in more danger too.

Putting them in danger for how they themselves handle a delicate situation. Dirty Harry took out the real crooks in his flicks but that is not easy to tell on a case by case basis. The LEO's deserve to go home to their family too but sure shouldn't be shooting to kill when the other person doesn't have a weapon in their hand and trying to stop a tazer wire is resisting arrest IMO. But pulling the trigger IDK?



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 10:50 AM
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originally posted by: odzeandennz

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: buddha
I see a future ware it will save your life
to just shoot ANY cop that stops you.
or you will end up dead!

because soon the cops will just shoot YOU!
So what would you do with a
jumpy cop that puts his hand on his gun?
or will you shoot as he takes his gun out?
good job I am in the UK.


I see a future where your behind bars for murder. Just the fact you even think this way shows they disarmed the UK for a good reason.


i see a future present where the world's #1 superpower has the most law enforcement charged with murder yearly than any other advanced nations...

They probably pay very little to LEO's compared to working in mid management at a place like Walmart and when you pay so little for something so important, huge mistakes are made that can't be taken back.



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 11:42 AM
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This is a problem we're struggling with. Unfortunately, we have way too many small-town cops that think they are the ultimate authority, law be damned.

I saw a female cop with an already bad attitude, backed up by another cop with a superiority complex who literally attacked a man without cause. That cop needs to spend the rest of his life in prison, without any solitary confinement entitlement for his protection. Sorry to the LEOs on this site, but if you think you can just go around starting fights so you can shoot people, you need to be locked up with the rest of the criminals.

This attitude issue is even creeping in where I live, out in the boonies. I don't call the cops if there is any way I can get out of it, and those few times I do, I approach them with caution. There are a lot of good cops out there who do great work, but these few, whose number is increasing, are destroying any trust we have in them.

And it will result in more deaths, on both sides, until the cops decide to become cops instead of gangsters in blue.

TheRedneck



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 11:55 AM
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a reply to: Justoneman

Police killed 1,129 US citizens in 2017. Yet only 12 officers were charged with a crime related to a shooting death that same year.

A pickup truck rammed into pedestrians near the World Trade center in New York killing 8. The attacker was self-radicalized and he had followed the Islamic State.

A Denver transit officer was killed by a mentally ill Army Veteran who had recently converted to Islam.

Olathe, Kansas shooting: A Kansas man shot three people after yelling "get out of my Country." The gunman said he believed the men he shot were Middle Eastern, but the victims were Indian engineers. An Indian man was killed and another was injured. Ian Grillot, an American who tried to save them, was also shot.

Charlottesville attack: A car plowed into a group of people marching peacefully during protests in Charlottesville, Virginia. One person was killed and 19 were injured.


So 2017 11 people killed in the US for what can be called a terrorist. One victim wasn't even a US citizen.

Same year 1,129 US citizens were killed by police.

So in 2017 a US citizen was 112 times more likely to be killed by police than terrorists.
edit on 18-8-2018 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 11:56 AM
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a reply to: notsure1

Wow. America is doing great. MAGA-BULLSHEET.



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 11:58 AM
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let's see

the thug shouldn't have fought with the police, this is what happens when thugs like this resist and fight the police

just another thug...



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 11:59 AM
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a reply to: Justoneman

This is what the cop said w.r.t. a real and/or perceived threat (it’s long but worth reading):


When pressed about the crime itself, Woodruff said Lawrence wouldn't show a license. "Is that your understanding of the law?" asked Sherrod during a deposition in August of 2017. "Yes," she said. "That just anytime you want to make a citizen produce a driver's license you can?" he asked.

Woodruff testified that she was afraid of Lawrence. "I mean you were afraid to try and arrest him?" She answered: "Absolutely." So she waited on backup. "He never threatened you by gestures?" asked Sherrod. "He threatened to sue me already early on," said Woodruff. "Okay, you're not claiming that he was subject to arrest because he threatened to sue you right?" "No of course not." "He never threatened your physical person, right? "Correct."

Then a couple minutes later: "You were scared, right?" "Yes." And then: "But it's not a crime for a citizen to make you uncomfortable, right?" "No, but when they do, you take action." "Did you shoot him because you were afraid there might be, he might have a gun?" asked Sherrod. "No," testified Woodruff. "You were already in fear of your life because you believed he was a sovereign citizen?" asked Sherrod. "I felt there was a threat, a possible threat there." Woodruff was insured at the time of the shooting.

The lawsuit late Wednesday was reassigned to a recent Trump appointee, U.S.. District Judge Emily Marks. As for excessive force, should the case reach trial, a jury would need to consider severity of the crime, threat to officers or others, and whether the suspect is resisting arrest or attempting to flee. In this case, both sides agree the underlying crime, if there was one, was minor. He did not flee.

The key dispute is whether Lawrence was a threat, whether he tried to gained control of the Taser, whether he reflexively grabbed for the barrel to stop be shocked, whether she let go of the Taser to grab her gun, whether a Taser in drive stun mode is a dangerous enough weapon to justify deadly force.

Woodruff ultimately testified that she shot Lawrence because he was trying to use the Taser on Officer Rhodes, who was holding Lawrence. "I was afraid that Officer Rhodes would be incapacitated, which would leave me."


Moreover, the officer personally insulted the guy’s physical appearance and hygiene, mentioning, “You're so smart you've got half the teeth in your mouth.” Finally, Rhodes, the male cop she claims she feared was in imminent danger, said, “I was just going to trip him and put him on the ground eventually until the other officers got here.”

Being an agitator, or even reflexively reaching for the business end of a taser (apparently, you can still stun someone with direct contact after the darts have been deployed), happens everyday without someone ending up in a pine box; this is a case where someone did and in reading through the linked article, it’s really difficult to come to any other conclusion than this was entirely avoidable and the family should be awarded damages.

Given the case law, she’s likely to skate on any criminal charges, but a good lawyer will help in brushing up on dept SOPs and training — a couple million dollars in compensatory damages and tacking on 3-6 times that in punitive damages will remind a few knuckleheads how to behave professionally.

a reply to: TheRedneck

ETA: @TheRedneck, that’s an interesting — and surprising — take on the gangsters in blue...is this more pervasive in smaller departments? No need to remind me how young you are, but is this ‘gangster’ attitude new in your experiences with LEOs?? I’d love to hear more of your take on this particular LEO and if you read the excerpted deposition testimonies?

edit on 18-8-2018 by BeefNoMeat because: ETA

edit on 18-8-2018 by BeefNoMeat because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 12:44 PM
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a reply to: BeefNoMeat

It depends... I don't see a lot of linearity between department size and population. It seems to be more prevalent in areas which are small but growing in population. Call it a culture war.

The larger cities have always had somewhat arrogant police, at least in my experience (and I appreciate the compliment, but I'm far from 'young'). I suppose that comes from the more prevalent crime that cities always seem to harbor. The small town police used to have an attitude of superiority tempered somewhat with a respect for those around them; that respect is what seems to be missing now.

Believe it or not, there has always been a power play between citizens and law enforcement here. We tend to submit easily to reasonable law enforcement, but we also tend to resist excessive force with a certain zeal. Add in the fact that most people are armed, and you have a balance of power. That worked well in the past; criminals tend to react badly to simple requests from law enforcement, and that triggers officers to use a little more aggression. Law-abiding citizens will usually respond well, if not perfectly, to reasonable requests and that should tell the officer they are not inherently dangerous... unless abused.

Of course, there are exceptions, but that is what has always worked.

In this case, it appears to me the cop showed zero respect for the man, and was actually the antagonist. The man was standing by his car, listening to what he obviously believed were lies about the situation from the lady cop. His attempts to correct the record were immediately seen as a refusal to obey orders, and he was attacked. When he tried to defuse the situation, it only made the officer more aggressive.

I try to imagine what that situation would be like between me and the local police chief around here. He is somewhat of a bully as well. One time, he stopped my son driving home with me in the truck. As I always do, as I was taught in my younger days, once we stopped, I slowly opened the door and stepped out, keeping my hands in full sight. He immediately jumped out of the car and ordered me back in the truck. I shrugged and got back in, leaving the door open.

He then proceeded to tell my son he had a brake light out, but that he was going to give him a warning this time. I pointed out that in Alabama, only one operating brake light is required. He tried to argue, but I know the law from my old hot-rodding days. In the end, there was no warning other than verbal... and I believe that is because I was there. He saw a kid driving a truck and decided it was a slow day so he would see what kind of tickets he could issue... most kids don't know the law. He did admonish me for stepping out, saying "I didn't know if I was going to have to fight you or not."

My response was that it would be pretty hard for me to cover the area between us at the time, with both vehicles as obstacles, before he could respond... and that he was being pretty silly even thinking that. He didn't like the silly part, but he did acknowledge it.

I still cannot see him actually shooting or even tasering someone in that situation, unless someone decided to attack him. He was simply trying to get his quota. The change is that the officer in the video apparently held zero respect for the victim, and overstepped his bounds because of that. That is indicative of a rapidly growing area transforming from rural to semi-urban.

I believe I heard the officers mention Geneva... Geneva is the county seat of Geneva County in extreme southeast Alabama, right on the Florida line. It is also a rural setting, but nearby Dothan is growing. I would think that close growth of Dothan would spill over into Geneva County and cause it to experience those same growing pains.

TheRedneck



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 01:27 PM
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a reply to: Bloodworth

No the thug deserved it for resisting and fighting the police, these thugs need to learn



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 01:28 PM
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edit on 18-8-2018 by XAnarchistX because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 01:32 PM
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This is truly terrible. I wonder what came out of it.

I am in no position to look up cop names and what happened after this, but this incident happened almost 4 years ago in Alabama. Did the cops go on trial?



posted on Aug, 18 2018 @ 01:35 PM
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a reply to: TheRedneck

Thanks. I appreciate the reply

I’m just now putting together “Dothan”...they held an early UFC event in Dothan because the original venue was axed because of ‘human cock-fighting’ statutes...at any rate, thanks again with the reply.




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