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Fat police lock up Chris

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posted on Feb, 22 2005 @ 03:04 PM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid
No I want Gov out of the insurance biz, including regulation. Health insurance is a choice, but, how many insurance requirements are not, ie, auto, etc......


I cant argue with you on that.

I remember when Auto Insurance wasnt manditory. The insurance companies pushed for it to be manditory so they could offer it at a cheaper price.

Within a year my rates had TRIPPLED.

So much for cheaper rates




posted on Feb, 22 2005 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by Amuk

Originally posted by DrHoracid
No I want Gov out of the insurance biz, including regulation. Health insurance is a choice, but, how many insurance requirements are not, ie, auto, etc......


I cant argue with you on that.

I remember when Auto Insurance wasnt manditory. The insurance companies pushed for it to be manditory so they could offer it at a cheaper price.

Within a year my rates had TRIPPLED.

So much for cheaper rates


Good now that you are completely "acidized" what about Chris. Should he be locked up by "do-gooders" and where do you draw the line.



posted on Feb, 22 2005 @ 03:24 PM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid
Good now that you are completely "acidized" what about Chris. Should he be locked up by "do-gooders" and where do you draw the line.


If he has a mental illness then yes. Otherwise let him eat himself to death. I think the families wishes would be an inducation that they at least didnt think he was. I am not a doctor myself so I cant really judge.

Mentally ill people are locked up all the time to keep them from harming themselves.

But there is no law against being a pig



posted on Feb, 22 2005 @ 03:26 PM
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Well, he did have a MI. So he should be locked up. How is it the liberals again DR? This isn;t even AMERICA! So that rught there kinda kills your arguement.



posted on Feb, 22 2005 @ 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by James the Lesser
Well, he did have a MI. So he should be locked up. How is it the liberals again DR? This isn;t even AMERICA! So that rught there kinda kills your arguement.


OK, then bunnies with pancake hats are also MI. Should they be locked up?

The american definition of Liberal is big gov taking care of the sheep from craddle to grave, because "they" know what is best for you.



posted on Feb, 23 2005 @ 06:25 AM
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HE HAS A GENETIC DEFECT!

and although a tendency to obsessive/compulsive behavior is one of the symtoms, along with developmental delays, there is much more to it.

I'm not sure if I would classify it as just a mental illness.....

Basic Facts About PWS:

www.pwsausa.org...

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It they are just throwing him into a mental institution to treat him for "mental illness", and not treating the actual illness, they are DEAD WRONG!!
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"Compounding the pressure of excessive appetite is a decreased calorie utilization in those with PWS (typically 1,000-1,200 kcal per day for adults), due to low muscle mass and inactivity. A balanced, low-calorie diet with vitamin and calcium supplementation is recommended. Regular weigh-ins and periodic diet review are needed. The best meal and snack plan is one the family or caregiver is able to apply routinely and consistently. Weight control depends on external food restriction and may require locking the kitchen and food storage areas. Daily exercise (at least 30 minutes) also is essential for weight control and health.

To date, no medication or surgical intervention has been found that would eliminate the need for strict dieting and supervision around food. GH treatment, because it increases muscle mass and function, may allow a higher daily calorie level.

Behavior Issues

Infants and young children with PWS are typically happy and loving, and exhibit few behavior problems. Most older children and adults with PWS, however, do have difficulties with behavior regulation, manifested as difficulties with transitions and unanticipated changes. Onset of behavioral symptoms usually coincides with onset of hyperphagia (although not all problem behaviors are food-related), and difficulties peak in adolescence or early adulthood. Daily routines and structure, firm rules and limits, "time out," and positive rewards work best for behavior management. Psychotropic medications—particularly serotonin reuptake inhibitors, such as fluoxetine and sertroline—are beneficial in treating obsessive-compulsive (OCD) symptoms, perseveration, and mood swings. Depression in adults is not uncommon. Psychotic episodes occur rarely.



Developmental Concerns

Motor Skills

Motor milestones are typically delayed one to two years; although hypotonia improves, deficits in strength, coordination, balance, and motor planning may continue. Physical and occupational therapies help promote skill development and proper function. Foot orthoses may be needed. Growth hormone treatment, by increasing muscle mass, may improve motor skills. Exercise and sports activities should be encouraged and adaptations made, as needed. Proficiency with jigsaw puzzles is frequently reported, reflecting strong visual-perceptual skills.

Oral Motor and Speech

Hypotonia may create feeding problems, poor oral-motor skills, and delayed speech. The need for speech therapy should be assessed in infancy. Sign language and picture communication boards can be used to reduce frustration and aid communication. Products to increase saliva may help articulation problems. Social skills training can improve pragmatic language use. Even with delays, verbal ability often becomes an area of strength for children with PWS. In rare cases, speech is severely affected.

Cognition

IQs range from 40 to 105, with an average of 70. Those with normal IQs typically have learning disabilities. Problem areas may include attention, short-term auditory memory, and abstract thinking. Common strengths include long-term memory, reading ability, and receptive language. Early infant stimulation should be encouraged and the need for special education services and supports assessed in preschool and beyond.

Growth

Failure to thrive in infancy may necessitate tube feeding. Infants should be closely monitored for adequate calorie intake and appropriate weight gain. Growth hormone is typically deficient, causing short stature, lack of pubertal growth spurt, and a high body fat ratio, even in those with normal weight. The need for GH therapy should be assessed in both children and adults.

Sexual Development

Sex hormone levels (testosterone and estrogen) are typically low. Cryptorchidism in male infants may require surgery. Both sexes have good response to treatment for hormone deficiencies, although side effects have been reported. Early pubic hair is common, but puberty is usually late in onset and incomplete.

Although it is often assumed that individuals with PWS are infertile, several pregnancies have been confirmed. Sexually active individuals should be counseled regarding risk of pregnancy and of genetic error in offspring (50%, except for those with PWS due to UPD). Basic sex education is important in all cases to promote good health and protect against abuse

www.pwsausa.org...
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"Most older children and adults with PWS, however, do have difficulties with behavior regulation, manifested as difficulties with transitions and unanticipated changes. "
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I think they were dead wrong!!



posted on Feb, 23 2005 @ 06:34 AM
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Thanks there dawn............

Few seem to undertand how "nazi" this is, but the genetic issue may wake some here up.



posted on Feb, 23 2005 @ 06:47 AM
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I'm afraid that the only thing that will wake some people up is when they come to them demanding that they take this $100. chemical cocktail everyday because that gene over there indicates that have an increased risk of dying from whatever disease that want to claim. Then, when they refuse because they think the drug is killing them, hey, they'll be locked up in a mental institution and have it forced on them.......then they will wake up!!!

I was listening to a news story awhile back, some bar or resturant has made it a policy to weigh every employee, and well, if they gain more than something like 8 lbs, they are fired.....
umm....I can see a definate problem with this....since I am underweight and well, 10-20 lbs would probably be healthy for me....but, they say we are all too fat, so how can that be....if I was working for this company I'd be visiting a lawyer, here I am trying to gain weigh since the last time I was at a doctor's office, he yelled at me about it.....and they are threatening to fire me??
THe whole thing is insane!!!



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 04:01 AM
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While you've all been enjoying ragging on each other you obviously missed yesterdays story about Chris being released. Not surprising since most of you obviously don't even come from the UK but there you go. I'm also not surprised that no one from the UK has posted here whinging about Chris's problem being a burden on us all, as we all pay to look after each other over here. An unforunate, horrible incident, but the fact that we've all got a say made sure that our voices we're heard and now, hopefully, he'll receive the care he needs.



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 04:39 AM
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I'm no fan of the nanny state over here in the UK.
But in this case, the authorities are in a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation.
Although this guy's symptoms might be physical, there is no denying whatsoever that he is also not 100% mentally fit. He is eating himself to death.
You can absolutely guarantee that when he dies (which probably won't be long), his family will be the first people to blame the government for not doing enough to help him.

So take him to hospital - family and conservatives whine.
Leave him at home - family and liberals whine.

My personal belief is that this guy should have given it a go. He got to hospital so he should have tried to work it out and got well. He didn't. Instead he returned home with the story that he's going to try to work things out for himself - something that he and his family have failed to do for the past few decades. He's back at square one.

When he dies in a couple of months time, the newspapers on the right will print how his and his family's life was made hell by the authorities. They will gloss over the fact that they tried to save his life.
The newspapers on the left will print how the government failed to act strongly enough to save him. They will gloss over the fact that the authorities were forced to let him die.



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 06:28 AM
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Originally posted by ridcully
While you've all been enjoying ragging on each other you obviously missed yesterdays story about Chris being released.


I am glade they let the kid out. Now I think they should lock up anyone seen eating salt. It causes high bloodpressure and costs you social "med" folks money. The ban all products with sugar.

Ok, where do you draw the line?



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 07:48 AM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid

I am glade they let the kid out. Now I think they should lock up anyone seen eating salt. It causes high bloodpressure and costs you social "med" folks money. The ban all products with sugar.

Ok, where do you draw the line?


Or for that matter, people hooked on nicotine. We have the same issue here in the US with smokers running up health insurance cost. Most of us understand why firemen wear mask in burning buildings but the same tax money that rightfully pays for those mask also has to pay for those who willfully inhale smoke on a daily basis..with just as many deadly toxins.

I've always been for individual rights in both these cases so long as the consequences is also made the sole responsibility of the individual. With individual rights also come individual responsibilities.

I think both parties in this share the condemnation. The authorities for dragging this guy out when he had committed no crime and the family for refusing the offered help.

In an ideal situation, the govt would have made help available, the family and Chris would have accepted it. Because they refused does not give the govt. the right to drag anyone out of their home but it does give them the right to limit or terminate any other govt funding.

Life is full of choices. No one can have their cake and eat it too. In my opinion, both parties made the wrong choice.



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 07:51 AM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid

Originally posted by goose
I agree totally but why do you assume its the liberals wanting this done. The liberals would be more in agrrement that it is no ones business but his own.


No its the liberals that want to control everything through twisted, arrogant PCness. PCness says this guy can't take care of himself so "we" must do it for him. Conservatives would say he has the freedom to do what he wants.................


then i vote conservative on that one, i find myself agreeing with you.



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 07:55 AM
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Originally posted by astrocreep
Life is full of choices. No one can have their cake and eat it too. In my opinion, both parties made the wrong choice.


How about "personal" responsibility? Everyone is so busy taking care of the "other" guys problem because "they" think individuals can't.



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 07:55 AM
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The american definition of Liberal is big gov taking care of the sheep from craddle to grave, because "they" know what is best for you.


Wow, mine eyes hath opened. now I understand your rants about the "liberal mentality" Until now i couldnt quite understand your meaning of the term. thanks.



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 07:57 AM
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Originally posted by goose
I agree totally but why do you assume its the liberals wanting this done. The liberals would be more in agrrement that it is no ones business but his own.


Whats the point of this thread?



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 07:58 AM
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Although this guy's symptoms might be physical, there is no denying whatsoever that he is also not 100% mentally fit. He is eating himself to death


People make bad health choices everyday, drugs alcohol, crappy food, not to mention so many other stupid things folk do, not wearing seatbelts, speeding etc etc etc. Are these people all not 100% mentally fit? Wheres the line drawn?

[edit on 072828p://59027 by instar]



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 08:02 AM
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Whats the point of this thread?



point is it could well be your butt thats dragged off to the nut house next for whatever reason, you smoke, you must be suicidal, off we go.
folk dont like there freedom eroded by gov policy. thats the point.



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 08:02 AM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid


How about "personal" responsibility? Everyone is so busy taking care of the "other" guys problem because "they" think individuals can't.


True, many people want the right to do this or the right to do that but when it comes to taking responsibility for the consequences, its always someone elses place. I appreciate that I have the right...or more correct..the liberty to decide what I do everyday..but I also know if I want to eat, stay warm and dry, I have to voluntarily spend a portion of that day earning the money to pay for it.

I'm all for helping those les fortunate so long as they understand and try to help themselves. I have no problem with the govt. making help available for people like Chris but if he refuses it, then I don't think he can hold the govt. responsible for the outcome. There has to be a point and time where we all say, "look, I made the choice that led me here. I got no one else to blame but me."



posted on Feb, 24 2005 @ 08:03 AM
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Originally posted by instar

The american definition of Liberal is big gov taking care of the sheep from craddle to grave, because "they" know what is best for you.


Wow, mine eyes hath opened. now I understand your rants about the "liberal mentality" Until now i couldnt quite understand your meaning of the term. thanks.


Unfortunately the term "liberal" has be corrupted here in the states. Once it meant 'anti-gov" anti establishment. Now it means "I'm smarter than you so shut up and do as I say". Hence, the Chris thing.



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