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Does all the crime in Trump's circle prove that capitalism doesn't work?

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posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 08:48 AM
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a reply to: introvert

Your comprehension is absolutely silly. It grants the people the right to partake in free commerce and entrepreneurship. Wtf does it have to do with your free speech.




posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 08:48 AM
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originally posted by: CB328
So you are saying that capitalism is no better than any other system? Thank you for finally being honest.


No, that isn't really what he said, but we all know your reading comprehension is fairly low.

What he said or implied was that no matter the system, humans are not infallible. There will always be people who are self-serving and corrupt. So whether it is socialism, capitalism, or any other ism, there are always going to be people who can and use the system for their own personal gain.

However, some systems are better than others at reducing the power and influence of the corrupt. Capitalism tends to work best because the consumer and businesses are more in control, not bureaucrats. This allows for greater social mobility. On the other hand, socialism tends to trap people at whatever station their are in life. It removes the incentives and ability to better one's lot in life. Socialism also tends to have an elite class of "administrators" who gain their wealth from corruption and favoritism. All one has to do is look at countries like China, Africa, Mexico, South America and others with their kept classes of elites while the masses are starving.



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 08:54 AM
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originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: introvert

Your comprehension is absolutely silly. It grants the people the right to partake in free commerce and entrepreneurship. Wtf does it have to do with your free speech.


Are you not paying attention to the conversation?

Go back and read what was posted.

www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 08:56 AM
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Is the misery in Venezuela proof that socialism doesn't work?



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 09:06 AM
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originally posted by: theatreboy
OP, did you type that with a straight face?

Be real, no matter what goverment, it is corrupt. At least here with capitalism, i have a chance to get ahead.


Or at least die of natural causes...



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 10:14 AM
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originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: introvert

It’s a system that grants rights through commerce and entrepreneurship.


No. Rights are granted through the constitution/bill of rights.

Capitalism is not a system of governance. It's an economic system.


There are no rights "granted" through the constitution or bill of rights.

Both documents limit the government on how much they can infringe on our fundemental rights as sovereign citizens.

Just a clarification...

edit on 2-8-2018 by Lumenari because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 10:17 AM
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originally posted by: Lumenari

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: introvert

It’s a system that grants rights through commerce and entrepreneurship.


No. Rights are granted through the constitution/bill of rights.

Capitalism is not a system of governance. It's an economic system.


There are no rights "granted" through the constitution or bill of rights.

Both documents limit the government on how much they can infringe on our fundemental rights.

Just a clarification...


Of course our rights are granted by the constitution/bill of rights, and subsequently protected from infringement.

Where else are our rights granted to us as citizens of the US?



Both documents limit the government on how much they can infringe on our fundemental rights as sovereign citizens


We are not sovereign citizens in the US.


edit on 2-8-2018 by introvert because: (no reason given)

edit on 2-8-2018 by introvert because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 10:33 AM
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When did ATSNN become a 'bitching blog'? Seriously. There is no content to the OP. It is nothing but opinion. No facts. No links. Nothing but the same BS to discuss and a few pages in it is Trump sucks, blah, blah, blah.






posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 10:44 AM
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originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: Lumenari

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: introvert

It’s a system that grants rights through commerce and entrepreneurship.


No. Rights are granted through the constitution/bill of rights.

Capitalism is not a system of governance. It's an economic system.


There are no rights "granted" through the constitution or bill of rights.

Both documents limit the government on how much they can infringe on our fundemental rights.

Just a clarification...


Of course our rights are granted by the constitution/bill of rights, and subsequently protected from infringement.

Where else are our rights granted to us as citizens of the US?



Both documents limit the government on how much they can infringe on our fundemental rights as sovereign citizens


We are not sovereign citizens in the US.



You are, of course, quite wrong.

I refer you to the Declaration of independence...


We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

Thomas Jefferson



edit on 2-8-2018 by Lumenari because: (no reason given)

edit on 2-8-2018 by Lumenari because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 10:56 AM
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originally posted by: ManFromEurope

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: CB328

Capitalism is the greatest system ever devised. The people have the power instead of the state unlike socialism, communism, fascism...etc


What power exactly?

What if you try to encounter the government, like with taxes, tickets, unruly behaviour - you know, all those things the government/state will counter your moves strictly and without remorse?

So, what power do "the people" really have?


we the people in the US have always had the power, we still have the power the problem is in the past when things were great people stopped paying attention and the politicians stole some power, and with their flunkies in the press they keep the people paying attention divided allowing them to continue to leach the wealth off the country.

But since they could not remove the safeguards in place without alerting the sleeping people to what they are doing the ability to take back the country is still there but we have the problem of the propaganda pushing the division in a major way.

If people would turn off the boob tube, set down their phones and go talk with their neighbors we absolutly could still take the country back.

To the OP no Capatilisim is fine as long as the people stay aware and keep on the people that are elected.



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 11:22 AM
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originally posted by: Lumenari

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: Lumenari

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: introvert

It’s a system that grants rights through commerce and entrepreneurship.


No. Rights are granted through the constitution/bill of rights.

Capitalism is not a system of governance. It's an economic system.


There are no rights "granted" through the constitution or bill of rights.

Both documents limit the government on how much they can infringe on our fundemental rights.

Just a clarification...


Of course our rights are granted by the constitution/bill of rights, and subsequently protected from infringement.

Where else are our rights granted to us as citizens of the US?



Both documents limit the government on how much they can infringe on our fundemental rights as sovereign citizens


We are not sovereign citizens in the US.



You are, of course, quite wrong.

I refer you to the Declaration of independence...


We hold these truths to be self-evident: that all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

Thomas Jefferson




How am I wrong? Jefferson believed we are born with rights granted by our creator and that is quite a subjective statement, but those rights are not recognized or granted to individuals unless they live within a system that recognizes those rights. Correct?

The apparent inspiration Jefferson had while drafting the DOI was that of John Locke and his writings that claimed the government existed to protect the rights and property of the individual.

Without society/government, there is no recognition of the rights of individuals and no mechanism for protection of those rights.

"God" can give you all the rights you want, but without a society that recognizes and grants those rights...it means little to nothing.



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 11:34 AM
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a reply to: CB328

If one does the research with non-partisan glasses, we can find examples of corruption and ethical issues in every example of government and civil organization.

I like to think capitalism offers an opportunity for more to participate than some other types of examples.

How individuals participate is up to each individual, either using illegal or unethical short cuts or straight attempts at success following rules and laws.

The volume of perhaps illegal activity which has yet to be proven in the current administration and unethical choices is no more prevalent than past administrations.

Not defending anyone admin, not any political affiliation. It stands to reason, that when humans are involved that there are those capable of what we from the outside consider egregious ethical decisions, and then the outright illegal activities.

Whether it is capitalism, socialism or any of the various forms our governments take, humans involvement by just the numbers prove that activities we deem illegal and unethical take place, sometimes they are caught and some get away Scott free.

And the questionable actions are not limited to the elite nor to any socio-economic position. Perhaps the elite are capable of larger egregious acts but those with far less are equally capable. Tax cheats cover both elitist, the middle and even the bottom.



edit on 8/2/2018 by DJMSN because: Addition



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 12:49 PM
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Yeah.



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 06:47 PM
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I call BS. I don't know any non-wealthy people who are unregistered foreign agents, friends with communist leaders, have "fixers" to threaten and pay off people, embezzelling or defrauding huge sums of money, lying to the FBI, enriching themselves from bankrupting businesses and from being in the government, let alone being friends with and abetting evil dictators like the Saudis.

Normal people don't do any of those things, but capitalists seem to constantly be involved in immoral and illegal activities.



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 07:24 PM
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a reply to: CB328

Psst! Hey! I have a secret... Capitalists are normal people. If you've ever tried to make a profit off of selling your time in exchange for money, sold a handcraft, invested in a stock, bought something with the speculation it's value would go up, searched for a killer sale on an item you wanted, used coupons, comparison shopped, enjoyed the benefit of choice, experienced a buyer's market as a buyer or a seller's market as a seller, purchased something at a flea market, had a yard sale, or chosen one internet provider over another based on service and the cost of said service, then you're a capitalist. Find a mirror, rail at yourself for not being what you consider "normal."



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 08:09 PM
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originally posted by: caterpillage
Is the misery in Venezuela proof that socialism doesn't work?


Hmm. Yes I think that may be true.



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 08:23 PM
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Capitalism works for the I percent and their flunkies in the 9 percent. All it does for the rest is enslave us.



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 08:27 PM
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a reply to: introvert




I agree. No matter what sort of economic system a nation decides to implement, whether it be capitalism or communism, there is always a threat to the integrity of that system from the natural tendencies of the human being. The systems themselves are not necessarily the problem. It's the people within the system that are the problem.


I don't often agree with you but I do on this.



That is why Democrats and Republicans need to stop the insanity and work together to minimize the amount of conflict of interest in DC.

We need to stop the infinite back and forth blame game between the two party and temporarily put our political differences aside and concentrate on

1. Congregational term limits

2. campaign financing reform.

3. Lobbying reform

4. doing away with super-pacs

5. Revolving door between gov't and private sector

6. Real Transparency

Nobody but the lobbyist are winning but the lobbyist with how things are.
edit on 33831America/ChicagoThu, 02 Aug 2018 20:33:23 -0500000000p3142 by interupt42 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 08:52 PM
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originally posted by: Willtell
Capitalism works for the I percent and their flunkies in the 9 percent. All it does for the rest is enslave us.


Socialism works for the governing percent. And enslaves everyone else.
Not sure what percentages that works out too honestly.
But I'm guessing it's way worse in our favor than your guess



posted on Aug, 2 2018 @ 08:57 PM
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a reply to: interupt42

Both sides agree, party wise, that all the things you list are things they don't wish to address.



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