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With Manafort's trial beginning....

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posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 11:05 AM
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When there is nothing to flip on, it makes it hard to flip. Especially when they don't follow the script.




posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 11:08 AM
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Manifort worked on Trumps campaign and spilled his guts about the money paid for information to Russians.

The WH is in melt down according to my unnamed sources.


www.vox.com...



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 11:16 AM
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originally posted by: loam
a reply to: intrepid



Incidentally, my view is that Manafort isn't flipping because he had nothing to flip with and all of his 'crimes' are unrelated to Trump and his campaign.


That's probably it. He tried to hide the money he was making back in Pre Trump Days. He worked for the pro Russian Yanukovych and his political party in elections prior to the West helping to install a more pro Western Govt there.

If Manafort had disclosed the Money and paid taxes on it, I doubt he would even be in a trial.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 11:18 AM
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originally posted by: olaru12


......The WH is in melt down according to my unnamed sources......


www.vox.com...


Yeah. That's why they put him in jail.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 11:45 AM
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originally posted by: olaru12
Manifort worked on Trumps campaign and spilled his guts about the money paid for information to Russians.

The WH is in melt down according to my unnamed sources.


www.vox.com...
Once again you push opinion piece links on topics you clearly have no knowledge.

So glad to see you've been wrong on all issues pertaining to POTUS.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 11:45 AM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Xtrozero

And here comes the "what about Obama?" deflection... Right on cue since I said something negative about Trump. It's not like pointing out the ONE lie that everyone calls Obama out on somehow is comparable to the daily lies that Trump says or anything, but you made it anyways just because a negative comment about Trump CANNOT stand without you guys making sure we also know that Obama wasn't a perfect human being too.

Also, I only brought up the Lincoln lie because it was the most recent one I read. None of what you said really has any baring on any point I made or was discussing though. Obama lying or not lying has nothing to do with anything involving Paul Manafort flipping and none of it has to do with calling an ATS poster a liar for getting a prediction wrong.


I said 200 years... My point is once again who cares that Trump bloviates, there is no impact and nothing on the scale of other Presidents who have lied with serious repercussions.

What I would like to know is why is this all so important today that wasn't even an issue since Clinton's "I did not have sex with that woman" days?

It's like comparing a person saying their 300 pound wife looks skinny in "that dress" to a person on the scale of Madoff and say they both lied so are the same, or in Trump's case put more emphases on the dress lie and not even touch a lie on the scale of Madoff or worst...

Just trying to understand yours and others motivation in all this...



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 12:01 PM
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a reply to: Xtrozero
If you want to believe there isn't any significant impact to Trump's lies that is your reality to convince yourself of, but in the real world constant lies of even the most inconsequential slowly erode trust. It blunts the edges of his threats and makes people deaf to the cries of his bogeymen.

I really don't understand why you'd think that people shouldn't make a big deal about calling out a pathological liar who is in charge of 300,000,000 people's lives pathologically lying. This isn't the case of some random mentally ill person on a street corner telling me who 50 years worth of stories but he's only 40; it's the President of the US and his words, even the most benign, have weighted importance because of that.

Furthermore, trying to make it seem like just because Trump tells a lie that he is like all other politicians who have got caught in lies is VERY dishonest. Most lies that Presidents or politicians get caught in are one or two major lies that stick with them. "I didn't have sex with that woman". "If you like your plan you can keep your plan". "There are WMDs in Iraq". Etc. Trump is a liar on a MUCH greater scale than that and oh so much worse because of it. Trump will straight faced say the above lies while also telling you the sky is green and purple. Then argue with you and insult you and try to make you sound like the bad guy for calling him on the lie if you tell him he is wrong.

It's like comparing a minor scrape to a massive laceration. Sure there is blood present in both and both are wounds that can lead to infection, but with the minor scrape it's just a matter of cleaning it and letting time heal it. Probably won't even scar. A massive laceration will require stitches and other life saving treatments to tend to. It will leave a scar. You are trying to make it sound like a minor scrape is on the same scale as a massive laceration.
edit on 31-7-2018 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 12:57 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
If you want to believe there isn't any significant impact to Trump's lies that is your reality to convince yourself of, but in the real world constant lies of even the most inconsequential slowly erode trust. It blunts the edges of his threats and makes people deaf to the cries of his bogeymen.



But why wasn't it Obama, Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan and so on lies too...How far does a trillion dollar lie go to erode trust?




I really don't understand why you'd think that people shouldn't make a big deal about calling out a pathological liar who is in charge of 300,000,000 people's lives pathologically lying. This isn't the case of some random mentally ill person on a street corner telling me who 50 years worth of stories but he's only 40; it's the President of the US and his words, even the most benign, have weighted importance because of that.


My point it seems it wasn't important in the past, even with huge country level impacting lies, but today it is the meme. I really don't care outside I think it is all just a piece of the "I hate Trump" pie, no matter how good he might end up to be.


What is more important to you...the size of a crowd, or 5000 lives? Trump bloviates like crazy, he is big everything all the time, he is "I come off the top rope with outrageous demands then I'm ready to make a deal...Trump is all this and more...

The funny part is it is working where Presidents in the last 70 years have failed. What are you going to do when he is more successful than any president in recent history? Are you just going to talk about his outrageous tweets and crowd sizes?




edit on 31-7-2018 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 01:04 PM
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a reply to: dawnstar

www.cnn.com...



The Justice Department announced indictments against 12 Russian nationals as part of special counsel Robert Mueller's investigation of Russian interference in the 2016 election, accusing them of engaging in a "sustained effort" to hack Democrats' emails and computer networks.




Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein said the indictment does not name any American citizen, but told reporters that defendants "corresponded with several Americans during the course of the conspiracy through the internet." "There is no allegation in this indictment that any American citizen committed a crime," Rosenstein said at a news conference. "There is no allegation that the conspiracy altered the vote count or changed any election result."

so how will it "come close to treason" when the LEO in charge of the investigation says there are no allegations that ANY american citizens committed a crime?
Or does Rosenstein not qualify as a reliable source for you?



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 01:05 PM
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originally posted by: Xtrozero
But why wasn't it Obama, Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan and so on lies too...How far does a trillion dollar lie go to erode trust?

NONE of those people are currently the President. So it really doesn't matter. Trump IS the President and he lies worse than any predecessor.


My point it seems it wasn't important in the past, even with huge country level impacting lies, but today it is the meme. I really don't care outside I think it is all just a piece of the "I hate Trump" pie, no matter how good it might be.

Who says it wasn't important in the past? You pretend like no one called the previous Presidents out for their lies or anything. We did. Hell, since you have to whatabout deflect to talk about them we are calling them out right now for them.


What is more important to you...the size of a crowd, or 5000 lives? Trump bloviates like crazy, he is big everything all the time, he is "I come off the top rope with outrageous demands then I'm ready to make a deal...Trump is all this and more...

There is an Aesop's Fable you should read. It's called "The Boy Who Cried Wolf".


The funny part it is working where Presidents in the last 70 years have failed. What are you going to do when he is more successful than any president in recent history? Are you just going to talk about his outrageous tweets and crowd sizes?

But he isn't and isn't even on pace to do so. Most of his successes are either embellished, taking credit for Obama's success, declarations that are too early, or (and these are my favorites) failures that he is trying to spin into successes.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 01:41 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t

But he isn't and isn't even on pace to do so. Most of his successes are either embellished, taking credit for Obama's success, declarations that are too early, or (and these are my favorites) failures that he is trying to spin into successes.


So can we call Obama's successes (I really can't think of any) as really Bush's? Since we can play that game...



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 01:47 PM
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a reply to: shooterbrody




"There is no allegation in this indictment that any American citizen committed a crime," Rosenstein said at a news conference. "There is no allegation that the conspiracy altered the vote count or changed any election result."


kind of think the key words would be "in this indictment".
doesn't mean the next one that comes out won't be centered on the american side of things.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 01:51 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t


Gotta say though, I really don't care if he flipped or not. Not flipping means we go to trial and put everything involving him on the table. Flipping means someone else goes down. Either way I'm satisfied. Your thread is setting a rather low benchmark for success, imo.


To get back on track... To assume flipping one is suggesting there was wrong in the first place. To say he is going to flip, or he chooses to not flip is a sneaky way of suggesting the President is guilty.

In the end there really isn't anything to flip or not flip over...all these cases have long ago drifted off the original path and are down totally different directions.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 02:06 PM
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a reply to: Xtrozero

I don't recall anyone in this thread declaring the President guilty of anything.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 02:58 PM
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After a rough week last week for the anti-Trump brigade, this one isn't off to a good start. The Manafort trial commencing tells anyone with a brain he obviously doesn't have anything good on Trump. He was their best hope.

Bye bye what was left of your childish impeachment hopes. All that's left is the "obstruction" angle, which is a non-starter.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 03:03 PM
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originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: shooterbrody




"There is no allegation in this indictment that any American citizen committed a crime," Rosenstein said at a news conference. "There is no allegation that the conspiracy altered the vote count or changed any election result."


kind of think the key words would be "in this indictment".
doesn't mean the next one that comes out won't be centered on the american side of things.




So no americans colluded with "these" russians to affect the election?
Thats what you submit?

or did they just collude with themselves?



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 03:16 PM
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a reply to: JBurns

I've always been of the belief that Manafort should flip. I said if he was smart he would. But I never try to second guess what a person will or won't do. The longer he held out the less likely that seemed. I thought he may be holding out for a pardon and he wants to be worthy. I would. I hope his suffering doesn't go unnoticed. But I think he's a sacrificial lamb and his fate is sealed.
If trump pardons him it may not sit well. I don't think he should go to jail for life for what he's being charged with. I hope the jury is lenient and just gives him time served.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 03:22 PM
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originally posted by: intrepid

originally posted by: JBurns
I'll give those individuals a chance to come clean, however I've bookmarked a good number of posts for the expressed purpose of coming back and discrediting the individuals who were pushing lies (in their usual matter-of-fact foregone conclusion way - absolutely intolerable/insufferable people)


You must have a vested interest in this to go to such lengths. I hope the time and energy pays off for you.

What could the pay off be?



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 03:26 PM
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a reply to: loam

If we're guessing on the outcome of the trial I believe he will be found guilty of all financial crimes.



posted on Jul, 31 2018 @ 03:31 PM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: JBurns

I've always been of the belief that Manafort should flip. I said if he was smart he would. But I never try to second guess what a person will or won't do. The longer he held out the less likely that seemed. I thought he may be holding out for a pardon and he wants to be worthy. I would. I hope his suffering doesn't go unnoticed. But I think he's a sacrificial lamb and his fate is sealed.
If trump pardons him it may not sit well. I don't think he should go to jail for life for what he's being charged with. I hope the jury is lenient and just gives him time served.


You were hopeful he had something to flip with. You need Trump to go down so hard you can taste it. I hope you're finding something else to obsess over. Mueller is just waiting for the midterms to be over because if he makes the announcement right now it'll hurt Dems chances.







 
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