What is the Mystery of the Trinity…?

237 The Trinity is a mystery of faith in the strict sense, one of the "mysteries that are hidden in God, which can never be known unless they are revealed by God". To be sure, God has left traces of his Trinitarian being in his work of creation and in his Revelation throughout the Old Testament. But his inmost Being as Holy Trinity is a mystery that is inaccessible to reason alone or even to Israel's faith before the Incarnation of God's Son and the sending of the Holy Spirit.

The quote above is from the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

Number 237 states that the mystery is hidden and can never be known, unless God reveals it.

251 In order to articulate the dogma of the Trinity, the Church had to develop her own terminology with the help of certain notions of philosophical origin: "substance", "person" or "hypostasis", "relation" and so on. In doing this, she did not submit the faith to human wisdom, but gave a new and unprecedented meaning to these terms, which from then on would be used to signify an ineffable mystery, "infinitely beyond all that we can humanly understand".

Number 251 goes on to state how the mystery is beyond human understanding; Even though terms like "substance", "person" or "hypostasis" are used to try and articulate it.

Whatever the mystery of the Trinity is, it is clearly something that is not currently known or is at least not wide spread knowledge.

So it’s not as simple as Stating, for example that, “The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are one etc”…That is not the mystery, because this aspect of the “Trinity” is well known to anyone who's ever read scripture.

So my question to Christians is this…

What is the Mystery of the Trinity…?

And if you don't know what the mystery is…i.e. God hasn’t revealed it to you yet…

Then why do you believe/accept it, when you don’t know the mystery behind it…?


I look forward to hearing people’s responses…

a reply to: Joecroft
The mystery is the fact that it's not easy to understand, and indeed not fully within human comprehension.

In a nutshell;
It is not true to say that Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are three distinct individuals. (That would be Tritheism)
It is not true to say that Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are one individual playing three different roles. (That would be Sabellianism).
The truth is somewhere halfway between those easily visualised possibilities.
How that works is a mystery.

P.S. I'm not going to be drawn by anyone into arguing to justify the doctrine. In the arguments of the early church, it follows on from the doctrine of the Incarnation, and that doctrine has to be accepted before there is any point in trying to talk about the Trinity.

"disolve et coagula"

Mercury, sulpher, salt

Gotta practice, break nature down, refine it, put it back together using only its purified triune constituents.

But I should know better

When I was a young Baptist, to us it was the Son, the Father and the Holy Ghost. Not Holy Spirit.

The Holy Ghost always put the fear of God in me....

a reply to: DISRAELI

You didn’t answer the second question…

If it’s a mystery and not easy to understand as you say, then why do you accept a Trinitarian belief…?

I mean picture this…

Imagine there is this really complex riddle, and it is very unclear as to what it truly means…i.e. it’s a mystery…

And I tell you to accept belief X, in regards to the riddle….would you accept it…?

You would be sceptical of my claim right…?…unless I could explain the mystery…

- JC

a reply to: Joecroft




How is one able to have faith if they do not completely comprehend, you ask?

It is not the knowledge that gives one faith, it is the certainty of the provider of that knowledge.

A single experience with god is all one needs to have the faith necessary to follow the word, regardless of how incremental it is dished out.

a reply to: Joecroft

He said not easy to understand which isn't the same as impossible to understand.

The part not fully within human comprehension is the part of deity in the first place. Every faith out there has that problem which is, of course, why we call it faith. You have to have faith in something that lies outside the realm we can fully prove and explain in tangible human terms.

originally posted by: BlueJacket
"disolve et coagula"

Mercury, sulpher, salt

Gotta practice, break nature down, refine it, put it back together using only its purified triune constituents.

But I should know better

Would you care to expand further...

This sounds intriguing


- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

For what it's worth...

originally posted by: olaru12
When I was a young Baptist, to us it was the Son, the Father and the Holy Ghost. Not Holy Spirit.

The Holy Ghost always put the fear of God in me....

There's nothing to be afraid of IMO...

Plus the Holy Ghost is meant to reveal all truth to those who seek it out….including the mystery of the Trinity

Peace be with you…

- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

I have been wrapping my head around string theory for some time
Quantum mechanics and relativity - but they don't work together unless we have strings to make them vibrate? No? Right?
So some believe strings that can't be seen and may not exist tie everything together, we don't know why or how but
We do know that gravity operates different to our cells, why?
Throw in some extra dimensions

See, science doesn't have many answers, especialy on big issues, but we accept reality though we don't understand it, it's in our face

Why accept a trinitarianism belief, why do you accept this life when you don't understand it

a reply to: ketsuko

Originally posted by ketsuko
He said not easy to understand which isn't the same as impossible to understand.

Yes, Absolutely…I gathered that from the Catechism itself, where it stated God can reveal the mystery to others. So clearly it is possible to come to an understanding.

Originally posted by ketsuko
The part not fully within human comprehension is the part of deity in the first place. Every faith out there has that problem which is, of course, why we call it faith. You have to have faith in something that lies outside the realm we can fully prove and explain in tangible human terms.

But you could just as easily take something fairly complex and mysterious and tell people to believe in X in regards to it…Of course most people would enquire…how do you know X is true etc…

This is not a question of Whether Jesus exists or whether God or the Holy Spirit exists, it’s a question of whether they are being accurately described and defined and understood…and also faith is never completely blind.

The Catechism does state that the mystery can be revealed by God to an individual…so in setting up this thread, my thinking was that there has to be at least one Christian out there, who has had the mystery revealed to them.

I’m hoping that such a person will arrive on my thread and explain the mystery

- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

The catechism may state that it can be revealed because that's what Catholics believe, that doesn't mean that it's an accurate statement
You show a lot of faith in the Romans catechism

a reply to: Joecroft

I have had the mystery revealed to me.

The mystery is the church can't fully explain it but they invested heavily into the ideology that stands in direct contradiction to what Jesus said about himself so they call it a mystery rather than try to explain it rationally.

It's much easier to understand that Jesus is the firstborn son of God and not God. It is easier to believe that at the moment God said "Let there be Light" the Light of this world was created.

It is much easier to understand that it was through the Light, Jesus Christ everything in this creation was made by, for and through.

The real mystery. Why does anyone still believe an interpretation that came from the Church of Constantine 2700 years ago that they can't properly explain in the first place?

There is no mystery if you believe the words Jesus spoke about himself and stop taking the convoluted interpretation of men who have proven to part of a fallible chuch while claiming infallibility.

Jesus is the Christ, the Holy Spirt. God is his father. No mystery, just the plain meaning implied by the words Jesus spoke. Faith for sure, but no mystery.

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: Joecroft

The catechism may state that it can be revealed because that's what Catholics believe, that doesn't mean that it's an accurate statement
You show a lot of faith in the Romans catechism

Actually no, you’re wrong….I have faith in God.

John 16:13
But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come.

The Holy Spirit can guide anyone into any truth…

So the Catechism is actually correct on that one.

- JC

It's the divine cycle and ultimate purpose of the life of man. The Father is to lead the Son into becoming the Father. The Holy Ghost is the spirit of this eternal familial cycle.

God reveals the truth of this 'mystery' to all men who live in respect to and actualize this principle. The simple and humble peace of mind in awareness of this accomplishment in loving purpose, only a Grandfather can truly acknowledge and comprehend.

a reply to: Joecroft

The mystery is its false doctrine... and yet they still believe it

a reply to: Akragon

Originally posted by Akragon
The mystery is its false doctrine... and yet they still believe it

lol

Hey Akragon

My thinking is, why would any Christian believe in it, if it has not been revealed to the individual that it is true.

Surely at least one Christian out there has had the mystery revealed to them and can articulate the mystery to others on this thread.

- JC

a reply to: Joecroft

Brother... Theres so many explanations it will make your head spin

So much so that it shouldn't actually be a mystery... except for the fact that Jesus and his followers never heard of such a thing

a reply to: rexsblues

Greetings...

Originally posted by rexsblues
It's the divine cycle and ultimate purpose of the life of man. The Father is to lead the Son into becoming the Father.

Or to become a better Son than the son he was before…right…?

Originally posted by rexsblues
The Holy Ghost is the spirit of this eternal familial cycle.

Absolutely…Communication is the Key…

Originally posted by rexsblues
God reveals the truth of this 'mystery' to all men who live in respect to and actualize this principle. The simple and humble peace of mind in awareness of this accomplishment in loving purpose, only a Grandfather can truly acknowledge and comprehend.

Yes, most men don’t knock on the door by seeking out the right questions.


- JC