It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

South Africa - Land Expropriation.

page: 6
24
<< 3  4  5    7  8 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Aug, 20 2018 @ 07:13 AM
link   
a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Have you ever been to the UK, because I don't think you have. You appear to habitually make things up. Just because your profile Location says UK etc...

To topic. Having done a bit of research in this space I can see that the big problem is this.

1. Poor blacks are motivated to take land that they feel is theirs.
2. Land reform has been slow. Mainly because of political corruption and apathy. After Apartheid in the early 1990s the ANC promised to return 30% of land to the blacks. To date they've managed 10%. No wonder that people are frustrated.
3. There is a growing sentiment that Africa is for black people, so the loss of whites isn't taken as a problem. In fact, the more white people that leave the better. Closely followed by Asians and anyone else who ain't racially black. Sort of reverse racism / apartheid, but because it's against whites it's OK.
4. Politicians have been slow to act and / or have helped fan the flames of divisiveness.
5. South Africa is a failing state.
6. Hopefully the post-Zuma era will start to get things sorted, else there will an increase in violence, illegal land squatting (i.e. taking land illegally) and sadly for South Africa the exodus of white and Asian Africans, taking with them the hope for a bright future.
7. Noting that whites in South Africa are also poor. The vast majority don't have the means to emigrate, so will be stuck in an increasingly hostile country.
8. Good luck South Africa.
edit on 20/8/2018 by paraphi because: (no reason given)




posted on Aug, 20 2018 @ 05:38 PM
link   
a reply to: halfoldman

Give it a couple of years. Then the thieves will be bitching that they're starving.

"No rice for you!"



posted on Aug, 21 2018 @ 05:35 AM
link   

originally posted by: paraphi
a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Have you ever been to the UK, because I don't think you have. You appear to habitually make things up. Just because your profile Location says UK etc...



hahhahha lol that made me smile
Yes Paraphi certainly been to the UK
Spent many years here and my family has been pretty much in the same county Staffordshire since the sixteenth century probably thousands of years before
But maybe I am making it up lol



posted on Aug, 21 2018 @ 05:43 AM
link   

originally posted by: Freeborn
a reply to: ufoorbhunter

Wow....what a massive exaggeration.

Almost lost for words.






That would be a first


Anyway I am concerned with the state of the country and I do believe it is possible that Brexit is one step towards the total disintegration of our state into a lawless crime and coke riddled island with an economy that may nosedive off the cliff. It's just an idea, I may well be wrong and also see that there are many possibilities to avert the cliff and maybe our economy will do well long term because of our withdrawl from the EU. Who knows which way it's going, but I'm just making preparations to escape thye inferno if it does all go tits up and we see total anarchy on the streets and a breakdown in law and order. South Africa is just my chosen option if an escape from the gates of hell is needed. Who knows what is around the corner, who knows what our military may do or whatever.............. I just have a plan if the wheels come off and Cape Town / Western Cape is the answer



posted on Aug, 21 2018 @ 07:51 AM
link   
Speaking as a South African I can say that this is a very worrying issue indeed.

I always assumed silly little things like a Constitution or International laws etc etc protected minorities from being exploited and or disadvantaged(taking property with out compensation is theft in my book) to prevent things, like Apartheid, from happening again. And yes, the white population are a minority in South Africa.

The Government sits on a lot of unused land that they own and there is plenty of good land that are under Tribal control, so why not expropriate these for the people to use?
Even simpler, just freaking pay the people for their land,instead of taking it from them and leaving them with nothing. It will make things go down much smoother I'm sure.

Perhaps it starts with just a farm here or there, but then? Everyone with two cars must "donate" one? Oh, you AND your wife works? One of you have to give your job to a unemployed person?
I realize that sounds ridiculous, and perhaps just a mini rant from a frustrated local, but once Goverments start going down those paths anything can follow, and in Africa it's usually something bad.

The sad truth is that there seems to be a very global, yes global, trend of late that equates anything white with "evil" and the history of South Africa just makes it a even more obvious case of this. Every Tom, Dick and Harry are labelled racist for any small slight. Any action by a police officer against a non white makes headlines etc etc. Meanwhile non white politicians can "allegedly" fire of a live round from a AK at a political rally, they can use words and songs that incite violence against white's and call it "struggle songs" ....

Uhhm, I think I may have gone off track a tad. So let me sum up:

Land expropriation without compensation = More racial intolerance, but hey it's what the Government wanted all along.



posted on Aug, 21 2018 @ 07:57 AM
link   
a reply to: ufoorbhunter



That would be a first

Lol, indeed.



Anyway I am concerned with the state of the country....


As are the vast majority of people in the UK.



....and I do believe it is possible that Brexit is one step towards the total disintegration of our state into a lawless crime and coke riddled island


How on earth has Brexit got anything to do with people taking coc aine?
The UK has long had a coc aine 'problem', starting donkey's years before the Brexit referendum.

The 'disintegration of our state' has more to do with Generation Snowflake, the dictates of the PC Brigade and interference from our EU masters.
And it certainly hasn't been helped by the criminal under-funding from a Tory government more concerned with the advancement of a political dogma and ideology rather than looking after the interests and well being of the British people.



.... with an economy that may nosedive off the cliff.


The important word there is 'may', and it may not.
Increasingly all the doom and gloom prophesised by The Remainers look like scare tactics and are increasingly unlikely to prove likely.

And even it does occur; short term pain for long term gain!



...... but I'm just making preparations to escape thye inferno ....


As is your right - you have to do what you think is right for you and your dependants etc.

Me, I've never ran from a fight in my life.
And I want to be a part of the force for positive change and help change this country everyone can be proud of.



...if it does all go tits up and we see total anarchy on the streets and a breakdown in law and order.


Total anarchy and the complete breakdown of law and order?
A bit of civil disobedience maybe but what you describe is just not going to happen and I have no idea why you would even begin to think it would.



South Africa is just my chosen option if an escape from the gates of hell is needed.


My personal opinion; out of the fire and all that.



posted on Aug, 21 2018 @ 08:08 AM
link   
a reply to: Freeborn

We have to be prepared to get out if something hits the fan and they start up a civil war, something along those lines. We don't know what the EU will do or if a group like National Action has infiltrated the army and police, takes over and starts a murderous cull of people. Total civil war, people starving in the streets, epidemics, we have to have a plan. Even a UFO invasion which might follow on from Brexit, again you need a plan of somewhere to bolt to in that event.



posted on Aug, 21 2018 @ 08:38 AM
link   
a reply to: ufoorbhunter



We have to be prepared to get out if something hits the fan and they start up a civil war, something along those lines.


First of all; in case WHO starts a civil war?

Secondly; get out? No thank you - I'm more of a 'we'll fight them on the beaches' sort of guy.
My country and I'll fight for it....but I can't really see it getting to that.



We don't know what the EU will do or if a group like National Action has infiltrated the army and police, takes over and starts a murderous cull of people. Total civil war, people starving in the streets, epidemics, we have to have a plan. Even a UFO invasion which might follow on from Brexit, again you need a plan of somewhere to bolt to in that event.


Wow.
How paranoid are you getting?

The EU?
Bring it on - fought them alone before, I'm absolutely certain we'd be able to do it again if we have to.....which we won't have to because it simply will not happen.

National Action take over?
Again, it'll never happen.....but if it did I think there'd be enough of us to oppose them.

As for the rest?????

The best bit - why would UFO's invade the UK because we are leaving the EU, please, please share your reasoning.

I don't recall you being anywhere near this paranoid before...a genuine and well intentioned question; are you ok?



posted on Aug, 21 2018 @ 09:00 AM
link   
Truly sad.

Making policies punishing or rewarding people based on racial identity from historical abuses will never end well.

For those who think this is omehow justified becuase of colonialism.

Correct me if I am wrong, but arent the overhwelming majority of blacks in South Afirca also descendent from people who conquered the natives of south Africa?

I believe I read before that the actual natives that lived nin south africa have almost all been wiped out, and they were taken over by both white colonials and black africans from other areas.

If that is the case, then why shouldnt people from that original group be given land from black people as well as whites?

Is skin color the only thing that matters, as opposed to who actual descendants were?

Or is it that there is an arbitrary cut off for how far back in history we should go for justice, like 60 to a hundred years ago, and the blacks that were abused those many years ago deserve justice, but the very blacks those blacks abused prior to that can go pound salt?



posted on Aug, 22 2018 @ 08:01 AM
link   
a reply to: halfoldman

Is there a new Steve Biko waiting in the wings? I hope so for the sake of South Africa. I bet the old aparthied lot that got rid of him (if any are still alive) would give anything to have him back these days.......



posted on Aug, 22 2018 @ 12:49 PM
link   
a reply to: Freeborn

Thanks for the concern about my state of mind Freeborn and it is quite normal right now. I am not planning to jump ship btw and will likewise fight for my country as did my ancestors before and actually quite like the idea of a Britain free of the EU. I just get very concerned about the economic impact of leaving something that most of the world would love to be a part of, especially as we were never ever a proper EU member anyway opting out of the Eurozone and Shengen too. We had probably the best deal of anybody in the EU and now it looks like we are out. Fair do but I am worried about the impact indeed it already has caused me economic grief with Sterling crashing.

The possibility of total anarchy on the streets is real and there will be some groups planning to make the most of this event. Whether it's Islamic groups seeking a further division of communities or their other side of the coin National Action types seeking the same, we are looking at a period where instability may take hold.

On the UFO front FB please take note this site is a conspiracy site and I am just joining in on that level while at the same time know through many experiences that there are motherships, probes, orbs, all manner of weird craft in our skies that the powers that be cover up the existence of.................... We must be totally prepared for the UFOs to take advantage of the period of instability to do whatever they want with us be it good or bad. I honestly do not want to wake up one morning then open my curtains and see a load of ufo dropped robots shooting stun gun type beams at the human beings on view then collecting them up me and you included as part of a cull to take back to their meat factories and made into a type of food for them.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 02:13 AM
link   
I would never have thought that I'd link to Fox news... But here it is...

Inside South Africa's racist land seizures



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 03:42 AM
link   
a reply to: ufoorbhunter



I am not planning to jump ship btw and will likewise fight for my country as did my ancestors before.....


Then why post that you are planning on doing so?



..... and actually quite like the idea of a Britain free of the EU.


Then why repeatedly state your misgivings over Brexit, how you think its going to be disastrous for you and your desire to remain in the EU?
Not just in this thread but in numerous other one's too.



I just get very concerned about the economic impact of leaving something that most of the world would love to be a part of,....


Of course there'll be difficulties ahead of us but its all about long term gain and re-asserting our own sovereignty.

I think the vast majority can see the benefits of being part of a Free Trade Association, but we want nothing to do with political union with a bloated, corrupt, dictatorial, globalist seeking entity that is the EU.
An 'organisation' that actively seeks to destroy the very notion of nationhood and national pride.
An 'organisation' that is anti-democratic and whose major powerbrokers and policy makers are largely unelected and self-regulatory.

Why would anyone want to be part of such a thing?



Fair do but I am worried about the impact indeed it already has caused me economic grief with Sterling crashing.


I both understand and appreciate that....but as I've said before; short term pain for long term gain.



The possibility of total anarchy on the streets is real and there will be some groups planning to make the most of this event. Whether it's Islamic groups seeking a further division of communities or their other side of the coin National Action types seeking the same, we are looking at a period where instability may take hold.


If my Aunty had balls she'd be my uncle!
If, may, if, may????
If I worried about everything that MAY happen I'd never leave the house or even get out of bed.

Extremist Islamic groups are an obvious threat.....regardless of Brexit!

National Action are a horrible, insidious group...but just how much of a national threat do they pose?
Not sure.....but I don't see how Brexit will make much of a difference to their racist, bigoted agenda.
They are what they are.

A bigger live threat to our society are the PC Brigade with their army of Social Justice Warriors and their offspring Generation Snowflake.



On the UFO front FB please take note this site is a conspiracy site......


Yes, I'm more than aware of that.....the thing that first brought me to ATS all them years ago.
But it doesn't give you a licence to post hypotheticals with no supportive evidence at all and no reasoned argument to give any level of credence.



We must be totally prepared for the UFOs to take advantage of the period of instability to do whatever they want with us be it good or bad.


If they are here then their technology must be so far advanced than ours that they'd be able to do whatever they want whenever they want regardless of Brexit.

There are far more real and actual problems in this world to deal with and worry over.

You're an intelligent person, let's get this thread back on track.



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 07:23 AM
link   
a reply to: Freeborn

Thread back on track



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 07:28 AM
link   

originally posted by: Gemwolf
I would never have thought that I'd link to Fox news... But here it is...

Inside South Africa's racist land seizures


We had some news about the invasions too on Sky news here in the UK a couple of weeks ago. I'll try dig it out........................... Yep found it, was in June. Farmers getting trained up by ex IDF special forces news.sky.com...



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 09:46 AM
link   
Just read this tweet by Trump on the farm seizures. Maybe Trump is coming to the table? www.france24.com...



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 10:08 AM
link   
Didn't Zimbabwe do something like this that tanked their economy and caused a massive famine because the new farm owners knew sweet F.A. about how to farm?



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 01:20 PM
link   
Here is a link on President Trump's tweet regarding South Africa and the reactions:
www.news24.com...

As I mentioned before, the ANC is speaking with a dual tongue, with one message for their radical followers, and another for their foreign investors, which is supposed to make it all seem like the height of reasonableness.

But the fact remains, they have test cases (just to make sure when they throw legal landowners off their property, they can't contest it). In fact they don't need to change the constitution at all.
Like in Stellenbosch for example - farm occupiers say the land belongs to the coloreds and the blacks (their own distinction), meanwhile the Bantu never lived there historically, and they have no historical claim here whatsoever (just as little as we have in Lesotho, Swaziland, or the former tribal lands along the fertile eastern seaboard). That is unless they buy or lease land here, like everybody else. But a historical claim, or ancestral claim they do not have here. Yeah the Khoisan people might, but that's another story. They're being settled by the Bantus before they can even work it out with the whites!
www.iol.co.za...
Land expropriation without compensation based on race and phony regional histories is non-negotiable - the ANC don't move from this.
How the the ANC can reiterate this with populist speech almost daily for months on end, and then call President Trump a "liar" and "racist" is beyond logic.

Anyway, all the newspapers say different things, there's a huge amount of psy-ops (especially to paint whites as "racists", while ignoring the genocidal hate speech on social media platforms against us). However, the theft and leaving highly skilled people destitute (people who assured food security so far) is part of the plan is never denied. In fact President Ramaphosa reiterated it again. It must just be an "orderly" theft from legal landowners, if they are white!
An "orderly theft", what a nice oxymoron.
businesstech.co.za...

As far as unimaginably brutal farm attacks go, yeah maybe the numbers and frequency has reduced (but not the shocking brutality). Not surprising really since the number of commercial farmers have reduced from 120 000 in 1994 to 35 000 currently (and doubtlessly falling after the latest shenanigans). See page 4 of this thread for numbers and sources. Of course attacks will decrease if the number of people you are attacking decreases! Duh!

But now who is the racist and liar?
Either you keep pumping land expropriation without compensation, and thus unravel property rights, or you do not.
And they are, and it is that simple.

But they do understand that such measures have international consequences, no matter how nicely you try and spin it. It will become a global issue if food security and investment in SA plummets further, and there are millions of starving refugees. Never mind personal sanctions against ANC and EFF leaders, and cessation of development funds. They have no Marxist friends to fund them now (unlike the 1980's), when the disinvestment and boycotts they called for didn't touch the ANC fat-cats.
And unlike Zimbabwe (when they expropriated white farmland), there is no convenient country further south for the hungry masses to flee. The only thing further south from SA is the deep blue sea.

But it's their own discourse!
They can't blame anybody else.
And they will call people slurs and liars, and say the same basic thing on the same day.

The mind boggles ...

Meanwhile the more openly racist and anti-white EFF claims there is no white genocide, but instead a black genocide in SA and the US. I can't speak on the US, but I don't recall when whites ever invaded a black-owned farm or tribal area and tortured their people for days on end (including acts so sexual and despicable I can't even mention them here, neither do whites go into their townships and cause their black-on-black crime). I mean all crime is a tragedy, and I'm certainly not happy about any of it, but if we're talking about race-based "genocides" lets just compare the numbers. The leftist press won't dare. And while white farmers have been halved or more, the black population is healthily growing in SA. So it must be the most spectacularly unsuccessful "genocide" in history. But there will be a genocide - a genocide of starvation and civil war between many factions, just like whenever the Marxists dispossess and wipe out the designated "kulaks" for the sake of collectivization. www.news24.com...

To sum up, nobody is a liar on this issue, since the ANC keeps saying it themselves: there will be race-based expropriation without compensation.
And conversely without secure property rights, the ANC can expect to be booted out of the Western sphere of power, influence and standing.
Obscure it and sugar-coat it any way you like, shout down your critics with name-calling and hysterical slurs - but that is the nitty-gritty.
edit on 23-8-2018 by halfoldman because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 01:33 PM
link   
To sum up, a bit of oxymoronic "orderly theft":


"We are going to take land and when we take land we are going to take it without compensation," Ramaphosa, in his capacity as ANC president, said at the launch of the campaign at the Makhulong Stadium. "We are going to do it in the interest of our people because our people want land for housing, they want land so that they can live, they want land so that they can use it as an economic resource." Ramaphosa, however, emphasised that the expropriation of land would not be done through land invasions, shouting "panzi land invasions, panzi (down with land invasions, down)". "We are going to embark on an orderly process of getting land into the hands of our people."


www.businesslive.co.za...
So how is anything that President Trump tweeted wrong, or the wider concerns of the global community?

Sure the EU leftists won't mind because their overproduced factory farming is looking for new surplus markets to smear off their chemically and hormone infested surplus produce (and they've already undercut much African farming, while erecting huge trade barriers to protect their own), but the question is, will the poor in SA be able to afford that when the food riots start? The price of imported maize-meal (a staple in SA) rises by over 60 percent with imports.

And not saying black people can't farm, but good luck taking a farm with generational expertise, and simply booting off the farmer and giving it to people from a completely different landscape, unless you only want bare subsistence and more rural squatter camps.
Didn't turn out very "productive" so far.
www.amazon.com...

A bit of a different issue, but one day I must make a thread about our fisheries!
Never mind fisheries along the African coasts fished out by EU and other trawlers (yeah, and these trawlers that unload in Spain, and throw a third of West Africa's fish-stock away - thus causing a further ecological tragedy - are tax funded by leftist EU governments).
It's another horror story of sheer mismanagement and corruption for coastal communities in SA.
My heart bleeds for our West Coast fishing communities.
And nope, it's not the nationalistic Poles and Hungarians funding the complete depletion of Africa's coast with massive trawlers - it's Merkel and the other leftists (also the Chinese)!
Not surprisingly, since the EU leftists prefer mass-migration to non-interference in Africa (for various baffling reasons).
www.greenpeace.org...
It's a story of the land and sea and restructuring the globe.
And they won't rest until the last bread-baskets in Africa are destroyed.
And she even said, Germany must make more propaganda in Africa so that all their most educated and productive people migrate.
Who says something like this? It's insane. Just saying, there are global forces at work - and it's ideological to destroy both Africa and Europe, until you have a classless, culture-less mass of people under a global socialist dictatorship.
Yeah, and they're doing it under the facade of "equality" and "virtue signalling" when the opposite is true.

But, it all seems like part of the end-game where leftist globalists want more mass migrations until local identities and food productions are destroyed as competitions to a global and central form of food production and dependency.
A world without borders, countries, cultures and with a single monopoly of control.
The success of white and some other commercial farmers in SA (despite radically decreased numbers) must be a thorn in their eye.
Hence it must be destroyed at all costs - even by people caught up in a game that will forever damn their future generations to globalist slavery.

That's my broad personal theory.
But to reiterate (as they often do) land expropriation in SA is going to happen, and anybody who sugarcoats this clear and present message is the liar!

And in this case, it is not President Trump, and I hope he will investigate thoroughly, and not just blow more smoke up people's butts who are losing complete touch with their own true ideological and historical worth. A stolen car may run for a while, but if you don't know how to maintain it, there is no future if you simply have that vehicle and don't know how to keep it running. What good will that do your children?
edit on 23-8-2018 by halfoldman because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 23 2018 @ 03:47 PM
link   
Just wanted to attribute my "motor-car" metaphor above to Stefan Molyneux.
I think my posts were already too long - too much to say.
I mean my thoughts are independent and reliant on a very dis-unified local SA press.
Especially considering they are reliant on politicians who back-track almost daily, and then sail ahead again.
It's deliberate newspeak and Marxist obfuscation.
Although I may not agree with the libertarian Canadian philosopher on all things, I think he summed it up pretty well two days ago, as far as the central nitty-gritty goes.




edit on 23-8-2018 by halfoldman because: (no reason given)



new topics

top topics



 
24
<< 3  4  5    7  8 >>

log in

join