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Trump and Putin, sitting in a tree........

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posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 12:54 PM
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a reply to: Thecakeisalie


Trump made the mistake of going of flying into Helsinki blowing hot air-I've said it before Putin is a former KGB head honcho; he made his weekly wage via misdirection, subterfuge and infiltration. Trump is a quasi successful businessman who's only real talent is his ego fueled obfuscation.


What does that statement mean? What is the point you are trying to get across?




posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 12:58 PM
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a reply to: theantediluvian


the finger was pointed at Russia and Trump and his supporters were eager to believe anything except that the Russians were behind it?


Because no evidence was presented indicating Russia was behind it. No evidence was presenting proving they were even "hacked" in the first place. You surely can't expect us to accept someone else's conclusions/analysis without having a chance to view the raw evidence. And don't try any of that "secrecy" BS, this was a PRIVATE company working for a non-government entity (The DNC is not a government agency). Heck, the Feds never even touched the actual server.

We learned our lesson after the Iraq fiasco. Never again will (nor should) the American people accept allegations without evidence.


How's that working out?


It is working out fine, as far as I know. There have been multiple elections held since 2016, and several Dems have won those elections. Where did the Russians go? How can't you see this as yet another Iraq 2.0 style lie? Our government has a SERIOUS credibility problem. The only way to get over that hurdle is verification, transparency, total accountability and evidence-based statements.


Secondly, I've never been one to accuse Trump of conspiring with Putin. I've said from the beginning that if anyone at all was conspiring with the Russians, it would likely be Manafort. And as it turns out, he was at the very least attempting to sell influence to his former benefactors. (see link in my sig)


Yes, and I appreciate that fact. You are one of the few who haven't made unfounded allegations against President Trump. Sure, if evidence of conspiracy comes to light, that is a different story. Even I would be jumping on that band-wagon, in that instance. But that doesn't represent reality. At the present time, the "collusion" peddlers use off-hand public remarks and some nebulous interpretation of emails to "get dirt" (Oppo research?) on Clinton as evidence.

As Hillary illustrated with her dirty-dossier, it is NOT a crime to get "oppo research" from foreign nationals. If so, then Hillary is guilty of "collusion" (read: conspiracy to defraud) by working with UK & Russian nationals/government contacts to get "dirt" on Trump.

It is a two way street.

Problem is, Americans have free speech. Free association. It isn't a crime to associate with foreign nationals nor to derive "dirt" on an opponent through those associations. Unless he willfully engaged in a conspiracy to violate US law it is not a crime.

And I agree RE: Manafort. All those DC-insider types need to be investigated, because it is clear they are as dirty as dirt gets. Manafort is a crook, and deserves the jail time. But so does a handful of other crooks.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 01:03 PM
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I wish it was just as simple as Trump and Putin got together and devised an elaborate plan to get Trump elected. It's never that simple though, it's turning out to be pretty damned complicated.

The shortest version I can muster is that Trump is guilty for crimes committed before office (money laundering, bribery, etc.) and some of those crimes involved Russian oligarchs funding Trump and money being passed back and forth. When Trump started to gain some traction through rhetoric during his campaign Putin saw an opportunity and seized it. He knew he had Trump in his pocket and began exploiting him and planting numerous operatives in and around the Trump campaign. Some of these operatives were already deeply involved in conservative politics, always greasing the wheels but never the ones to turn those wheels.

After Trump won then Putin's operatives began 'advising' the president on who he should select for various cabinet positions, all people who were exploitable by Putin in some way. At this point, it's important to keep in mind that Robert Mueller has only been going after people involved in the campaign in some way, if more information comes out on people in the Trump administration then that's when the sh*t will really hit the fan.

Trump either knew it was happening or he didn't. If he did then why didn't he stop it? If he didn't know, then he's only guilty of the sketchy things he did before he was in office.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 01:17 PM
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a reply to: JBurns

The problems rather simple, the problem is the divide between the people.

It's a class war, always has been and always will be, but now "They" are attempting to remove the middle class and let the poor subside on even less.

Which is where all the hatred, racial intolerance, and even religious indifference stems from.

Either way with people like Trump and Putin at the helm the average Joe is apt to get the bum deal.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 01:24 PM
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originally posted by: loam
a reply to: andy06shake

Funny how anti-Trump liberals, who supposedly abhor LGBTQ discrimination, always find a way to use gay imagery as a slur against their opponents.


This argument annoys me. So, for memes and political cartoons depicting Bill Clinton chasing after and fondling women — are these a slur against heterosexuality? Are they saying it’s bad for a man to be attracted to women?

The stuff with Putin and Trump isn’t putting down homosexuality in general; it is implying that Putin and Trump are a little too close for two countries who are not allies.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 01:28 PM
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a reply to: JBurns

The problem is Putin can play the game better.

Trump has the personality of a tween playing Call of Duty- he talks a big game but throws out threats that his ass can't cash. Putin on the other hand is the camper, someone who sits idle, waiting for the time to strike.

And the democrats are the medics-useful in times of peril but are completely useless when it comes to facing a threat head on.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 01:30 PM
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a reply to: kaylaluv

Exactly.


Nobody gives a crap where they are sticking there plungers. LoL

I simply posted the pic to highlight exactly how close their relationship seems to be, nevermind the fact that both Men don't exactly have anything nice to say about homosexuality in general.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 01:37 PM
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originally posted by: kaylaluv
This argument annoys me.


Of course it does, because it's true.

The mental gymnastics you have to perform to say otherwise is proof enough.

Take for example:



So, for memes and political cartoons depicting Bill Clinton chasing after and fondling women — are these a slur against heterosexuality? Are they saying it’s bad for a man to be attracted to women?


No. It's a direct comparison to philandering married men...which most people view negatively.

So people that use gay imagery to embarrass political opponents only do so because it's the 'gayness' they see negatively.




edit on 26-7-2018 by loam because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 01:43 PM
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a reply to: loam

How can it not just be a noise up over political muppets, who let's face it, are indeed rather homophobic themselves?

You dont even have to find it humoursome yourself, but that's no need to ruin the laughter for the rest of us.

Nothing wrong with 'gayness', but plenty darn wrong with people.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 01:47 PM
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a reply to: andy06shake

Just trying to keep up.

Since you're loosening the outrage rules, I guess much of what has been leveled at Trump and his supporters can be reassessed.

Good to know.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 01:54 PM
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a reply to: loam

Well Trump should be assessed by trained mental health care professionals, nevermind reassessed, that's a given.


But its a free country, reassess as you see fit, and if you come to any other conclusions be sure and let us know.

I think the Mans showing signs of senility myself, dont know what his diet is like but Vascular Dementia may explain his cognitive impairment, racist outburst and general stupidity in spades.

And he is at that age.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 02:02 PM
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a reply to: loam

So, men who have extra-marital sex are bad, but not men who have sex with women they are in a committed relationship with, right?

Same thing with the gay relationship. Most people view it negatively when two leaders from countries that aren’t supposed to be allies are getting along a little too well. That doesn’t mean two men who are in a legit gay relationship are looked down upon.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 02:02 PM
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a reply to: andy06shake

Hm. Interesting train of thought.

I suppose many of the kale warriors on the left must suffer from protein deficiency.




posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 02:03 PM
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a reply to: kaylaluv

Yup. Keep telling yourself it isn't a gay slur.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 02:04 PM
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a reply to: loam



Trumps not on the Kale ile tell you that, more like the Tango if truth be told.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 02:13 PM
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The answer to this, from the ATS forum nonetheless, would be epic.

Both would have to be utilizing black technologies from crashed UFOs and dead Alien bodies.

This resulted in Trump finding out about the Tr-3B, US most blackest, crunchy crispity project, this allowed him to go to meetings undisturned.

Putin used technology from the ancient Siberian defense network, long left by an antediluvian civilization, it is here that the two met and planned to destroy ONLY LEFTIST LIBERALS.

They realize that they can hacks puny human technology with advance planetary Vex Minds, capable of simulating past and present environments and through ontological means, brute force that into reality, thus evoking Mandella effect at the same time.

Then, the pinata arrived...



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 02:50 PM
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originally posted by: notsure1

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: network dude

I don't think I've ever seen anyone say that Trump and Putin planned anything together.

You appear to be asking someone to justify or explain a strawman argument you created.


What? Are you kidding right now? Are you this dumb ?

WOW just wow.

What about pee gate? and now trump is his puppet and helsinki? You need to stop being an idiot.


None of what you said shows that anyone claimed Trump and Putin personally worked together on colluding.

Perhaps you need to read the specifics of what is in the OP, or at least implied by the OP through it's language, before you say such things.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 02:54 PM
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originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: Nikola014


Bulls# The main narrative you and the democrats and the mainstream media push, is the collusion with the Russians, which means someone must have planned it, because that's how collusion works. Two sides get together to plan an action


I'd argue that the "main narrative" as you put it, has always been that the Putin regime interfered in the election to advantage Trump/disadvantage Clinton.

The question has been whether or not Trump or anyone in his campaign conspired with the Russian government in their efforts.

Granted, there are some who are convinced that Trump himself literally coordinated with Putin (including a few on ATS, possibly in this thread) but even among those who accuse Trump of "collusion," many actually see it more like Trump graciously accepted the assistance (publicly) and has since done whatever he could to dismiss the interference altogether, show his appreciation, etc — which isn't actual conspiracy but might as well be.

Meanwhile, Trump and his people have sought to move the goalposts all the way conspiracy. At every opportunity (including inventing opportunities) he repeats "no collusion!" (no conspiracy) as though that makes anything short of conspiracy a non-issue.

That's what the OP seeks to do here too.


Absolutely correct.

There has never been a "narrative" of any substance that Trump himself was involved in collusion, or that he planned any specifics with Putin.



posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 03:03 PM
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originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: Nikola014


Bulls# The main narrative you and the democrats and the mainstream media push, is the collusion with the Russians, which means someone must have planned it, because that's how collusion works. Two sides get together to plan an action


I'd argue that the "main narrative" as you put it, has always been that the Putin regime interfered in the election to advantage Trump/disadvantage Clinton.

The question has been whether or not Trump or anyone in his campaign conspired with the Russian government in their efforts.

Granted, there are some who are convinced that Trump himself literally coordinated with Putin (including a few on ATS, possibly in this thread) but even among those who accuse Trump of "collusion," many actually see it more like Trump graciously accepted the assistance (publicly) and has since done whatever he could to dismiss the interference altogether, show his appreciation, etc — which isn't actual conspiracy but might as well be.

Meanwhile, Trump and his people have sought to move the goalposts all the way conspiracy. At every opportunity (including inventing opportunities) he repeats "no collusion!" (no conspiracy) as though that makes anything short of conspiracy a non-issue.

That's what the OP seeks to do here too.


Absolutely correct.

There has never been a "narrative" of any substance that Trump himself was involved in collusion, or that he planned any specifics with Putin.





posted on Jul, 26 2018 @ 03:04 PM
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originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: Nikola014


Bulls# The main narrative you and the democrats and the mainstream media push, is the collusion with the Russians, which means someone must have planned it, because that's how collusion works. Two sides get together to plan an action


I'd argue that the "main narrative" as you put it, has always been that the Putin regime interfered in the election to advantage Trump/disadvantage Clinton.

The question has been whether or not Trump or anyone in his campaign conspired with the Russian government in their efforts.

Granted, there are some who are convinced that Trump himself literally coordinated with Putin (including a few on ATS, possibly in this thread) but even among those who accuse Trump of "collusion," many actually see it more like Trump graciously accepted the assistance (publicly) and has since done whatever he could to dismiss the interference altogether, show his appreciation, etc — which isn't actual conspiracy but might as well be.

Meanwhile, Trump and his people have sought to move the goalposts all the way conspiracy. At every opportunity (including inventing opportunities) he repeats "no collusion!" (no conspiracy) as though that makes anything short of conspiracy a non-issue.

That's what the OP seeks to do here too.


Absolutely correct.

There has never been a "narrative" of any substance that Trump himself was involved in collusion, or that he planned any specifics with Putin.


Then how the hell were you gonna impeach him?

Nobody ever said trump colluded? You are so delusional.

Backtrack much??




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