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Florida Man Shot Dead Over Parking Space Row.

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posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 10:38 PM
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It was a lawful shoot.

There is nothing about him stepping back that makes it unlawful. A person may use any level of force if they reasonably believe the threat rises to the level of being an imminent and immediate threat of serious bodily harm and/or death. One case describes "the 'stand your ground' law... a person has a right to expect absolute safety in a place they have a right to be, and may use deadly force to repel an unlawful intruder."




posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 10:40 PM
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It appears to me to involuntary manslaughter to say the least. Most likely a crime of passion. Rage brought on by being pushed to the ground.



posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 11:08 PM
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That's why when you are a child they tell you repeatedly;


KEEP YOUR HANDS TO YOURSELF



posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 11:18 PM
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Just copying what I wrote in the other thread about this incident...

My observations:

- The reaction of the other shoppers walking in/out of the shop (particularly the guy in light blue shirt) makes me believe the shooter was more than likely being quite loud/imposing and perhaps threatening towards the lady in the car. In fact it almost seemed like the guy in the light blue shirt went in to warn the husband/victim of what was happening, as the husband looked to have come out already knowing that something was happening (notice his child stayed behind, probably told to do so).

- As the husband was fast approaching, the wife immediately began hopping out of the car. This to me seemed more like a case of her getting out to get in-between the shooter and the husband and keep the situation from escalating. The reason I mention this is because one of the previous posters indicated that her hopping out was supposed to be further justification for the shooter being "afraid for his life".

- While the shooter was pushed down to the ground quite hard - I didn't get the impression that he intended to do any further harm. But when the older guy pulled the gun, the husband immediately stepped back and it was quite obvious any potential threat was gone. There was absolutely no reason to have to fire the weapon at that point.

In my opinion the shooter should be tried and convicted of manslaughter at the very least. If you make a point of carrying a gun in public and getting into confrontations that put you at risk of a physical beat-down - then you better be able to control your temper when drawing the weapon. The mere sight of it in 99% of cases will be enough to scare the aggressor away and firing it should only ever be done as a last/desperate option.



posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 11:20 PM
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Easy fix: ban handicapped parking spots



posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 11:31 PM
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originally posted by: Navieko
Just copying what I wrote in the other thread about this incident...

My observations:

- The reaction of the other shoppers walking in/out of the shop (particularly the guy in light blue shirt) makes me believe the shooter was more than likely being quite loud/imposing and perhaps threatening towards the lady in the car. In fact it almost seemed like the guy in the light blue shirt went in to warn the husband/victim of what was happening, as the husband looked to have come out already knowing that something was happening (notice his child stayed behind, probably told to do so).

- As the husband was fast approaching, the wife immediately began hopping out of the car. This to me seemed more like a case of her getting out to get in-between the shooter and the husband and keep the situation from escalating. The reason I mention this is because one of the previous posters indicated that her hopping out was supposed to be further justification for the shooter being "afraid for his life".

- While the shooter was pushed down to the ground quite hard - I didn't get the impression that he intended to do any further harm. But when the older guy pulled the gun, the husband immediately stepped back and it was quite obvious any potential threat was gone. There was absolutely no reason to have to fire the weapon at that point.

In my opinion the shooter should be tried and convicted of manslaughter at the very least. If you make a point of carrying a gun in public and getting into confrontations that put you at risk of a physical beat-down - then you better be able to control your temper when drawing the weapon. The mere sight of it in 99% of cases will be enough to scare the aggressor away and firing it should only ever be done as a last/desperate option.


Good analysis. As a ccw holder and knowing a lot of them most are good people. But like any group you have a certain % no matter how minuscule that are bad apples. Some people strap on a set of balls they otherwise don't have when they have a firearm on them.

When armed you should not do anything that may cause a conflict when it comes to small things like flipping someone off because they cut you off or hounding someone over a parking space.

You are armed and ya should try to avoid conflict. From what I read this isn't the first time this guy argued with someone over a parking spot.

If you see someone getting robbed, beat to a pulp, raped etc sure intervene if you want. But do not go around playing cop over small minuscule things like this and putting yourself into a position that may cause a conflict over something that in the grand scheme of things doesn't amount to much.

We also don't know how threatening he was to this woman, I also noticed the man looking at them as he was walking in. This makes me believe they were in fact loud.

While 99% of legal gun owners/carriers are good people do not let anyone lie to you and say there is absolutely none that are looking for a chance to shoot someone. There are exceptions in every group of people and life in general.

The guy was disengaging after he saw the firearm, imo he should face manslaughter at least.
edit on 23-7-2018 by ker2010 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 11:32 PM
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originally posted by: Grimpachi
It was a lawful shoot.

There is nothing about him stepping back that makes it unlawful. A person may use any level of force if they reasonably believe the threat rises to the level of being an imminent and immediate threat of serious bodily harm and/or death. One case describes "the 'stand your ground' law... a person has a right to expect absolute safety in a place they have a right to be, and may use deadly force to repel an unlawful intruder."






That above statement is the reason why so many people get shot each and everyday in the U. S of A.



posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 11:47 PM
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I bet he will not face manslaughter and even if he does the state would lose.

Everyone keeps talking about how the guy stepped back well that doesn't matter. What matters is what the shooter perceived. What was going on from his point of view after he was attacked?

By law the shooter only needs to "reasonably believe" he is still under threat of harm. Unlike us he did not have eyes from a video feed where he was in a calm environment able to carefully watch and count how many steps his assailant made.

If he hadn't attacked the man he would still be alive. If people are quick to resort to violence then they are prone to be resisted with violence.
edit on 23-7-2018 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 11:57 PM
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a reply to: Grimpachi

If you are armed don't play Barney Fife.

Here is the deal SYG is a good law but its to easy to abuse.

Lets say the woman had parked in a regular parking spot. And lets say the shooter went to her cussing her out and harassing her just because he wanted to.

The BF comes out sees it and pushes him for it and gets shot.

Is the shooter still innocent? Because if so anyone who wants to shoot someone can do this numerous times until they eventually get attacked by a man defending his woman. Bait em and shoot them. Its not rocket science seeing how this can be abused.



edit on 24-7-2018 by ker2010 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 23 2018 @ 11:58 PM
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a reply to: Grimpachi
Um... pretty certain third-party witnesses (other than the wife & kids) as well as video evidence will play a large role in determining whether the shooter felt/actually was under a continued threat of harm after drawing his pistol - certainly more so than what the shooter says he believed (I mean obviously he's going to argue he was still under threat, not exactly impartial here).



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 12:07 AM
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Looks like a murder

The threat was over, yet he still fired.
Probably a little adrenalized from being pushed to the ground so hard.
But the threat was over, and he had control, being a weaponized self appointed hall monitor.

TO me it looks like a murder.



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 12:10 AM
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a reply to: Navieko

He was already assaulted any reasonable person will admit there is a threat of more violence since violence was already used.

So if it does go to court I am sure a lawyer will make that case.

More people would live longer if they learned that physical violence is not an acceptable answer to verbal arguments.



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 12:12 AM
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The guy needs to get charged. He can claim SYG if he wants, but he's gonna have a seriously hard time describing where the threat to his life was coming from.

I hope that POS fries.

This displays a severe lack of tactical patience that is present often even in the most minimally trained CCW holder.

ZERO judicious behavior. #ING NONE.

Sorry, this kind of crap irritates the hell out of me.

To offer an alternative, I carry a gun AND pepper spray. Most physical confrontations never escalate to the point of extreme violence. Regardless, such a risk is unnecessary and beating the # out of people can land you in jail if you take it too far. For those times there's pepper spray.

I carry Saber Red OC spray. Do NOT use bear mace it is NOT as strong as regular pepper spray.

Not every altercation needs to be solved with the presence of a gun. Broaden your defensive toolbox and don't be an idiot.



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 12:17 AM
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a reply to: spacedoubt

Looks like it to me, as well.

I might, if I'm the DA, let him plead out to manslaughter, since there was violence aimed at him.

But...that's a tough sell as I saw no continuing threat there, it was over.



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 12:20 AM
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a reply to: eManym

There's nothing involuntary there.

It was deliberate intent. He drew. Aimed. Fired. That doesn't fit my definition of involuntary there. Maybe in some odd legalistic way it's involuntary...but I think that'd be a tough sell to a jury.



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 12:22 AM
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originally posted by: Grimpachi
He was already assaulted any reasonable person will admit there is a threat of more violence since violence was already used.

Clearly not once he draws the gun out causing the guy to immediately back off. Just because you feel threatened/insecure enough to draw the weapon out doesn't mean it needs to be fired. There was more than enough time in the couple seconds between him drawing the weapon and firing it, for him to have seen the threat was no longer present.


So if it does go to court I am sure a lawyer will make that case.

Oh it'll go to court and while I'm sure the lawyer will try and make that case, I'd be pretty darn surprised if the shooter isn't at least convicted for manslaughter, if not murder (seeing as he doesn't deny deliberately pulling the trigger).
edit on 24/7/18 by Navieko because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 04:53 AM
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a reply to: alldaylong>>> I had family friend and neighbor whose brother was murdered in a fight over a street handicapped parking space. He got one and then someone on the same street wanted it. Its like everybody wants to be able to use a handicapped space. Turning somebody in should be as simple as taking a photo of the car in the space, getting their license number and then taking a photo of their placard or lack of one. If anything comes up wrong, say the placard is a phony or stolen or out of date, then a $500 fine should be mailed to the cars owner. This Florida case is being politicized to undermine the law and to get it overturned. The cops hate the public taking the law into their own hands and anti gun control is huge in Florida because of the school shooting and that little Nazi Hogg kid. They could charge the guy but want a public outcry over justice not being served. The guy was an a hole for shoving the man, but the man was apparently an a hole as well. Manslaughter could be the charge but the police and DA are kicking a political football around.



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 08:15 AM
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I would pin the problem on prosecuting the shooter on this. A large guy just pushed you hard and you're looking up at him from the ground. There is a little temporary insanity on the shooters part considering the situation. Even with the other guy retreating at the sight of the gun. It's sad but self defense covers this. At that point it's well in his thought processes that he's about to get stomped on.

I'm afraid this is just assholecide.
edit on 24-7-2018 by ntech because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 08:22 AM
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a reply to: alldaylong


They were both wrong.

Parking Nazi dude is either crazy or looking for a fight.

Victim of the shooting shouldn’t have resorted to physical violence right off the bat. Now he is dead.

Lesson here: don’t get physical with crazy people in stand your ground states.


If I had been the driver, or in the car. I would have just said something like “Oh I wasn’t aware, thank you”, and moved the car. You should never argue with crazy.


edit on 24-7-2018 by KTemplar because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2018 @ 08:30 AM
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a reply to: alldaylong

Those of the cloth will say, it's the end times, those of chaos would say, yes we're winning! And those who favor reincarnation will say, it was meant to be! the bad people on this planet will be victims in the reincarnation cycle, and those with common sense who don't give a # about the mumbo jumbo crap they've been fed about their reality will say 'wtf' I can't wait till this # is done with.



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