So when Trump gets reelected in 2020 who are they going to blame?

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: gortex

I know. I'm just enjoying pointing out how the OP is being a hypocrite.

Why?

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: gortex

I know. I'm just enjoying pointing out how the OP is being a hypocrite.

Once you siad that Trump calling Ms 13 animals and saying there were mistakes on both sides was much worse than saying rip the POTUS son out of his mothers arms and kill him and strip and rape and beat the head of the DHS in public, you have lost all credibility .

So no one should ever care what you have to say anyway.

Unless of course they agree with idiotic bs..

Ultimately if Trump wins again in 2020 Dems will blame ourselves. The level of saltiness will likely (at least in my opinion) be comparative to the disparity between the popular vote and the electoral college tally.

I guess I'm curious at what point the disparity becomes anathema to our Democracy. Whats that magic number where we can agree something is wrong, 60%, 70%, 80% popular vote over-ridden by electoral votes?

Would any Republican have a problem if Republican's won the vote in 2020 and beyond with ~20% of the popular vote (in this, our 2 party system)?

originally posted by: Wayfarer
Ultimately if Trump wins again in 2020 Dems will blame ourselves. The level of saltiness will likely (at least in my opinion) be comparative to the disparity between the popular vote and the electoral college tally.

I guess I'm curious at what point the disparity becomes anathema to our Democracy. Whats that magic number where we can agree something is wrong, 60%, 70%, 80% popular vote over-ridden by electoral votes?

Would any Republican have a problem if Republican's won the vote in 2020 and beyond with ~20% of the popular vote (in this, our 2 party system)?

You are overestimating how popular your idea of Democracy ie mob rules is. We are not a Democracy no matter how many times you repeat it. We are a Constitutional Republic.

Saw earlier where someone in this thread mention our educational system, it's a shame instead of our educational system teaching historical facts and critical thinking skills, it seems to have been taken over by people who don't want to educate but to indoctrinate.

originally posted by: pavil
a reply to: notsure1

The Nobel Peace Prize Committee.

LOL
No.

And they will blame it on the uneducated fly-over idiots. Hopefully those can be countered.

originally posted by: seeker1963

originally posted by: Wayfarer
Ultimately if Trump wins again in 2020 Dems will blame ourselves. The level of saltiness will likely (at least in my opinion) be comparative to the disparity between the popular vote and the electoral college tally.

I guess I'm curious at what point the disparity becomes anathema to our Democracy. Whats that magic number where we can agree something is wrong, 60%, 70%, 80% popular vote over-ridden by electoral votes?

Would any Republican have a problem if Republican's won the vote in 2020 and beyond with ~20% of the popular vote (in this, our 2 party system)?

You are overestimating how popular your idea of Democracy ie mob rules is. We are not a Democracy no matter how many times you repeat it. We are a Constitutional Republic.

Saw earlier where someone in this thread mention our educational system, it's a shame instead of our educational system teaching historical facts and critical thinking skills, it seems to have been taken over by people who don't want to educate but to indoctrinate.

I'm not sure I made mention about the popularity of representative democracy in my post.......

But, since you replied, at what point is the system 'broken'. I mean, it would seem pretty obvious if we take it to the most illogical extreme (for understandings sake) and assume you are the only person who voted for Trump in 2020, and Trump still wins, is that working/a good thing for our country?

At what point does that number become less odious? Is it at least 20%, what? Saying that a representative democracy is working when some overwhelming majority of the people didn't vote for the person winning is practically no different than a kleptocratic despot holding onto power at the behest of the close cadre of lackeys they personally enrich.

I keep hearing the argument that if Democrats want to take back the state of the nation then we should vote for it, but what happens when every democrat can vote for what they want and still be unable to win?

a reply to: Wayfarer


Why it isn't working now is we have a corrupt government to the core! For a Constitutional Republic to work as our founders set it up, we need a government that is far from the corruption of our current example.

We need term limits, we need to make lobbying government officials a crime. How is it that giving money to an elected official to pass laws that favor your agenda/corporation is not considered a crime by those giving the cash/favor and those receiving it?

Remember Martha Stewart going to prison for insider trading? Why is it our elected officials made it legal for them to do exactly what she did and it's perfectly legal?

Democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep voting what is for dinner. Our Constitutional Republic was designed to prevent that. Aren't you glad we have many minority lifestyle groups that can legally be who they are? What if the majority of folks decided it should be illegal to be gay, trans or anything else for that matter? Do you see how a Constitutional Republic is better than Democracy now?

originally posted by: seeker1963
a reply to: Wayfarer


Why it isn't working now is we have a corrupt government to the core! For a Constitutional Republic to work as our founders set it up, we need a government that is far from the corruption of our current example.

We need term limits, we need to make lobbying government officials a crime. How is it that giving money to an elected official to pass laws that favor your agenda/corporation is not considered a crime by those giving the cash/favor and those receiving it?

Remember Martha Stewart going to prison for insider trading? Why is it our elected officials made it legal for them to do exactly what she did and it's perfectly legal?

Democracy is 2 wolves and a sheep voting what is for dinner. Our Constitutional Republic was designed to prevent that. Aren't you glad we have many minority lifestyle groups that can legally be who they are? What if the majority of folks decided it should be illegal to be gay, trans or anything else for that matter? Do you see how a Constitutional Republic is better than Democracy now?

Ya know, this is one of the most calm and reasoned responses I've gotten from you, so thanks for that.

In response to your query at the end of your last post: I'm actually referring to a flip of that scenario, wherein the minority group controls the majority (which I can't see as any better than the position you offered). Also, coincidentally, I could almost argue that the Republican minority of voters has (in some fashion) made it their prerogative to limit/inhibit the very lifestyles you espoused in your post above (not implying you agree with that either of course), so in essence the minority is actively working to take freedoms away from the majority in this case.

Regarding the rest of your reply above, I actually agree with just about all of it.

a reply to: notsure1

They'll blame eeRRReeeerrrrreRRRRepublicans.

Because those racist, sexist, homophobic, lady-hating bastards and their guns are intimidating the entire country... AND WORLD!!! by allowing Trump to do and say whatever he pleases.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: notsure1

Definitively calling an election before it has happened? What's next you going to quote some poll numbers?

Dude I was driven 18 wheels from
Boston to Fontana ca. up to and all thru
the ga damn election. The yard signs and
banners thru out the land from boston
thru neighbor hoods in Jersey and Penn.
Maryland West Virginia etc. All along the
I 40 were highly indicative of the over
whelming landslide victory that was about
to occur. I saw it coming and that's what
happened. Your wretched alternative
whyning cry baby candidate was denied
country wide. You wanna know what's going
on in this country?

DRIVE A TRUCK

Walk away shot

I am a Trump supporter, but let’s not get over confident. He has enemies all around.

a reply to: notsure1

So when Trump gets reelected in 2020 who are they going to blame?

The Deplorables & the Electoral College.

a reply to: notsure1

Maybe they'll go old-school Gore and blame that guy Chad again.

www.politico.com...

onald Trump is on track to win reelection to the presidency of the United States. Yes, despite Russiagate, despite #holegate and despite whatever gate he blunders through next. Despite approval ratings that would make Nixon weep. Despite his mind-numbing political misjudgments—defending accused pedophiles, for example—and the endless, unnecessary daily drama. Trump is winning. It is actually happening, people. And if there are those who want to stop it—and there are, of course, millions—they need to know what they are up against. It’s a lot more than they overconfidently think. First, consider the fact that Trump is simply lucky. Maybe one of the luckiest men to ever run for president. He’s somehow managed to turn his reputation for audacity and shamelessness into a shield. How many controversies and scandals has he survived that would have destroyed any of his predecessors long ago or sent them hiding in their homes in shame? The other day his personal lawyer made the preposterous claim that he personally paid $130,000 to an ex-porn star threatening to expose her relationship with Trump—with money from his own pocket—apparently just because Trump is a notoriously swell guy. How many lawyers do you know who’d so generously shell out over one hundred grand for a friend simply out of the goodness of their heart? Did anyone believe that ridiculous story? Who knows—because it’s off the front pages and we moved on to yet another shocking scandal like last weekend’s tweetstorm, when the president of the United States seemed to blame the Russia investigation for the death of schoolchildren in Florida. Remember the pardon of the controversial Sheriff Joe Arpaio, a birther who was accused of using his office to target political opponents and conduct racial profiling and was found guilty of a felony for disobeying a court order? Remember the phone call with the war widow when Trump seemed to forget the dead soldier’s name? Nobody does. We are too exhausted. We don’t have time. Second, consider Trump’s record as president. He actually has something to run on. He’s cut taxes. He’s rolled back regulations. He’s put ISIS on its heels. The economy and the stock market are humming along again, despite recent turmoil. Any other Republican incumbent running on that record of relative peace and prosperity—just as Eisenhower and Reagan did—would be in pretty good shape for reelection. Trump, as loathed as he is, might not cruise to reelection on an electoral landslide like those predecessors. But if jobs continue to be created and the economy continues to hum, whether he deserves the credit or not, enough voters might just hold their nose again and vote for him. Third, his opposition can’t get their act together. Who speaks for the Democratic Party? Depends on what time it is. What does the Democratic Party stand for? Well, they hate Trump and Russia. Oh, and they oppose tax cuts, always a popular proposition, especially at a time when Trump’s supposedly satanic tax bill has now found favor with a majority of the nation.

time.com...

If in November 2020 we are looking back on how Donald J. Trump came to be re-elected as President of the United States, those undergoing a second round of horror and dismay will find themselves reflecting on how seriously, and how often, they underestimated their foe. The left has history when it comes to looking down on, and therefore underrating, its opponents. Ronald Reagan was derided as a genial but bumbling movie actor but was elected twice to govern both his state and his country. As was George W. Bush, who seemed to inspire a kind of hysterical contempt in his adversaries: Haha, he’s so stupid. He says words like “misunderestimate.” Oh, he’s beaten us. Again. Donald Trump, by the same token, was surely too erratic and offensive and vulgar and narcissistic and unqualified to get his party’s nomination, let alone run an effective campaign. Let alone win. You might think that the anti-Trumpists would have begun to learn from this long series of events, but apparently not. Their opinion of Trump as a man need not have changed from the one they formed two years ago in the primaries, but neither does their view of his capabilities seem to have evolved. Inevitably, then, their underestimations continue. This error takes two forms. The first is to deny his achievements, and therefore miss how they galvanize his support. As I found in my most recent round of research, one of the things Trump voters most often say they like about his presidency is the economy: new jobs, higher take-home wages and, of course, the booming stock market. His opponents naturally refuse him the credit for these things. Yet speaking during her campaign about President Bill Clinton’s economic record, Hillary herself said “the results speak for themselves… America saw the longest peacetime expansion in our history.” Well, either a president deserves the plaudits for economic success or he doesn’t. And according to my recent focus groups in Memphis, Tenn., and Oxford, Miss., Trump voters see a direct connection. The invitation for Trump to hold face-to-face talks with Kim Jung Un provides another instance. Had this improbable event occurred under Barack Obama, a second Nobel Peace Prize would already be on the way. But Trump, his critics suggest, is merely reaping the reward of painstaking South Korean diplomacy — or, worse, is being played by the Pyongyang regime. Many of the voters we spoke to earlier this month were apprehensive about what might happen (“It could probably go either way,” one said with wary understatement), but saw the prospect of talks as a vindication of Trump’s robust approach. North Korea liked to act tough, “and if we don’t push back, they get their way a little bit more,” another observed. “But when we pushed back, he kind of fell back down and said, hey, I’ll talk to you.”

fivethirtyeight.com... covno between former leaders of the DNC and RNC longer read so i wont quote it but its a decent polite debate rare in this age

www.rasmussenreports.com... rategy

Voters see more chance for President Trump’s reelection these days and strongly believe that impeachment is not the best strategy for Democrats running for Congress. In fact, just 15% of Likely U.S. Voters believe focusing on the president’s possible impeachment is a better campaign strategy for Democratic congressional candidates than focusing on policy areas where they disagree with Trump. The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone and online survey finds that 70% think focusing on policy differences is a better political strategy. Fifteen percent (15%) are not sure. (To see survey question wording, click here.) Forty-one percent (41%) now believe the president will be reelected in 2020, up from 34% in late December. Twenty-six percent (26%) still think Trump will be defeated by the Democratic nominee, but 31% felt that way four months ago.

if they have been reading a variety of news and not their echo chambers (this applies to both sides mind you) it will be expected but we still should not get over confident.

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: notsure1

So if Trump gets reelected in 2020 who are they going to blame?

Fixed that for you.
No one has a crystal ball , he could do an Elvis given his lifestyle then what.

What lifestyle you talking about, Willis

a reply to: RalagaNarHallas

It's called overkill

a reply to: notsure1

Do you see what Trump looks like these days?

Dude's starting to look like Queen Elizabeth's grandfather.

I'm skeptical that he will want a second term, regardless of public opinion.

a reply to: Archivalist

The guy needs a care home, and fast. LoL

Some times you can't save people from themselves. There was a time when 'Laverne & Shirley' was voted the best program on TV. Politicians count on the abject ignorance of the populace and know they can easily manipulate them. The oldest trick in the propaganda book is to repeat something --- especially a fabrication --- over and over knowing there will be a segment that will blindly repeat it and, before long, it's accepted as truth.

a reply to: Stormdancer777

What lifestyle you talking about, Willis

Oh yeah I forgot , he's the most healthiest President that ever lived , his doctor said so ... kinda.