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NATO Squabble Provides Context to US Defense Spending Numbers

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posted on Jul, 12 2018 @ 07:06 AM
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a reply to: Irishhaf
First of all, i don´t bash the complete "U"SA, but i critize the behaviour of it´s governments, it´s Potuses, it´s oligarchy, it´s efforts to rule the world by military power.

I don´t bash the still sane people that live there!

And what we heard here is that a huge majority in the "U"SA is against Trumps-NATO moves. Wasn´t there even a vote in the "U"S senate, which ended with an overwhelming vote of no confidence against Trumps Nato plans? Fake news?
US Senate votes to defend NATO as Trump attacks alliance

But i bet we soon will have demonstrations again, with signs saying "Ami Go Home". Thanks Trump!
You just have to read the comment sections of european newspapers, doesn´t matter if more right or more left, more and more people want the "U"S military, it´s listening stations, it´s three letter agnecies to leave Europe. And not the other way around, as you tried to tell us. More and more people recognize that it is silly to have beef with one of our neighbours, just for the profits of the "U"SA.

Just look at the Northstream2 theatre. Trump wants to make us buy his expensive and dirty fracking gas, like the Trump sycophants in Poland do. Transported from the "U"SA to Europe. While we can have cheaper and qualitatively better gas and oil from around the corner. And we can trust Russia with that, there was never a problem except when the Ukraine stole gas that was for thought for Germany! But we can´t trust the "U"SA under Trump anymore, as the world had to learn.

And we are doing what both sides(look what Trump did, the "U"SA, it´s government, is more and more seen as the enemy, by almost the complete world) agreed to, in 2014. From year to year the NATO states spend more and more. And again, it´s not 2024 yet!

Another again: The NATO states can´t fulfil CONTRACTS which don´t exist!

If somebody breaks contracts, "deals", then we could observe over the last months that Trump and his "U"SA, the Trump-"U"SA, breaks contracts. That "deals", done with the "greatest dealmakers of all times", are not worth the paper the were written on.

Because the next "Tweet"(how silly is that, tbh?), often just minutes later, nullifies everything again.
Who will take anything serious anymore, that comes out of the mouth of Trump?
It´s not even worth to meet and to talk with him, as the world had to learn over the last months.

That´s how it is.




posted on Jul, 12 2018 @ 07:16 AM
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a reply to: ManFromEurope


THAT was hundreds of years ago or in a much minor scale. Your comparison is wrong.


Minor scale... we have been playing at world building for about 70 odd years... yall were at it for hundreds of years before our nation was even born.

Thanks for proving my point, you are a hypocrite yoou refuse to admit the wrongs europe has done to try and claim the moral high ground so you can judge America.

Much of the things we have done wrong we learned from Europe, but sure go ahead and pretend Spain, England, France, Germany, and the Netherlands didnt try to colonize the world, wrecking the nations they invaded.

At least I am willing to admit, America can and should do better, I dont think we are better than Europe... but many europeans I have met over my 4 yr stay certainly think they are better than americans.

Funny thing... every single thing I am routinely told is wrong with America, I have seen here in Europe.


Fine sure whatever... keep on living in fantasy land.



posted on Jul, 12 2018 @ 07:22 AM
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It´s too funny, i ended the comment and had to read this now. Trump suddenly is singing the highest praises to the NATO:
Plötzliches Lob von Trump - "Die Nato ist jetzt eine gut geölte Maschine"

He is turning faster in the wind like Angela Merkel, and that means something!

I mean, is he maybe suffering from schizophrenia? Not to attack him. But wasn´t it yesterday when he "tweetet" against Germany and Merkel, attacked Germany the whole time. But when he met Merkel he was talking about very good relationships to Merkel and Germany?

Something is very wrong with that guy.



posted on Jul, 12 2018 @ 07:30 AM
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a reply to: DerBeobachter


Ohh it’s better than that Trump said they agreed to raise spending but Macron denies this and said they will match the 2% rate they are all targeting



posted on Jul, 12 2018 @ 11:49 AM
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And as predicted the majority of responses here have nothing to do with the OP.



posted on Jul, 12 2018 @ 01:04 PM
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originally posted by: face23785
And as predicted the majority of responses here have nothing to do with the OP.


That is a shame. I was hoping to wake up and have some interesting posts to read.



posted on Jul, 12 2018 @ 01:56 PM
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originally posted by: TycoonBarnaby

originally posted by: face23785
And as predicted the majority of responses here have nothing to do with the OP.


That is a shame. I was hoping to wake up and have some interesting posts to read.


Most of the people who read this are disappointed to find out one of their favorite anti-military talking points is busted. I never expected this to generate any decent discussion. I was just hoping one or two people would find the information enlightening.



posted on Jul, 13 2018 @ 06:58 AM
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German military issues


The problem centers on a specific component, called a "grease nipple," that is part of the system that cools the wingtip pods. Technicians were able to replace the malfunctioning pods, according to Spiegel, but supplies of the component are limited because the primary supplier needs to be recertified after a change in its ownership.

Limited supplies for a problem... not good.

Without that system, the jets aren't able to carry out missions. At the moment, according to the report, only about 10 of German's Typhoons are able to start missions.

Article was from May..

The Luftwaffe's Eurofighter readiness issues are compounded by a lack of air-combat missiles. Because of that shortfall, only four of the fighters are currently ready for combat missions, according to Spiegel.


4 fighters...

We have 50+ year old weapons platforms with a readiness rate of around 90% of the fleet can do its mission on any given day.

Deeper into the article it says Germany says they have 82 flyable euro fighters... but only 4 are capable of shooting back and having their defense systems work.

Since Nato does not have any active mission for them at this moment technically they are in compliance with NATO requirements.


Olaf Scholz, the new finance minister from the CDU's junior coalition partner, the Social Democratic Party, presented a 2018 budget that only offered the Defense Ministry half the money it requested, focusing instead on domestic measures and seeking to avoid additional debt.


With the military getting half the budget they requested the odds of this changing anytime soon seem dim.

So yea.. .I am all for us pulling out of the majority of Europe and bring the assets and money home.

ETA: I chose Germany because if they claim to not have the money to keep readiness levels up, the odds are high other members of nato will have similar "issues".
edit on 13-7-2018 by Irishhaf because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 14 2018 @ 08:40 AM
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originally posted by: Irishhaf
German military issues


The problem centers on a specific component, called a "grease nipple," that is part of the system that cools the wingtip pods. Technicians were able to replace the malfunctioning pods, according to Spiegel, but supplies of the component are limited because the primary supplier needs to be recertified after a change in its ownership.

Limited supplies for a problem... not good.

Without that system, the jets aren't able to carry out missions. At the moment, according to the report, only about 10 of German's Typhoons are able to start missions.

Article was from May..

The Luftwaffe's Eurofighter readiness issues are compounded by a lack of air-combat missiles. Because of that shortfall, only four of the fighters are currently ready for combat missions, according to Spiegel.


4 fighters...

We have 50+ year old weapons platforms with a readiness rate of around 90% of the fleet can do its mission on any given day.

Deeper into the article it says Germany says they have 82 flyable euro fighters... but only 4 are capable of shooting back and having their defense systems work.

Since Nato does not have any active mission for them at this moment technically they are in compliance with NATO requirements.


Olaf Scholz, the new finance minister from the CDU's junior coalition partner, the Social Democratic Party, presented a 2018 budget that only offered the Defense Ministry half the money it requested, focusing instead on domestic measures and seeking to avoid additional debt.


With the military getting half the budget they requested the odds of this changing anytime soon seem dim.

So yea.. .I am all for us pulling out of the majority of Europe and bring the assets and money home.

ETA: I chose Germany because if they claim to not have the money to keep readiness levels up, the odds are high other members of nato will have similar "issues".


Great post highlighting how just having equipment doesn't mean you're ready for action.



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