Socialism Takes Over America... Could it Happen?

a reply to: Edumakated

You can ignore the stupid video all you want but at no time in history has this country had such extreme wealth inequality. Government is the only power strong enough to fight the corporations control over pricing and wages. It's just too bad you don't see it.

a reply to: dfnj2015

Why is it that socialists REFUSE to read these two LAWS?

Amendment IV The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

www.law.cornell.edu...

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States;nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

www.law.cornell.edu...

Don't expect some of us to be nice about having more money taken out of our wallets so that socialists can given it to what ever special interest group they want to buy more stuff.

When I am busy not outsourcing my existence to someone else.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
As usual, we'd have to me talking about actual socialism to have a factual discussion on the topic.

The US has a mixed economy with a social safety net system in place. The markets are free with necessary regulations and controls in place to insure that the public health and welfare is protected.

Much like our Constitutional democratic republic, we have had the best of all possible systems in place politically, economically and with a slow evolution, socially.

As Franklin said "if we can keep it."

There is a slow push left because politicians know they can win elections by promising a chicken in every pot. Our current system slows this progression, but ultimately, it will prevail and be the down fall of the country.

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: dfnj2015
a reply to: Edumakated

This is what I am talking about:

Just because you ignore how bad it is doesn't mean it isn't really bad.

You can post that stupid video 15 billion times. It doesn't change basic economic facts. You can also deflect from the fact you clearly don't know anything about how CEOs wages are determined, stock ownership, and the like.

At no point in history has there ever been wealth equality. EVER.

What you fail to grasp is that while the rich are in fact getting wealthy, more and more people are moving out of poverty and into the middle class as well. Hardly anyone in western society except real losers stays lower income their entire lives. While I have a 1% household income TODAY, 20 years ago I would have been considered poor being I had little to no income.

The vast majority of people who also make it to the top 1% don't even stay in the top 1% either.

Sure, Jeff Bezos has extreme wealth being worth like $100 billion, but he has also created TRILLIONS in wealth for other people. Think of the hundreds of thousands of people he employs. All the ancillary businesses that are thriving because of Amazon - ad agencies, law firms, small businesses, real estate. There is a reason are chomping at the bit to be chosen for Amazon's new headquarters location.

Superstitious nonsense about people moving out of poverty. Contrary to your right wing delusions the facts simple do not support your way of thinking.

Consumer Price Index for All Urban Consumers: Purchasing Power of the Consumer Dollar

a reply to: dfnj2015

You can ignore the stupid video all you want but at no time in history has this country had such extreme wealth inequality.

Since videos are 'facts'.

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: dfnj2015
Don't expect some of us to be nice about having more money taken out of our wallets so that socialists can given it to what ever special interest group they want to buy more stuff.
When I am busy not outsourcing my existence to someone else.

Except spending money on the military is "good" socialism. All military spending is pure socialism.

Guns or butter, choose.

a reply to: dfnj2015

Yep.

And the reason why is that EVERY single person in this country get's a DIRECT benefit from.

As GENERAL WELFARE.

Robbing from the rich so a poor person can get free GMO food where JP MORGAN makes billions off EBT fees ISN'T.

a reply to: neo96

I also heard immigrants can go on welfare and receive $8000 per month plus a new $100,000 car.

All military spending is pure socialism.

If you ignore the billions spent that create millions of middle class TAX PAYING jobs that pay for those socialist delusions.

Introducing NEW WEALTH instead of the law of diminishing return that just recycles wealth.

Since videos are facts...

a reply to: neo96

So you're in favor of the government owning the means of production then?

Socialist.

a reply to: neo96

Why because neo96 says so?

Go look up what a strawman argument is and tell me what it means and you'll see your statement was one.

For socialism to work on any scale, small to large, all the participants have to be unified in the goal. Suppose Neo96, Ketsuko and myself came across a deal for 200 acres of mostly woods. And we decide to pool our money and buy the land outright. So we work it out, build log cabins and furniture, grow crops and hunt the land. We do without electricity and indoor plumbing but are still on the hook to pay property taxes. So after debating and taking stock of what we can do well we decide on making knives. Neo is pounding out blanks, i’m knocking out the handles and finish work and ketsuko is tanning leather making sheaths and felling walnut trees like Paul Bunyan.

Things are going great and we are making some serious bank, except we are running out walnut trees and deer. We have the cash to outsource the walnut and leather but that cuts into steel budget and will reduce knife production to the point of not being able to buy new tooling when they wear out or need replaced which will shut us down completely. And worse, it makes ketsuko a burden to the group because they are not really producing equal work for an equal share. We could diversify by adding furniture to our product line like display cases/boxes or kick ketsuko out of the loop completely.

And that is where socialism breaks down. When outside factors make part of the group a burden on the rest. All because the common goal isn’t commonly met with equal participation. Could have just as easily been Neo getting a bad burn forging or I getting a deep debilitating cut while polishing.

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: dfnj2015

You can ignore the stupid video all you want but at no time in history has this country had such extreme wealth inequality.

Since videos are 'facts'.

Amazing isn't it. Anyone who has traveled outside the US knows how wealthy we are as a country. America really doesn't have what anyone would call extreme poverty. Sure, we have people who are "poor" but the reality is that their standard of living if far above what would be found in any third world country.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Nope.

I'm in favor of not making myself a commodity of the mob.

IE the mob doesn't own me or what I WORK FOR.

a reply to: strongfp

Why do I have to accept socialism?

BECAUSE SOMEONE ELSE says so?

Anything to justify that asinine argument is a strawman.

a reply to: Ahabstar



I am looking at two pieces of property away from everything.

100 Acres and 180.

Gonna use CAPITIALISM to pay for it. Hopefully.

The problem isn't the system that one lives by, but the humans that run the system.
Humans are animals and we are all vulnerable to corruption.

Capitalism has gone too far it seems and now we are like serfs compared to the top 1%.

Socialism has failed in a lot of countries due to the powerful opposition of corporate backed capitalistic strategies.
There's always been a war or at least a cold war going on.

The future of the world will without a doubt be a one world, socialist styled community.
Don't worry, future generations will love it and love the fact that they live in harmony with the earth, the universe and science - their one true god.

They will look back at this blip in history as a small part in "The Great Struggle", that began with Copernicus and ended with the Revolution of 2070.
There will be exhibits at museums that show portly, unshaven humanoids wearing obnoxious red baseball hats and carrying AR10's fighting with black clad, masked ninjas wielding hot pink dildos. Yes it will be entertaining, but also sad and educational.

The future and ideal world will be a non-corrupt form of socialism run by benevolent AI. It will be good, we will design it to be so.

I guess it comes down to two frames of mind:
Conservative - you know that one day the guns will be dinosaurs but you like living in the now and dying for today's world.
Progressive - you know that one day the guns will be dinosaurs and you want to live for the future and die for tomorrows world.

Choose your own adventure.

originally posted by: EmmanuelGoldstein
The problem isn't the system that one lives by, but the humans that run the system.
Humans are animals and we are all vulnerable to corruption.

Capitalism has gone too far it seems and now we are like serfs compared to the top 1%.

Socialism has failed in a lot of countries due to the powerful opposition of corporate backed capitalistic strategies.
There's always been a war or at least a cold war going on.

The future of the world will without a doubt be a one world, socialist styled community.
Don't worry, future generations will love it and love the fact that they live in harmony with the earth, the universe and science - their one true god.

They will look back at this blip in history as a small part in "The Great Struggle", that began with Copernicus and ended with the Revolution of 2070.
There will be exhibits at museums that show portly, unshaven humanoids wearing obnoxious red baseball hats and carrying AR10's fighting with black clad, masked ninjas wielding hot pink dildos. Yes it will be entertaining, but also sad and educational.

The future and ideal world will be a non-corrupt form of socialism run by benevolent AI. It will be good, we will design it to be so.

I guess it comes down to two frames of mind:
Conservative - you know that one day the guns will be dinosaurs but you like living in the now and dying for today's world.
Progressive - you know that one day the guns will be dinosaurs and you want to live for the future and die for tomorrows world.

Choose your own adventure.

What is ironic is that social also creates a 1%. The difference is that unlike with capitalism, the 99% have no chance to make it to the 1%. You'll notice that those who advocate for socialism never actually want to live under it themselves. The elite always find a way to exempt themselves.

You see this all the time with liberals. They advocate for services/benefits for the masses while exempting themselves. This shows you how hypocritical they are and what they really think of their own policies.

Public Schools: Advocate for public schools, but send their kids to private.

Security: Advocate for gun control, but have armed security or live in gated communities

Environment: Advocate for living green, while continuing to have their own massive personal energy footprint with private jets, big houses, etc.

Healthcare: Goverment provided healthcare, but will exempt themselves to the free market.

Anytime you have a system whether communist, socialist, facists, etc. You will still always have elites at the very top who live wealthy and better than everyone else.

Capitalism is the only system that has allowed people the opportunity to move up without regard to birth right or political ideology.

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: strongfp

Why do I have to accept socialism?

BECAUSE SOMEONE ELSE says so?

Anything to justify that asinine argument is a strawman.

That wasn't what is intended to the post you replied to.
And I was stating facts, I wasn't pushing a socialist agenda. Maybe if you relaxed a little and stopped being on edge all the time you'd actually see your comment meant nothing to what I was saying.