Rising conservative star Jordan Peterson in debate: "Athiesm leads to murder"

originally posted by: RAY1990
a reply to: Raggedyman

What's your point man? You're surely reaching...

If you want a simple answer it comes from evolution.

But no. I'm guessing God made those little fishes to clean off the whales and those Greater Honeyguides of Africa were made to serve humans and find them bee hives?

You keep making the assertion that atheists have moral code, if that's the case then no humans have a moral code. Which is a load of none sense. Hell I've seen hungry dogs before and strays that were never taught. Why don't they eat me?

You're missing one fundamental truth to life, all communication and interaction is based upon two things. Food or # off. When an animal knows it's productive to share time, resources and abilities they tend to stick to this paradigm and not betray it. Seemingly this trait is somehow remembered through generations. Because last I heard we are the only animals with an oral tradition and history.

Humans in the most basic of societies still practice banishment and forms of punishment, some of these societies have no god. Why do they follow the generalized "golden rule" system?

I'd say it's because it's in our DNA, it's a part of what makes us who we are. Many animals share this trait, not to say exceptions don't exist because they do. Within individual species this "exception" is usually dealt with one way or another.

Again what's your point?

Naturally learned traits vs artificial traits?

It is definitely an evolutionary phenomenon that manifests in our pain and pleasure centers. It feels good to help people, and it feels bad to hurt people. Of course there are always outliers who do not function the same as the majority of the population.

a reply to: kaylaluv

Which ones are true Christians, and which ones are false Christians, and who gets to decide that?

Lets agree that not all teacher are created equal . Lets imagine one teacher fails to teach clear distinctions about subject matter . Even in the realm of scientific discussion there are lots of disagreements . Lets make it real simple and let the kids decide . Who gets to play with the ball first . Or who gets to have the last cookie . There are disagreements across every subject including Atheism . Do you see a pattern . Its called the human condition which vary's with time and temperament . we aint perfect ,none of us . How could you expect to get a perfect agreement among imperfect humans ...can't be done .

a reply to: Woodcarver

yes, humans wrote that. If you will notice in that definition of the word “endowed “, It does not mention God. But even if it did mention God, it would’ve been a human who wrote it.

Humans write human documents but you need to ask who endowed the humans ? if it was a human then who ?

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
a reply to: kaylaluv

Which ones are true Christians, and which ones are false Christians, and who gets to decide that?

Lets agree that not all teacher are created equal . Lets imagine one teacher fails to teach clear distinctions about subject matter . Even in the realm of scientific discussion there are lots of disagreements . Lets make it real simple and let the kids decide . Who gets to play with the ball first . Or who gets to have the last cookie . There are disagreements across every subject including Atheism . Do you see a pattern . Its called the human condition which vary's with time and temperament . we aint perfect ,none of us . How could you expect to get a perfect agreement among imperfect humans ...can't be done .

why would a God who creates such dire consequences for not believing in him, leave the only evidence of his existence in a book written by anonymous humans over 2000 years ago. When he would obviously know that, it would be translated, mistranslated, and misinterpreted, and then taught to people incorrectly?

It seems nonsensical to believe that anything in that book is anything other than the thoughts of the humans who wrote it down.


Do you believe that God wants you to believe things that don’t make sense?

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
a reply to: Woodcarver

yes, humans wrote that. If you will notice in that definition of the word “endowed “, It does not mention God. But even if it did mention God, it would’ve been a human who wrote it.

Humans write human documents but you need to ask who endowed the humans ? if it was a human then who ?

The answer to that would also be other humans. We have a historical record of all the rules that societies were structured with. We can plainly see the evolution and the fine-tuning of these ideas and how they were implemented to create better or worse societies.

We also see this in other animal Societies. Where do chimpanzees get their moral values? Where do ants get their moral values?

a reply to: Woodcarver

why would a God who creates such dire consequences for not believing in him, leave the only evidence of his existence in a book written by anonymous humans over 2000 years ago. When he would obviously know that, it would be translated, mistranslated, and misinterpreted, and then taught to people incorrectly?

He knew that s#it would happens and despite that chose to allow each person work out their salvation before Him . Its called faith not prof . deal with it , or not

a reply to: Woodcarver



I always liked this, it's simple and generalized but it drives the point elegantly. It's in our nature to nurture.

a reply to: Woodcarver

We also see this in other animal Societies. Where do chimpanzees get their moral values? Where do ants get their moral values?

why do some ducks not fly south for the winter and end up freezing . Why do chimps have territories ? lots of questions and lots of answers ...pick one you like if that makes you happy or dig deeper .

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: kaylaluv

I think you will find the bible very clear on those issues, no interpretation necessary

Sorry, not so clear. For example, Jesus didn’t say anything about homosexuality or same sex marriage - whether it was okay or not okay. Some Christians will tell you his quote about a man and a women leaving their parents and getting married should be interpreted to mean gay marriage is wrong, but it doesn’t clearly say that. It’s an interpretation.

As for science and hard wired brain
I already stated clearly that I believed the brain was hard wired
What I asked for was hard scientific evidence, those links were opinion pieces in scien i.e. Magazines, not science

There are studies referred to in the articles. The articles have references, links, and citations.

I am sorry Kayla but

It's not worth my time
It's all there for you to search out
I don't think you care or want the truth so why should I continue

a reply to: kaylaluv

What the bible might teach and may teach can be two different things because of the context thing . Another aspect is not so much what you are taught but what you are not taught . Having a fuller picture is much better then a half one

a reply to: toysforadults

You have to realize that most of the people who claim atheism are actually luciferians (side note I tried to swipe out luciferians and it came out politicians) . Oh they'll deny it till the cows come home but they are none the less.

Jaden

originally posted by: Masterjaden
a reply to: toysforadults

You have to realize that most of the people who claim atheism are actually luciferians (side note I tried to swipe out luciferians and it came out politicians) . Oh they'll deny it till the cows come home but they are none the less.

Jaden

That's ridiculous.

Atheism is a lack of belief in a god/deity - - period.

They don't replace it with another belief of supernatural.

It's more like Luciferians usurp the word atheist.

"Atheistic" philosophy is not atheism.

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: kaylaluv

I think you will find the bible very clear on those issues, no interpretation necessary

Sorry, not so clear. For example, Jesus didn’t say anything about homosexuality or same sex marriage - whether it was okay or not okay. Some Christians will tell you his quote about a man and a women leaving their parents and getting married should be interpreted to mean gay marriage is wrong, but it doesn’t clearly say that. It’s an interpretation.

As for science and hard wired brain
I already stated clearly that I believed the brain was hard wired
What I asked for was hard scientific evidence, those links were opinion pieces in scien i.e. Magazines, not science

There are studies referred to in the articles. The articles have references, links, and citations.

I am sorry Kayla but

It's not worth my time
It's all there for you to search out
I don't think you care or want the truth so why should I continue

No, you're wrong.

As Kaylaluv says - - the bible is about interpretation.

a reply to: Annee

It's not ridiculous, people lie all the time. Go on the deep web and you'll see how prevalent it is and they fight for the same things proclaimed atheists do.

Jaden

originally posted by: Masterjaden
a reply to: Annee

It's not ridiculous, people lie all the time. Go on the deep web and you'll see how prevalent it is and they fight for the same things proclaimed atheists do.

Jaden

You're wrong.

Atheist has ONE meaning. Lack of belief in a god/deity.

Personal philosophy is personal philosophy.

Usurping atheist to fit your philosophy does not mean you are atheist.

Like the Church of Satan. It was started because LeVey wanted to justify Hedonism. He used atheism - - lack of belief in gods - - to justify his actions.

Atheist/atheism is not a verb - - it has no actions - - it does not justify Hedonism because a man chose to use it that way.

You can be an atheist (lack of belief in gods/deities) - - - and still have beliefs/philosophies - - - but, those are on you. Those are your own personal beliefs/philosophies.

"Atheistic views/philosophies" - - - is NOT atheist. Only "Lack of belief in gods/deities" is atheist.

What's the rub on this guy?

Is he another right wing larper meme character the left made up like Spencer?

I bet he is.

If he is legit, our politically jacked media is choosing to focus on extremists.

Sounds about right for their track record.

I'm glad I don't watch the news. It's a real time-suck.

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
a reply to: Woodcarver

why would a God who creates such dire consequences for not believing in him, leave the only evidence of his existence in a book written by anonymous humans over 2000 years ago. When he would obviously know that, it would be translated, mistranslated, and misinterpreted, and then taught to people incorrectly?

He knew that s#it would happens and despite that chose to allow each person work out their salvation before Him . Its called faith not prof . deal with it , or not

So God is deliberately trying to trick people into NOT believing in him? And only those who will believe in things that have no good reason to be believed will be saved? Somehow? God is rewarding irrational thought?
At least you admit that believing in God’s makes no sense. That is why it requires faith to believe in.

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: kaylaluv

I think you will find the bible very clear on those issues, no interpretation necessary

Sorry, not so clear. For example, Jesus didn’t say anything about homosexuality or same sex marriage - whether it was okay or not okay. Some Christians will tell you his quote about a man and a women leaving their parents and getting married should be interpreted to mean gay marriage is wrong, but it doesn’t clearly say that. It’s an interpretation.

As for science and hard wired brain
I already stated clearly that I believed the brain was hard wired
What I asked for was hard scientific evidence, those links were opinion pieces in scien i.e. Magazines, not science

There are studies referred to in the articles. The articles have references, links, and citations.

I am sorry Kayla but

It's not worth my time
It's all there for you to search out
I don't think you care or want the truth so why should I continue

Why do you continue to start a discussion only to run off when you are presented with very good arguments against your beliefs about imaginary beings?

Belief in God does not make sense. That is why you claim it takes faith to believe in it?

originally posted by: Masterjaden
a reply to: toysforadults

You have to realize that most of the people who claim atheism are actually luciferians (side note I tried to swipe out luciferians and it came out politicians) . Oh they'll deny it till the cows come home but they are none the less.

Jaden

Who cares if some atheists are luciferians? That has nothing to do with what atheists are, and what makes a person an atheist.

I’ve never actually met a luciferian. Out of all of the atheists that I know, none of them meet the standard of Luciferian. Most of them are secular humanitarians if you want to put a label on things. A luciferian is something very specific. They are people who practice very specific sets of beliefs. And as far as I can tell there are only a few pockets scattered around the world and usually in big cities . And I say sets of beliefs, because even those people do not have a consistent worldview.

originally posted by: Pyle

originally posted by: Teikiatsu
This seems rather oversimplified. It doesn't sound like he said any atheist would become a murderer simply because they are an atheist.

What I got from the video was that Peterson said a *genuine* atheist would be able to rationalize a "perfect" murder on a terrible person because they had convinced themselves that there would be no metaphysical consequences and it would be for "the greater good."

Which is a dumb argument because religions have done this very thing many times over but believed they would be free form metaphysical consequences.

But we aren't talking about religions, now are we? We're talking about a person who rejects religion.

My belief: People will find a way to rationalize murder if they need to make themselves feel better about it. See? Simple. No need to try and deflect to religion or other organizations.