Why are American people so hung up on women having abortions ?

a reply to: richapau

Actually science tells me it's the termination of a human life.

I've noticed that people who say abortion is "no big deal" were never aborted.

originally posted by: Teikiatsu
I've noticed that people who say abortion is "no big deal" were never aborted.

Well you know children are hereditary. If your parents never had kids you won't either.

originally posted by: intrepid

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: intrepid

Then why are we talking about whether it impacts me since you agree it's meaningless?

I'm pointing out that both this issue and your ridiculous scenario aren't affecting you. You're projecting your belief on others. I'm of the opinion everyone should just mind their own f'n business.

Not having come into this discussion until this point, I could point out there are a lot of laws that most people would be unwilling to do away even though they don't have an impact on us directly.

Murder and rape or theft laws generally don't ... right up until you become a victim of those crimes. Even then, wider society has no real interest because that crime only impacts you, right? What does your neighbor or some random idiot in the next town over care if your person or property was violated in some way?

The answer is that he doesn't.

Of course, what it comes down to is that our foundational law recognizes that people have the basic inalienable right to both their persons and property. Where people get caught up on this issue is that some people would like to conveniently refuse to assign personhood to people inside the womb, and yes, it is very much a matter of convenience.

There is a concerted effort in society to decouple sex and procreation because it is preferable to think of sex solely as an expression of pleasure and affection between two (or more in some cases) persons and not as a vehicle by which the species multiplies itself through the production of new individuals, new *persons.*

It is the push to abdicate a fundamental responsibility essentially.

originally posted by: intrepid

originally posted by: Teikiatsu
I've noticed that people who say abortion is "no big deal" were never aborted.

Well you know children are hereditary. If your parents never had kids you won't either.

Actually, his parents (the ones who raised him) *didn't* have him.

originally posted by: Teikiatsu
I've noticed that people who say abortion is "no big deal" were never aborted.

Strawman.

Next?

a reply to: ketsuko

When does a fertilized egg become a human being?

I look for consistency when it comes to moral issues such as these.

If scientists found a bundle of cells on a distant planet, they would label it life. How is that different from the cells in a womb?

If someone kills a pregnant woman, do they get charged with killing an infant as well? If that baby in the womb isn't a life, then should this hypothetical killer be charged with only one count of murder?

Also, if people claim to be pro life, they should oppose the death penalty.

As a society, we should set the example that we're better than murderers and we will not stoop to their level.

Whether it be abortion, murder or even the death penalty, when you decide whether a living person should live or die based on how it may inconvenience you, that is evil.

The only grey area in all this is a war like, it's either me or them moment of self defense.

Nobody is "hung up" on it. It is a disgusting and despicable genocidal practice. That said, I couldn't care less about your wedge issues nor will I let you make the 2016 election about abortion/illegals.

Our concern is liberty, small government, greatly decreased taxes, greatly decreased/totally eliminated government involvement in our private lives, destroying large/bloated/useless departments of government, free speech, total and absolute gun rights, restoring the SCOTUS with originalists who will utterly defeat and destroy the socialists/subversives like we've done to MS13 and illegals, and defeating your unwanted mob-rule direct democracy (the only word never mentioned in the US Constitution)

Article 4 Section 4: (paraphrased) Each state will have a Republican form of government

NOT a democratic one.



(but if you could stop advocating for the needless death of unborn children that'd be excellent. There are a handful of valid medical reasons, but if you aren't ready for children you shouldn't be procreating. Period)

a reply to: Gryphon66

At what point can a scientist test its DNA and tell you it's not a human being?

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: Teikiatsu
I've noticed that people who say abortion is "no big deal" were never aborted.

Strawman.

Next?

How. Explain.

a reply to: Psilocyborg

Actually, they could. A single cell is a living thing. Look at a prokaryotic bacterium, and given our hunger to find life on other planets, they very much would.

a reply to: Gryphon66

I don't want to argue the semantics. Legally, abortion is permitted so arguing against it a waste of time. No need to overturn Roe v. Wade, despite the fact I find the practice absolutely disgusting.

I have two adult daughters, and god forbid if one of them had a medical issue (or even made a bad choice) I don't want them using a coat hanger to kill themselves or injure themselves. I hate abortion, but I would support my daughters no matter what happened.

Regardless, no use in fighting things that are already settled matters. Just as gun rights are a settled matter and free speech as well.

Time to move on to more productive things, including reducing the size/impact/power of government (especially in our individual lives) and ensuring our Constitution is read in the original sense it was written. This will mean fighting to overturn patently unconstitutional laws (that violate both the 2nd and 14th amendment of the Constitution) the NFA and GCA.

a reply to: Gryphon66

I would say at the moment fertilization is complete. Maybe you can define what a human being is if you disagree.

a reply to: JBurns

Exactly why I am pro choice. Abortion is a necessary medical procedure. It kills another human being, sometimes that's needed.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Exactly why I am pro choice. Abortion is a necessary medical procedure.

As much as it hurts me to admit it, I am as well. There are times it is necessary. Is it always necessary? Perhaps not, but that isn't my place (or ESPECIALLY the government's place) to insert themselves into a private citizen's healthcare decisions

It kills another human being, sometimes that's needed.

Sadly that is also true, doesn't make it hurt any less (including for the people getting the procedure done - if they have a heart/conscience)

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: richapau

Actually science tells me it's the termination of a human life.

Nope. It's the termination of a gestating embryo/fetus mid development.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

And how many "human beings" did you kill with jerking off?

Millions?
Billions?
Trillions?

Any educated guess?

a reply to: JBurns

Regardless, no use in fighting things that are already settled matters. Just as gun rights are a settled matter and free speech as well.

It's not settled as long as you have the President promising to appoint judges who will work to overturn Roe V Wade. It's not settled when you have VP Pence promising to make abortion illegal. It's not settled while you have state legislatures looking for ways to ban abortion in their prospective states.

Complacency is not good for liberty and freedom is never given freely, it has to be fought for, over and over again.

a reply to: musicismagic

Personally I find this to be an important issue because I feel that it is sick and disgusting for a government to use the Constitution and our laws to regulate human bodies.

I like freedom. It's that simple.