GAO report says DoD must learn why pilots leave for commercial airlines

www.stripes.com...

The military needs to get a better handle on why pilots are leaving the military and how many are leaving for jobs with commercial airlines, a new Government Accountability Office report said.

The report, which was released Thursday, comes as the Air Force, Marine Corps and Navy grapple with a pilot shortage, especially in the fighter pilot community, where there are shortages as high as 27 percent, according to the GAO.

In addition, the DoD should determine why water is wet.
/s

Oh this is easy, jackass DOD people...


27% DONT WANT TO KILL PEOPLE.


Alright boys, now just pay me $500 and I just saved you roughly $821,384 dollars for the crapshoot "study" those jokers over there were about to run up.

Money

a reply to: IgnoranceIsntBlisss

Nope. Not really. Has far, far more to do with $$$.

Commercial pilots get paid way, way, waaaay more than AF pilots or naval aviators.

The gov in general is facing the problem they can't get the best skilled because they don't pay even remotely comparable salaries.

Maybe because it costs like 60k to get your commercial and the training is payed for by tax payers instead of the pilot?

The pay and schedule is probably better too.

Not rocket surgery DODumbarsses

Maybe they could do one final study on the amount of money wasted on studies.

The pilot in the article did 22 years. He got a pension. Time to double dip as some people say. I think two decades is plenty of service.

Regarding killing people, it is a volunteer service. The USAF breaks things and kills people. You should know before you join.

A big problem with military jobs is the transfers. Tough to get equity in a house when you move every three years.

a reply to: gariac

I know people in government are not the smartest. But this is a new low in stupidity.

They joined for the free education. They left because the pay was higher. How stupid does someone have to be to not understand basic math?

The chance that anyone here is actually smarter or knows better than what the government is studying here is basically zero.

It's important to study the reasons in great detail, so that accurate/precise measures can be taken to combat them. If you do not have the in-depth understanding first and then implement measures based on the study, then you risk implementing the wrong measures, and therefore wasting a tremendous amount of money that would likely be many times (maybe a thousand times?) more costly than the study itself.

The full report is here.

Honestly I do not like talking about what stripes has written about the report, when the report is publically available.

a reply to: gariac

Ha!

Money, Money, Money....


Google commercial airline pay:

The 2018 median annual commercial airline pilot salary is $130,059. Half of all pilots earn less than this amount and half earn more. Salaries range from a low of $112,657 to as much as $146,834.Jun 7, 2018



When factoring in bonuses and additional compensation, a O3 - Air Force - Captain at US Air Force can expect to make an average total pay of $84,164 . See all O3 - Air Force - Captain salaries to learn how this stacks up in the market.3 days ago

Airlines pilots have a seniority system where the pilots with the most hours get first dibs on the preferred routes. It's actually the short haul flights that are preferred over the long-haul international flights. There was one senior pilot who had the Hawaii to Las Vegas route, twice a day, 8am and 6pm. Basically flying business people to and from the islands every day.
Junior pilots would have to do the Los Angeles to Paris run. Which because they were younger was a novelty, but once they have a family the short routes are preferred.

originally posted by: watchitburn
Money

737 pilot with a major carrier can make 25,000 a month if they are willing to bust their butt. The money increases with 757, 767, and anything else bigger.. When I worked I never bid a line of time that did not have at least 18 days a month off.. Of course that took years of seniority... Junior bird men are lucky to get 10 days a month off on reserve and never know where they are going until they get the call..

Presently the world over has a qualified pilot shortage

Add work schedule which comes with seniority "ie" Work 3 days a week, coffee and even a meal during a flight..no one shooting at you or having to put up with some idiot who thinks he owns you.. Yep if DOD is that stupid then Houston/Washington we have a problem..

oh i wonder why pilots leave the military?

could it be things like a lot more income. better benefits like healthcare. much more stable work hours and the ability for a family to not have to move around the world all the time. the ability to stay in "reserve" and make even more money, plus still get to fly air force birds. much more comfortable workspaces, especially for spending long hours in the air. like actually being able to get up, and even a pretty much proper toilet, plus the ability to actually have decent meals, as well as beverages while in the air. none of the military BS to have to deal with, like saluting.


seriously if they want to retain more pilots these are the things they need to deal with to compete. especially when it comes to pay, benefits, and family circumstances. and if they give such things to pilots, they would really have to do the same across the entire military. for example if a civilian pilot receives $25,000/month plus good benefits. and then the air force to competes gives the same wage and benefits for the same amount of flying. then a captain in the army also deserves to be paid the same as a captain in the air force, for equal time spent working. which unfortunately is a rather unrealistic expectation. just paying the pilots that much would cause a huge increase in the military budget, far, far bigger if they extended that equal pay across the military. and truthfully, the military fully deserve to be paid MORE than their civilian counterparts, considering that they are quite literally putting their lives on the line. it really is an unwinnable situation.

When you are young you want the F16

When you get a little older, you want the Gulfstream.

Maybe a P51 for pleasure on the side when the itch is there. Otherwise I can see the crotch rocket wow factor fading as a pilot may get older and just want to fly something more comfy and under different circumstances.

Its not just money from the airlines causing these people to leave but the hours requirements for commercial pilots. Military is the cheapest way for alot of people to get the hours they need. Soon as they get the hours they punch out.

originally posted by: generik
oh i wonder why pilots leave the military?

could it be things like a lot more income. better benefits like healthcare. much more stable work hours and the ability for a family to not have to move around the world all the time. the ability to stay in "reserve" and make even more money, plus still get to fly air force birds. much more comfortable workspaces, especially for spending long hours in the air. like actually being able to get up, and even a pretty much proper toilet, plus the ability to actually have decent meals, as well as beverages while in the air. none of the military BS to have to deal with, like saluting.


seriously if they want to retain more pilots these are the things they need to deal with to compete. especially when it comes to pay, benefits, and family circumstances. and if they give such things to pilots, they would really have to do the same across the entire military. for example if a civilian pilot receives $25,000/month plus good benefits. and then the air force to competes gives the same wage and benefits for the same amount of flying. then a captain in the army also deserves to be paid the same as a captain in the air force, for equal time spent working. which unfortunately is a rather unrealistic expectation. just paying the pilots that much would cause a huge increase in the military budget, far, far bigger if they extended that equal pay across the military. and truthfully, the military fully deserve to be paid MORE than their civilian counterparts, considering that they are quite literally putting their lives on the line. it really is an unwinnable situation.

There were plans to move pilots to flying drones. That avoided the need to go abroad. They had a shift pattern. But the problem was that even being a drone pilot still involved killing other people even if remotely.

a reply to: stormcell

Like I said, if you join the military, you will be breaking things or killing people. The problem with drone warfare is the "signature strike." Some target fits a pattern...they get whacked. Convoy of Hilux...whack 'em. Except once in a while it was a convoy going to a wedding or buying food.

Those Hellfires could take 30 seconds to hit a target. Often a kid would wander into the kill zone.

I could see the job being a strain.

I bet a commercial pilot gets a lot of respect. I certainty give them props.

a reply to: IgnoranceIsntBlisss

Actually I would say the private sector pays more is why.

Money is a big piece of the puzzle no doubt, also though most of the pilots I have known and worked with or flown with just wanted to fly.

As the USAF continues to slim down they are forcing these people that just want to fly to spend more and more time in an office managing people.

Also many pilots are not exactly Politically correct, the USAF is becoming more and more politically correct so by staying they put their future earnings at greater risk so most are now getting the bare minimum of hours needed to be able to make the jump to the civilian world.


I have nearly 20 years in the USAF and I would tell my son if he was old enough today to not join the USAF, it is a train wreck right now.

originally posted by: Irishhaf
Money is a big piece of the puzzle no doubt, also though most of the pilots I have known and worked with or flown with just wanted to fly.

As the USAF continues to slim down they are forcing these people that just want to fly to spend more and more time in an office managing people.

Also many pilots are not exactly Politically correct, the USAF is becoming more and more politically correct so by staying they put their future earnings at greater risk so most are now getting the bare minimum of hours needed to be able to make the jump to the civilian world.


I have nearly 20 years in the USAF and I would tell my son if he was old enough today to not join the USAF, it is a train wreck right now.

Not to mention when someone has 16 or 17 years in and gets cut (RIF, reduction in force)... I have known many who were majors that did not make lieutenant colonel or even Captains who did not make Major and got the old RIF notice 3 years before they were legally ready to retire. In the old days it was a get "out of here some of money" and pack your bags..

Some of those guys were pissed to say the least.

I spent 8.5 years flying in the service (4 years in S.E. Asia) and when Vietnam fell I hung up my guns for uncle sugar.. Never have I ever regretted that decision. Service was darn good to me but others unfortunately can not say the same.