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Is Trump the forest or the tree?

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posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 11:42 AM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: loam
Both ideologies have their idiots. And those idiots are screwing it up for all of us. The Founders didn't want common men to be allowed to vote because they knew there were a lot of really short sighted morons in humanity. Its hard to argue with them.


No doubt.

But with state of the media, you have to wonder whether we're dealing with something quite new and irreparable.

Hard to even see where we might be 10 years from now. I can't say I've ever felt that before.




posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 11:47 AM
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a reply to: loam

Please tell me whats 'the left'?
The Left (die Linke) in Germany is a party (9,2 percent - election 2017).



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 11:48 AM
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a reply to: Slinki

He is the monkey that keeps the forest awake!



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 11:52 AM
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a reply to: loam

A problem is what's good for the goose is good for the gander. Some on 'The Right' have injected a good few new ad-homs since they began to back Trump. Snowflake, cuck, TDS, libtards, SJWs etc. It hasn't created a climate of discussion; it's moulded a divided culture that's experienced equally on both (or all) sides.

Because you lean right, you only perceive the attacks from 'The Left.' Even your argument here presupposes the blame all lying with 'the Left.' How about the idea that either side has proponents of hysterical hatred?

Let's be honest and contemplate the great likelihood that Clinton would be attracting very similar hysteria from 'the Right' if she was POTUS. Neither side has the moral higher ground although it's fair to say the majority of each side aren't the ones throwing # at each other - it's a fringe activity for partisan extremists imo.

It's also my opinion that divisive, negative politics have become a major part of how people interact today. Despite all that, I 100% share your concerns that the anger (both sides) won't dissipate in the future. What happens then?



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 12:06 PM
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originally posted by: Kandinsky
a reply to: loam

Because you lean right, you only perceive the attacks from 'The Left.' Even your argument here presupposes the blame all lying with 'the Left.' How about the idea that either side has proponents of hysterical hatred?


Not really fair to claim I only perceive the attacks from the left. My posting history on these boards demonstrate enough that I've called out the BS in the other direction. And I also agree that BOTH sides have their proponents of hysterical hatred.

But what I think we have not seen before is the scale of the MSM and political leadership happily bathing in this level of hysteria.

We've moved from attacking political positions...to attacking the moral character of politicians for holding those positions...to demonizing the people who support those politicians.



It's also my opinion that divisive, negative politics have become a major part of how people interact today. Despite all that, I 100% share your concerns that the anger (both sides) won't dissipate in the future. What happens then?


Exactly.



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 12:15 PM
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Watch what happens when a Democrat gets into office. You think Obama was bad? It's nothing compared to what's coming when that happens. And it will happen, it's only a matter of time before the pendulum swings the other way again. Each swing will continue getting more and more intense and people will gladly put their energy behind each swing.

You think Trump supporters will play nice? Hell no, they'll just revert to the same exact things the left is doing right now and won't feel one bit hypocritical about it either.
edit on 6/22/2018 by 3NL1GHT3N3D1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 12:16 PM
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a reply to: loam

Yeah, sorry for swashing you down with a broad brush there. I retract the comment.


It's certainly been repellent to see the MSM so easily used by political parties to shape the electorate. Sickening to see how they've eagerly chosen political bias and favours over anything else. I know that's a feature of the popular press since it began, but it seems to have shed the pretence entirely.

It's a symptom of the MSM seeing people dehumanising their opposites. People think for themselves and we've somehow lost that awareness in all the rush to #talk those with different ideologies.

All the best Loam.



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 12:25 PM
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a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Must mean the only answer is to vote independent, or Libertarian



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 12:30 PM
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a reply to: Kandinsky



We completely agree with one another.



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 01:10 PM
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a reply to: Kandinsky

Not a new phenomena, Edward R Murrow framed his shows most notably against Joe McCarthy. Murrow was a friend of Roosevelt, Truman and JFK made him head of USIA (US media propaganda) in 1961. Incredible irony since VOA and USIA/State Department by extension was a common target of McCarthy for harboring communists.



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 01:31 PM
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DJT is what I would call, a Common Sense Republican. He has a talent for examining an issue and understanding what needs to be done to fix it........UNDER BUDGET AND ON TIME!

But, he is constantly faced with stupid political games and stupid politicians. I think he has a lot of heart which has probably developed with time and experience. It is a tricky balancing act to implement solutions with necessary action and also heart, but, imo, he has this unique ability.



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 01:31 PM
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a reply to: oloufo

Trump’s greatest sin is that he switched parties and became a Republican. Then again, so did Hillary after the 1968 GOP Convention.



posted on Jun, 22 2018 @ 01:36 PM
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a reply to: loam

Excellent question!
Personally, I think the left will continue exactly as they are now.
No solutions, just yell about the problem.

Have they offered any solution to the problem they see now? Why would that change. They are a party of victims. Remove the victim and where we they fi d their base?



posted on Jun, 23 2018 @ 08:48 AM
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a reply to: loam

Trump is a manipulator. He knew there was a notable and vocal movement of racist apologists in the United States, as well as an amorphous movement of people of an anti-intellectual persuasion. He also knew that if he could frame some lies in certain ways, that he could mobilise both these groups into a cohesive unit. By being publicly dumb about things, and framing policy in the most hamfisted ways possible, he reinforces the notion that smart is dumb, and dumb is smart, thus fluffing the egos of the drooling halfwits out there, who always thought they had the answers, but never did.

By cementing his station as a hard man, by way of making the lives of the vulnerable harder, as has been his habit, he also makes the rampant white supremacists hot under the collar for him, especially when he spouts anti-immigrant rhetoric (despite the fact that the amount of immigration into the US is almost exclusively the fault of the US itself, not the nations from which people are coming, and despite his habit of employing immigrants, over and above people from the US originally).

So Trump is and would be a problem, regardless of what movements he latched onto for a support base. He will lift and drop any tool he needs to achieve his avaricious aims, and that makes him dangerous to the United States of America, because if history has taught us anything, ends do not justify either themselves, or the means by which they are achieved. Noble things are done by noble methods, period. If there is some moral objection to an action which supports a given end result, even when weighed against all the variables, then the chances are that the ends should not be achieved. For example, going to war because you want more oil money is an evil end, and any means you use to achieve it are automatically invalidated by the ends sought. Also, if your intention is going to war to protect lives, then you do not do it with air strikes and mass invasion, because doing so poses greater risk to life than leaving things as they are, which is an example of ends being invalidated by totally and completely improper means.

However, there is a bigger problem than Trump, and that comes in the shape of the movements which most rabidly support him, those being the white supremacist movements and Nazi sympathisers out there, as well as the people who have deliberately and wilfully remained ignorant of certain scientific and sociological realities, in order to feel better about maintaining their selfish manner of going about their lives, a manner of living which denies future children the right to grow up in a lush, healthy ecosystem, by insisting on being permitted to over use fossil products, regardless of the immediate or long term costs to the planet and our ability as a species to live on it.

He is not the forest or the trees... but he is the fungus which grows on idiots and makes them feel like geniuses.



posted on Jun, 27 2018 @ 10:52 PM
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originally posted by: loam


Over the past couple of months, I've slowly begun to realize something about the state of politics in the US-- or at least something about the direction of the left. As the political rhetoric continues to explode into daily extremes I've never seen before, you have to wonder where all of this Trump hate will go, long after he's gone?

In other words, do cooler heads prevail after the dust settles, when he's finally out? Or does every future Republican president get the Trump treatment from here on out?

Just curious what others think...

Is Trump the forest or the tree?


He's the tree.

That said, I think that the children of the Baby Boomers aren't going to tolerate this. The problem there is that they aren't a majority. This is their last stand...it just sucks that we have to live through it.

-Or-

This is classism asserting itself and applying Bernays everywhere.



posted on Jun, 27 2018 @ 10:56 PM
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originally posted by: Martin75
Have they offered any solution to the problem they see now?


Yes. They have. They even applied some of those solutions in the past decade. And then the GOP took it all back.

Why don't you talk about that?




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