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The situation on the southern border makes me sick.

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posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:03 PM
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originally posted by: Wayfarer
I'll never tire of coming to ATS to find all the folks that gleefully endorse sequestering/imprisoning/harming children.

Its like a hyperbolic parody of evil.

If a law says 'zero tolerance, children must be imprisoned', is it better to follow the law, or follow your conscious?

Do any of y'all think GOD will reward you for following one over the other?


A huge difference between being detained/taken care of and imprisoned. I say let the children stay with the parents, just expedite the rout out of here back to where they came from. We should not be hosting them for more than a 24 hour period.




posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:03 PM
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originally posted by: conspiracy nut
Trumpsters have turned into Vulcans all logic no emotion. Yet their logic has been hijacked by fear and a resistance to change. Trump wants to make America great again, by isolating us and pissing off all of our allies and talking up dictators like Putin and Kim. The scary part is his supporters will support him to the gallows.


I suppose the acceptable alternatives are war with Russia and NK (China by proxie), and committing yet another about face to remain embroiled in the worlds affairs after everyone wishing we'd stop being the world police?



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:04 PM
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originally posted by: MrRCflying

originally posted by: Wayfarer
I'll never tire of coming to ATS to find all the folks that gleefully endorse sequestering/imprisoning/harming children.

Its like a hyperbolic parody of evil.

If a law says 'zero tolerance, children must be imprisoned', is it better to follow the law, or follow your conscious?

Do any of y'all think GOD will reward you for following one over the other?


A huge difference between being detained/taken care of and imprisoned. I say let the children stay with the parents, just expedite the rout out of here back to where they came from. We should not be hosting them for more than a 24 hour period.


Sure, keeping the kids with the parents is absolutely reasonable. The people in power expressly don't want that though, and I assume you support them?



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:06 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer




How many innocent immigrants actually seeking asylum for valid reasons do you think are an acceptable sacrifice in America's new stance on immigration/deportation (with the understanding that by denying them they we are sending them back to their deaths)? Is it worthwhile that we send 10 innocent immigrants back to hellhole's so that we catch the 1 who's trying to sneak into the USA for some nefarious purpose?


There are legal ways of seeking asylum.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:06 PM
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originally posted by: Wayfarer
I'll never tire of coming to ATS to find all the folks that gleefully endorse sequestering/imprisoning/harming children.

Its like a hyperbolic parody of evil.

If a law says 'zero tolerance, children must be imprisoned', is it better to follow the law, or follow your conscious?

Do any of y'all think GOD will reward you for following one over the other?


Remember when the German guards in the concentration camps tried to use the "we were ordered" defense after the war, and how well it worked for them?

There will be hell to pay when all this is done too, and anyone making excuses for being ordered to do it, or following someone else's law to do it will end up in the same boat. We are human and we know the difference between good and evil; and no matter what someone, anyone, tells us what to do -- we should have it in us to say that it's wrong and we won't be part of it.
edit on 19-6-2018 by Kharron because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:07 PM
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originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: MrRCflying

Don't believe any of it. They would use children to further their politics long before they care about actual children.

Note how those who are to blame are the ones maintaining the sovereignty of their country, and those who are caring for the children while their parents are punished for breaking federal laws. Meanwhile the people who risked the lives of their own children, who put them in this situation, are to face zero repercussions for doing so.


How many innocent immigrants actually seeking asylum for valid reasons do you think are an acceptable sacrifice in America's new stance on immigration/deportation (with the understanding that by denying them they we are sending them back to their deaths)? Is it worthwhile that we send 10 innocent immigrants back to hellhole's so that we catch the 1 who's trying to sneak into the USA for some nefarious purpose?


Should Mexico or South American countries remain perpetual hellholes?



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:08 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: DBCowboy

Do you really need a citation, seeing how Trump and Session's "no tolerance" policy is brand NEW, and shocking the hell out of the world?


Out of curiosity, have you read the memo?

The memo doesn't even touch the issue about detention or separating families. If you keep citing the memo ("policy") about seeking out appropriate criminal charges for people breaking the law in the context that it forces family separation, people might start thinking that you don't understand what you're talking about.

"Might."



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:10 PM
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a reply to: Kharron

Most do. The lack of agents coming forward is quite telling in my opinion.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:11 PM
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originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: MrRCflying

originally posted by: Wayfarer
I'll never tire of coming to ATS to find all the folks that gleefully endorse sequestering/imprisoning/harming children.

Its like a hyperbolic parody of evil.

If a law says 'zero tolerance, children must be imprisoned', is it better to follow the law, or follow your conscious?

Do any of y'all think GOD will reward you for following one over the other?


A huge difference between being detained/taken care of and imprisoned. I say let the children stay with the parents, just expedite the rout out of here back to where they came from. We should not be hosting them for more than a 24 hour period.


Sure, keeping the kids with the parents is absolutely reasonable. The people in power expressly don't want that though, and I assume you support them?


If you are asking if I support Trump, yes, I do.

I do however think that the process is too slow. Process them, send them back. Breaking into another country because you came from a "hellhole" is not a reason. Plenty of people live in "hellholes" in the US and make due just fine. Some even take personal responsibility (imagine that) to rise above it and make something of themselves. I can't break into the mansion up on the hill and start living there, because I think my house is a "hellhole". If they are scared for their lives, move to a better part of the country they are from. There is lots of room outside the crime ridden cities. Other people there seem to find a way, and a lot have good lives. If they still want to come to the US, apply legally. I would welcome them with open arms.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:12 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Wayfarer




How many innocent immigrants actually seeking asylum for valid reasons do you think are an acceptable sacrifice in America's new stance on immigration/deportation (with the understanding that by denying them they we are sending them back to their deaths)? Is it worthwhile that we send 10 innocent immigrants back to hellhole's so that we catch the 1 who's trying to sneak into the USA for some nefarious purpose?


There are legal ways of seeking asylum.


Some have gone to the border, entered the border patrol station, and requested Asylum. Being the 'legal' way, I take it you would be against those families having their children forcibly removed from them?



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:12 PM
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Food for thought.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:13 PM
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originally posted by: Wardaddy454
a reply to: Kharron

Most do. The lack of agents coming forward is quite telling in my opinion.


Well, most people country wide know the difference. However the fringe opinions on websites such as this one are still concerning, as it's more than it used to be a few years ago. Even though it's a minority still, it's on the rise. That's not good.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:14 PM
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originally posted by: MrRCflying

originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: MrRCflying

originally posted by: Wayfarer
I'll never tire of coming to ATS to find all the folks that gleefully endorse sequestering/imprisoning/harming children.

Its like a hyperbolic parody of evil.

If a law says 'zero tolerance, children must be imprisoned', is it better to follow the law, or follow your conscious?

Do any of y'all think GOD will reward you for following one over the other?


A huge difference between being detained/taken care of and imprisoned. I say let the children stay with the parents, just expedite the rout out of here back to where they came from. We should not be hosting them for more than a 24 hour period.


Sure, keeping the kids with the parents is absolutely reasonable. The people in power expressly don't want that though, and I assume you support them?


If you are asking if I support Trump, yes, I do.

I do however think that the process is too slow. Process them, send them back. Breaking into another country because you came from a "hellhole" is not a reason. Plenty of people live in "hellholes" in the US and make due just fine. Some even take personal responsibility (imagine that) to rise above it and make something of themselves. I can't break into the mansion up on the hill and start living there, because I think my house is a "hellhole". If they are scared for their lives, move to a better part of the country they are from. There is lots of room outside the crime ridden cities. Other people there seem to find a way, and a lot have good lives. If they still want to come to the US, apply legally. I would welcome them with open arms.


Do you yourself come from a hellhole, or have you ever had to flee for your safety? I should hope you answer yes to those questions, because to espouse an opinion on them without having had an inkling of the experience that you are railing against smacks in the face of all reasonable logic.

Furthermore, while you don't think children should be separated from their parents, apparently the sum measure of your displeasure is what you're sharing with us on ATS, since by your admission you still gleefully support the people who are doing it, thereby making you part of the machine that's causing your displeasure in this situation.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:14 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer




Some have gone to the border, entered the border patrol station, and requested Asylum. Being the 'legal' way, I take it you would be against those families having their children forcibly removed from them?


There is no crime when someone enters a country legally.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:15 PM
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originally posted by: Wardaddy454

originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: MrRCflying

Don't believe any of it. They would use children to further their politics long before they care about actual children.

Note how those who are to blame are the ones maintaining the sovereignty of their country, and those who are caring for the children while their parents are punished for breaking federal laws. Meanwhile the people who risked the lives of their own children, who put them in this situation, are to face zero repercussions for doing so.


How many innocent immigrants actually seeking asylum for valid reasons do you think are an acceptable sacrifice in America's new stance on immigration/deportation (with the understanding that by denying them they we are sending them back to their deaths)? Is it worthwhile that we send 10 innocent immigrants back to hellhole's so that we catch the 1 who's trying to sneak into the USA for some nefarious purpose?


Should Mexico or South American countries remain perpetual hellholes?


Goodness no, but unfortunately many here on ATS (and a little under half the country) doesn't believe its the US's job to fix other places.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:18 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Wayfarer




Some have gone to the border, entered the border patrol station, and requested Asylum. Being the 'legal' way, I take it you would be against those families having their children forcibly removed from them?


There is no crime when someone enters a country legally.


I think you're having trouble grasping what I'm asking, so I'll posit it another way:

Lets list the facts:
-Children are being forcibly removed from their parents while their immigration status is determined
-This is occurring whether they walk into the immigration office of their own volition or being brought in by ICE/customs

What you have intimated so far is that there is nothing wrong with separating families (even when they haven't committed a crime), since those that walked in and asked for Asylum probably aren't going to get it anyways, and therefore have entered illegally (by proxy) and deserve to have their children taken from them.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:19 PM
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Congress doesn’t want to pass a law preventing the separation of family members at the border because there would be other things in there that they don’t want to give a win to the other side. Kids be dammed.

Trump wants the other things and would give them this as a win if they agreed to other things.

If there is one person that doesn’t believe both sides are using this situation to their advantage then let it be known far and wide that you are an idiot.

This is a game. Both sides are playing chicken to see who folds first. Guard the freakin’ border, pass a law to put these people on a return trip within 24 if they cross illegally, staff embassies with enough people to make imagration a little easier, give the dreamers immunity, and move on. It’s not that hard we just can’t stand to agree with each other any more or the damn tv ratings would go down.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:21 PM
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a reply to: Kharron

I'm willing to bet most of it is a response to strangers telling other strangers they are racist Nazis that have no compassion without even knowing that person.



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:24 PM
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originally posted by: Wardaddy454
a reply to: Kharron

I'm willing to bet most of it is a response to strangers telling other strangers they are racist Nazis that have no compassion without even knowing that person.



Hmmm ... is that kind of like strangers telling other strangers they are gutless Communists that have no work ethics without even knowing that person?



posted on Jun, 19 2018 @ 02:24 PM
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a reply to: Wayfarer




I think you're having trouble grasping what I'm asking, so I'll posit it another way:

Lets list the facts:
-Children are being forcibly removed from their parents while their immigration status is determined
-This is occurring whether they walk into the immigration office of their own volition or being brought in by ICE/customs

What you have intimated so far is that there is nothing wrong with separating families (even when they haven't committed a crime), since those that walked in and asked for Asylum probably aren't going to get it anyways, and therefore have entered illegally (by proxy) and deserve to have their children taken from them.


Well yes, if children are being separated from parents, their parents jailed after entering a legal point of entry, that is unjust. Can you show me an example of this?
edit on 19-6-2018 by LesMisanthrope because: (no reason given)




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