A minimum-wage worker needs 2.5 full-time jobs to afford a one-bedroom apartment in most of the US

originally posted by: Xenogears
We don't all have unlimited potential. Someone with progeria or down's syndrome does not have the same capability to be productive as a high iq healthy individual.

If we don't all have unlimited potential, then society is obligated to push high performers as far as possible for the benefit of all.

originally posted by: Xenogears

originally posted by: Aazadan

Eugenics is backward thinking at best. Our diversity is our strength.

Eugenics doesn't work because if we all have unlimited potential, then trying to forcibly evolve society doesn't actually get you anywhere because the potential remains unchanged.

We don't all have unlimited potential. Someone with progeria or down's syndrome does not have the same capability to be productive as a high iq healthy individual.

An extremely high IQ is and aberration and a handicap equal to that of someone with an exceptionally low IQ. That being true and it is, do you promote breeding out those with too high of IQ's?

I say that because I have one family member and an old dear friend who have had a very hard time in life, at least as hard as someone with a learning disability, due entirely to their IQ's making them social outcasts and their total inability to function in a group or in normal social settings. They both struggle with things that an average person finds easy.

originally posted by: Blaine91555


An extremely high IQ is and aberration and a handicap equal to that of someone with an exceptionally low IQ. That being true and it is, do you promote breeding out those with too high of IQ's?

I say that because I have one family member and an old dear friend who have had a very hard time in life, at least as hard as someone with a learning disability, due entirely to their IQ's making them social outcasts and their total inability to function in a group or in normal social settings. They both struggle with things that an average person finds easy.

Too many people "claim" they have a high IQ and they really don't. More times than not, a person with a high IQ is lacking in other important areas, so having a high IQ might not be the best mix for success. The RARE few who have it all is not something we see very often.

Drive and desire is most likely the best attributes along with the ability to keep focused attention. With al that said were does a person like Justin Beaver fit in all this who has crazy talent but seems to pull off some stupid events.

a reply to: Xtrozero

I've known or met only two people in my lifetime that had a crazy high IQ over 180. One exists happily as a professor at a major university, but outside of academia, he's helpless and I mean truly helpless. The other, a close friend, has been in and out of mental institutions, twice thrown out of one university for proving his professors published theories wrong, fired often because he cannot follow instructions or deal with authority and currently penniless, living on disability. Neither of them could function in normal social settings.

Bieber is unexplainable.

originally posted by: Blaine91555

originally posted by: Xenogears

originally posted by: Aazadan

Eugenics is backward thinking at best. Our diversity is our strength.

Eugenics doesn't work because if we all have unlimited potential, then trying to forcibly evolve society doesn't actually get you anywhere because the potential remains unchanged.

We don't all have unlimited potential. Someone with progeria or down's syndrome does not have the same capability to be productive as a high iq healthy individual.

An extremely high IQ is and aberration and a handicap equal to that of someone with an exceptionally low IQ. That being true and it is, do you promote breeding out those with too high of IQ's?

I say that because I have one family member and an old dear friend who have had a very hard time in life, at least as hard as someone with a learning disability, due entirely to their IQ's making them social outcasts and their total inability to function in a group or in normal social settings. They both struggle with things that an average person finds easy.

You increase the IQ of the entire population, beyond human limits. Policies should be such that intelligence of the population increases.

originally posted by: Xtrozero
Too many people "claim" they have a high IQ and they really don't. More times than not, a person with a high IQ is lacking in other important areas, so having a high IQ might not be the best mix for success. The RARE few who have it all is not something we see very often.

A high enough IQ is a curse. It's a lifetime of lonliness and unhappiness. You experience the world in a totally different way that you can't share or translate to anyone around you. It seriously impacts ones ability to form relationships, and often leads to extensive abuse (just look at Stephen Hawkings or Einstein's relationships). Those people had defective brains. Many others without said issues were later able to learn in their footsteps.

Sometimes the one breaking new ground needs to see beyond this realm of existence though in order to develop an idea.

Anyways, back to the main point... one of the few things IQ does correlate with is misery. The higher you go, the more likely you are to be chronically depressed.

originally posted by: Aazadan

Anyways, back to the main point... one of the few things IQ does correlate with is misery. The higher you go, the more likely you are to be chronically depressed.

Back to really on point... Why does a minimum wage worker think they should get a single living apartment? Privacy is a luxury all over the world, but here in the states it is what people expect and not earn.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Aazadan

Anyways, back to the main point... one of the few things IQ does correlate with is misery. The higher you go, the more likely you are to be chronically depressed.

Back to really on point... Why does a minimum wage worker think they should get a single living apartment? Privacy is a luxury all over the world, but here in the states it is what people expect and not earn.

Even hunter gatherers could build huts for their individual families. What other third world nations do is not of our concern. We have more than enough space. A person could even be trained to cut down trees and build their house from the ground up in an empty lot.

Everyone deserves a right to their own roof. Without that you're exploited by landlords constantly raising the rent, and are at risk of homelessness if an emergency leaves you unemployed for long enough. It is a form of slavery, a huge portion of such low wages are garnished merely to pay the roof.

originally posted by: Xenogears


Everyone deserves a right to their own roof. Without that you're exploited by landlords constantly raising the rent, and are at risk of homelessness if an emergency leaves you unemployed for long enough. It is a form of slavery, a huge portion of such low wages are garnished merely to pay the roof.

Well then have at it, build a hut then... People rent because it is easy.....

Why do people wait for others to provide....it is not a right... Why not have 100 people pool they money buy 5 acres some place and build their individual huts on it like a group of Quakers would.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Aazadan

Anyways, back to the main point... one of the few things IQ does correlate with is misery. The higher you go, the more likely you are to be chronically depressed.

Back to really on point... Why does a minimum wage worker think they should get a single living apartment? Privacy is a luxury all over the world, but here in the states it is what people expect and not earn.

Why should they not? We're a developed country with a high quality of life. Why can we not establish a minimum standard of living that's above living on the streets?

originally posted by: Xtrozero
Well then have at it, build a hut then... People rent because it is easy.....

Why do people wait for others to provide....it is not a right... Why not have 100 people pool they money buy 5 acres some place and build their individual huts on it like a group of Quakers would.

Because trying to sell that property becomes a nightmare. You get all of the disadvantages of ownership, with none of the advantages. Renting is far superior to that scenario.

What ever happened to a fair day's pay for a days hard work?.
We are all cogs in the wheel it is fine telling everyone to get a better job but whom then does the hard low paid jobs? I bet 99% of folk couldn't do my job a good moral job helping others, but get paid crap.
I just wish I didn't have to struggle all the time.

originally posted by: Aazadan


Because trying to sell that property becomes a nightmare. You get all of the disadvantages of ownership, with none of the advantages. Renting is far superior to that scenario.

But but... Xenogears suggested if you can not buy or be given a place to live then it is slavery.

originally posted by: Aazadan


Why should they not? We're a developed country with a high quality of life. Why can we not establish a minimum standard of living that's above living on the streets?

Who is going to pay for it? Show me a "developed country" where the standards is everyone gets a single living place to live. Just about every country in the world you have multiple people living together sharing cost, but here in America people want minimum standards to be single living wage. Even in the 80s I had roommates until I was in my 30s when I started to make enough money to live on my own, just say.

originally posted by: testingtesting
I just wish I didn't have to struggle all the time.

How old are you? What have you done since high school good and bad? Are you able/willing to move to a job in another state, or country? What skills do you have?

originally posted by: testingtesting
What ever happened to a fair day's pay for a days hard work?.

That is a hard question to answer other than a job has XX amount of worth. Like mowing a yard it might be worth 20 bucks, but it is not worth 200. Every job has a value that that the pay can not be higher than what the value the position brings to the company, or the company makes no money.

originally posted by: Xtrozero
Who is going to pay for it?

If we were to fix wage stagnation we could give people more to work with for a housing budget. If we were to fix the lack of regulations in the housing market we could make the industry less speculative, less prone to bubbles, and therefore less prone to periodic spikes in property value, which in turn cause spikes in rent costs.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Aazadan


Because trying to sell that property becomes a nightmare. You get all of the disadvantages of ownership, with none of the advantages. Renting is far superior to that scenario.

But but... Xenogears suggested if you can not buy or be given a place to live then it is slavery.

It is slavery, when low income families lose 30-40+% of their income to rent, and are only a few missed payments away from the streets.

You know save and invest enough, and you can live off of dividends without working squat. But channels that could allow for easy savings like the roth iras, they put limits on how it works past inheritance. Accumulating too much savings also jeopardizes social aid, before the savings reach a point of allowing for self sufficiency.

No one asks to be born into this world. And it is the nutty policies, favored by the majority, that has people unable to provide adequate resources giving birth to children in suboptimal environments, only to be lorded over as wage slaves to the privileged children of wealthy elite.

Only someone that works out of choice not necessity is free, and only the elite are free. Anyone that has to work out of necessity or face living in the streets begging, they are not free.

originally posted by: Xenogears

Only someone that works out of choice not necessity is free, and only the elite are free. Anyone that has to work out of necessity or face living in the streets begging, they are not free.

Most living off the streets for very long do by choice, so they might be the freest of us all. BTW none of us are free by your definition even the rich.

a reply to: Xtrozero



There's that talent thing we were talking about.