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Not a fan of trump......but.....

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posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 12:36 PM
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a reply to: DJW001

It was right before your definition of peace. Also right after those secret talks....it's in there.


Were you going to get around to addressing what it is that we gave up to North Korea or KJU?




posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 12:43 PM
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a reply to: JinMI


Were you going to get around to addressing what it is that we gave up to North Korea or KJU?


Not for the first time, by holding a summit meeting with Kim, Trump has elevated him on the world stage and provided ample fodder for domestic propaganda. He has also alienated and/or frightened our allies and trading partners in the region. First, shredding TPP, then implying that he may pull troops off the peninsula. American withdrawal from the region strengthens China's bid for hegemony. Korea is a Chinese client. Taking pressure off DPRK takes pressure off PRC. This then creates problems for Japan, which has a strong movement to get United States military bases off the islands. It also creates tension with Taiwan and Viet Nam. There I go, sounding like a partisan idiot again.



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 12:44 PM
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a reply to: JinMI


It was right before your definition of peace. Also right after those secret talks....it's in there.


Refresh my memory, please.



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 12:49 PM
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a reply to: DJW001

I addressed your stance on what you think KJU gained and it's not something worth anything. It makes zero sense for him to go out for essentially bragging rights. I also addressed the summit and that NK having nuclear capabilities elevated THEMSELVES in not only as an adversary but being the leader of a nation, capable of having a conversation with another leader.

I've repeated this across the boards, if some harsh words shake our 'allies' then they can't be that great of an ally. I'm not worried about any politicians delicate feelings, they'll get over them and come back to the table. Or go on their own twitter tirade with some strong words for Trump. Either way, it's drama fo yo mama.

We havn't withdrawn. We may want to, we may but we still have bases in the region that won't be unoccupied.




There I go, sounding like a partisan idiot again.


FYI this is the first time since my initial reply that you've made a complete argument.



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 12:50 PM
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a reply to: DJW001

Better to refresh your schtick. For your own good. Hell, it's amusing to me lol.



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 12:59 PM
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a reply to: DJW001


Not for the first time, by holding a summit meeting with Kim, Trump has elevated him on the world stage and provided ample fodder for domestic propaganda.

So you admit that this is nothing new, so I am confused what Trump gave up by holding a summit. Better to ignore Kim?

You don't seem to understand who North Korea or Kim Jong Un is. Kim does not need political capital at home. Kim IS the political capital. He was never voted into office, nor will he ever have to face re-election. In the eyes of his people, he is a god with a divine right to rule. he has no restrictions on his rule. He does whatever he wants to do inside North Korea, and that includes executing anyone who suggests he can't.

We cannot ignore Kim out of existence. He will not lose his next election if we leave him alone. He will not be impeached. If we ignore him, we effectively legitimize everything he does; it we ignore direct threats he has made toward us and our allies, we encourage him to carry out those threats.

That is not opinion; it is how the world works. Kim Jong Un is a dictator.

The fact that a dictator in a third-world country has nuclear weaponry and the ability to deliver it, in the hands of a leader who is well-known to be unstable at best, is what elevated Kim Jong Un. Not the summit. No one will be vaporized over anything that happens in Singapore... that cannot be said for anything that happens with nuclear weaponry.

Kim has no need for more fodder for any domestic agenda. He is an absolute ruler.

You make less sense every time you post.

TheRedneck



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 01:00 PM
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a reply to: DJW001

Really did I not see all of this on the news channels? I don't recall any of this when Former President Obama made the deal with Iran, can you show me the videos? as I recall, even the pallet of cash was sent under the cover of darkness? I'm sure you can show me the handshake of Former President Obama and the Ayatollah of Iran, Right?

Or was it done thru "back channels"?

that almost sounds like collusion doesn't it?



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 01:03 PM
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First off let me start by saying I am for the United States making peace with any and every country on Earth.

next let me say that I think you're celebrating much too soon let's wait to see if this Summit pans out anything as Kim has made several promises over and over again only to back down.

third to say that Obama didn't try to do anything to establish peace is a total lie he went to Iran and Cuba and sought out peace deals and all the right did was talk s*** but now that Trump is over there praising Kim the right loves him but if Obama would have praised the Ayatollah or Castro you guys would have been out there with pitchforks in front of the White House. Also to say trump has done more for peace you are conveniently leaving out the drama he is starting with r two best friends and neighbors and half of Europe, he is putting us on the verge of a global trade war but he is praising the dear leader he deserves a noble peace prize lmao!!! I just cannot believe the level of hypocrisy here.



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 01:28 PM
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originally posted by: conspiracy nut
First off let me start by saying I am for the United States making peace with any and every country on Earth.

next let me say that I think you're celebrating much too soon let's wait to see if this Summit pans out anything as Kim has made several promises over and over again only to back down.

third to say that Obama didn't try to do anything to establish peace is a total lie he went to Iran and Cuba and sought out peace deals and all the right did was talk s*** but now that Trump is over there praising Kim the right loves him but if Obama would have praised the Ayatollah or Castro you guys would have been out there with pitchforks in front of the White House. Also to say trump has done more for peace you are conveniently leaving out the drama he is starting with r two best friends and neighbors and half of Europe, he is putting us on the verge of a global trade war but he is praising the dear leader he deserves a noble peace prize lmao!!! I just cannot believe the level of hypocrisy here.




I agree with you about celebrating too soon. I hope and pray this leads to peace, but way to early to celebrate.

Do you feel Trump is being unfairly criticized when people say he gave legitimacy to Kim with this summit?

Do you think Obama deserved the Nobel? If so, what "specifically" did he do to deserve it?




posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 01:37 PM
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a reply to: TheRedneck


So you admit that this is nothing new, so I am confused what Trump gave up by holding a summit. Better to ignore Kim?


I meant that was not the first time I had to explain myself. When children tantrum you need to ignore them so they do not think that can manipulate you. The media did not ignore Trump and now he is president. Obama threatened Assad but failed to follow up, encouraging him. Kim threatened Trump, and Trump has rewarded him by treating him as an equal. It is true that Kim has absolute control over the "information space" inside DPRK, but he has begun to engage online abroad, chiefly through.malicious hacking. Trump is creating uncertainties among our allies that can be exploited in the information space.



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 01:38 PM
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a reply to: JustaBill


I agree with you about celebrating too soon. I hope and pray this leads to peace, but way to early to celebrate.


Agreed. Much too early to celebrate anything. But, it's hard not to speculate.


Do you feel Trump is being unfairly criticized when people say he gave legitimacy to Kim with this summit?


Bollocks. Total and complete bollocks.


Do you think Obama deserved the Nobel? If so, what "specifically" did he do to deserve it?


I'm still, after all this time, trying to figure out what it is he did that was so exceptional. Getting elected to the Oval Office as the first person of color? I mean it's certainly a note worthy accomplishment, but Nobel worthy? Not so much.

I know you weren't asking me, but what the Hell.



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 01:39 PM
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a reply to: JustaBill


Do you think Obama deserved the Nobel? If so, what "specifically" did he do to deserve it?


In fairness, Trump deserves the Nobel Peace Prize every bit as much as Obama did.



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 01:45 PM
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a reply to: JustaBill

I believe it is fair to criticize trump for gloating over a cruel dictator but to criticize him for legitimizing Kim would be hypocrisy.

I do not believe Obama deserves a peace prize. Although he did try to work out peace deals w Cuba and Iran which I praise he also droned and meddled the Middle East peace process and set it back 100 years. Shame!



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 01:48 PM
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a reply to: seagull



I know you weren't asking me, but what the Hell.


I value anyone's input addressed to them or not so it's not a problem and your input is just as valued.


Bollocks. Total and complete bollocks.


Agreed. I find it amazing how people criticize Trump meeting a leader of a 3rd world country with nukes is worse than meeting leaders from 3rd world countries without nukes.

I'm still, after all this time, trying to figure out what it is he did that was so exceptional. Getting elected to the Oval Office as the first person of color? I mean it's certainly a note worthy accomplishment, but Nobel worthy? Not so much.

Same here, I have no idea. Even Obama's supporters thought it was a mistake. After reading this article, it appears it was just for optics and nothing more.




posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 01:56 PM
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originally posted by: conspiracy nut
a reply to: JustaBill

I believe it is fair to criticize trump for gloating over a cruel dictator but to criticize him for legitimizing Kim would be hypocrisy.

I do not believe Obama deserves a peace prize. Although he did try to work out peace deals w Cuba and Iran which I praise he also droned and meddled the Middle East peace process and set it back 100 years. Shame!



I believe it is fair to criticize trump for gloating over a cruel dictator


I can't agree with you more on how well you phrased this. I do believe Trump felt the need to "gloat" to continue to bring Kim along in this process, but I was turned off by it personally. The praising was sickening to me.




posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 02:07 PM
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a reply to: conspiracy nut




I believe it is fair to criticize trump for gloating over a cruel dictator


I have to agree with that. There had to be a better way to say that...almost any way.



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 07:43 PM
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originally posted by: DJW001

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: DJW001

Yes...that video was some cringey S**.

Still doesn't change the nature of what transpired. It seems as though folks in general really want peace in and with NK however there is a segment who don't want it if Trump is handling it.


The situation is clearly far too complicated for Trump supporters to grasp. North Korea exists because it is a compromise between the regional powers and the United States. The United States cannot sign a peace treaty without South Korea being on board, and China has (bogus) historical claims to the peninsula. Japan and other Asian allies have their own interests as well. What we have now is peace, albeit armed. Trump is stirring up a hornet's nest because he thinks he is smarter than every other American, Korean, and Chinese diplomat of the past half century.


How can anyone blatantly be ignoring facts like you do and still try to use words like "clearly"?

You have no justification other than your own butt hurt trumphate . I challenge you to define "clearly" because to me what you typed is Bovine Scat! Those trumpsters you hate are beating you lefties.... I bought popcorn and soda!

Score seems to be Trumpsters are up by 1000 The lefties are shooting BS so flimsy like you just tried to do, that it won't even stick on a wall.


edit on 13-6-2018 by Justoneman because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 07:51 PM
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a reply to: DJW001


I meant that was not the first time I had to explain myself.

Well, it is true that it takes a lot of explaining to correct so many multiple contradictions, so I guess I can understand that.


When children tantrum you need to ignore them so they do not think that can manipulate you. The media did not ignore Trump and now he is president.

Hahaha, yeah, the media sure should have ignored him instead of denigrating him at every turn. But I understand you need someone to blame. Hillary, is that you?


Obama threatened Assad but failed to follow up, encouraging him.

That was Obama's Modus Operandi.


Kim threatened Trump, and Trump has rewarded him by treating him as an equal.

I don't see acceptance of the fact that he is ruler of a nation which has some nuclear capability as "treating him as an equal." Didn't trump say his button was bigger, and worked? Again, Kim did not get the first sanction lifted. Aside from a chance to hear Trump do, as you claim, "absolutely nothing," what was Kim's reward again?

The only possible way the exposure of the summit could in any way be seen as a reward is to assume that Kim craves normal relations with other nations... and that indicates there is a possibility for peace. Just another contradiction in your thought processes.


It is true that Kim has absolute control over the "information space" inside DPRK, but he has begun to engage online abroad, chiefly through.malicious hacking.

And international goodwill helps him with this malicious hacking how, exactly?


Trump is creating uncertainties among our allies that can be exploited in the information space.

China is on board with the summit. Japan loves the summit (they're sitting there staring down Kim's nuclear barrel). Moon of South Korea has had his own summits and apparently is encouraged by this. What uncertainties are you talking about?

Israel loves us because Trump finally moved the embassy to Jerusalem. Russia has backed down twice, so they at least respect us. The EU is going broke because of the exact reasons they disagree with Trump... they'll come around. Canada needs to get a leader who will actually lead... Trudeau showed classic symptoms of passive-aggressive disorder in that last little fiasco. Mexico isn't happy, but that's because we're not letting them mess in out back yard any more.

Again, you might want to pick a talking point and stick to it. Just one, because when you throw all the talking points out there together, they tend to contradict themselves and make you look... well, like you look right now.

TheRedneck



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 08:34 PM
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originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: DieGloke


What he has done with North Korea is worthy of respect and kudos and Trump has accomplished more to bring peace than Obama or any other modern president.


What, exactly, do you believe he has done? They issued a statement that said nothing material about what they are going to do. At least prior presidents got specific agreements to cease nuclear and missile research, which DPRK promptly broke. What Kim means by "denuclearization" has never been clearly defined, nor is there any sort of time table. Most likely, Kim has just been manipulating Trump to increase his stature on the world stage.




Sure, and I live in Kim Towers and have all his books.

The kid is a monster intellect for sure!

And he/his dad or grandpa never been threatened with annihilation.

That kinda gets someones attention.


ETA, beat ya to death and still take your lunch money!





edit on 6 13 2018 by burgerbuddy because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 13 2018 @ 08:38 PM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
The only thing that happened here is that Trump gave NK what they could never have dreamed of otherwise: to be seen as diplomatically commitant with America.

Dear Leader won.




Yeah a photo op.

I have a pic with me and ian anderson, can I claim I play guitar with Jethro Tull?

lol.





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