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F-22

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posted on Dec, 3 2005 @ 11:20 PM
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Status quo can only be maintained as long as long as countries are willing to accept buying lower end products. But if the US keeps the price high and out of reach of others, then a situation occures were they are not going to sit around and wait for someone else, not on friendly terms with the US, gives them trouble. They will develop machines they can afford and are almost as capable. Sweden has a long history with that, being neutral. They develop the JAS 39 about the same time as the Typhoon and, unlike the Typhoon, is now in service.
Also, many see the F-22 as too big of a leap. It overstep it's competition so far it may have nothing to fight. It's almost too big of an ego. Back when the F-15 was created, there was a specific aircraft it was supposed to beat. The F-22 did not get developed like that and it could be it's undoing. It will not be used because no one will want to waste it on a mission against 'second rate' or 'third rate' opponents, at least until it's too late. In a number of wars since the end of WW2, enemies with older, obsolete aircraft gave more modern forces more problem than they ever thought possible. Picture if you will, in 1956, a WW2 Bf-109 shooting down a MiG-15, the standard back then. This really happened. I wouldn't be too suprised if an F-22 gets tagged by a MiG-21 somewhere in the world in the future. Had the Soviet Union still been around, well, make as many as you can. But now, things have changed. I think it will get more use being a bomber than a fighter.
The F-22 is still only a paper plane. Once it has been baptised by fire, then we'll see how it fits in world of military aviation.




posted on Dec, 3 2005 @ 11:46 PM
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US Air Force really had no plans of exporting this plane. That is what the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter is for. A stealthy, cheap, all purpose aircraft that isnt as specialized. Personally I like the VTOL version of it. Something to take over the roll of the aging harrier.



posted on Dec, 4 2005 @ 05:41 AM
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Originally posted by TSR2005
I wouldn't be too suprised if an F-22 gets tagged by a MiG-21 somewhere in the world in the future.


If the F-16 and F-15 have never been downed by an enemy plane, what in the world makes you think the Raptor will be?

The Raptor is able to take on 5+ F-15's and win...without contest. As a Raptor pilot said...It's (shooting down other aircraft) like clubing baby seals...



posted on Dec, 4 2005 @ 07:07 AM
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Originally posted by American Mad Man

Originally posted by TSR2005
I wouldn't be too suprised if an F-22 gets tagged by a MiG-21 somewhere in the world in the future.


If the F-16 and F-15 have never been downed by an enemy plane, what in the world makes you think the Raptor will be?

The Raptor is able to take on 5+ F-15's and win...without contest. As a Raptor pilot said...It's (shooting down other aircraft) like clubing baby seals...




that may well be true - but it does paint a misleading picture - as both the F-16 and F-15 HAVE been shot down before , but not by aircraft - but SA-6`s (which are 20 years old!!)



posted on Dec, 4 2005 @ 07:25 AM
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The F-15 has never been shot down under the control of a US pilot. I dont know if another country lost one but I sure as hell know we didnt. One did crash some years back inside the US. But Ive never heard of one being shot down.
www.globalaircraft.org...

Further more, the aircraft will still be able to perform in air superiority roles well into the 21st century with continuing upgrades.

The F-16 was shot down in Serbia, the famouse Basher Five-Two incident. Pilot Scott O'Grady escaped and was eventually rescued. here is everything I could find in reference to an F-16 being shot down, certainly not a long list.
www.f-16.net...
www.aeronautics.ru...



posted on Dec, 4 2005 @ 08:24 AM
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I remember waching a documentary about the downed F-16 pilot Scott O Grady when i was a young lad back about 1997. He was hiding from Serbian militia gangs for a few days and nights. He was eventually rescued by the USMC?. I think they were becouse they had sea stallions and AH-1 Cobras to support him.



posted on Dec, 4 2005 @ 08:52 AM
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Originally posted by ludaChris
The F-15 has never been shot down under the control of a US pilot. I dont know if another country lost one but I sure as hell know we didnt. One did crash some years back inside the US. But Ive never heard of one being shot down.
www.globalaircraft.org...



www.signonsandiego.com...


WASHINGTON – The remains of one of two Air Force pilots who were declared missing after their F-15E fighter jet was shot down over Iraq on April 7 have been recovered and identified, the Pentagon said Friday.



well there ya go - 2 dead crew from an eagle that was shot down.



posted on Dec, 5 2005 @ 02:01 PM
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Originally posted by Harlequin
that may well be true - but it does paint a misleading picture - as both the F-16 and F-15 HAVE been shot down before , but not by aircraft - but SA-6`s (which are 20 years old!!)


Like I said, no F-15 or F-16 has been shot down by an enemy aircraft.

I said this in response to the absurd comment that he wouldn't be surprised if a Mig-21 downed a Raptor.

As for it being misleading...

I dissagree. You can count the number of teen series fighters that have been shot down on your fingers, and that is over tens of thousands of sorties.

That's a pretty good ratio, if I do say so my self.



posted on Dec, 5 2005 @ 02:53 PM
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mrbunnyman
I just have to ask but does anyone bother to do a little research before the post a question. I'm not trying to be confrontational but it seems to me with alot of the questins on here the answer could be found with a quick websearch on industry sites.

The same could be said about you.



mrbunnyman
For example the F-22 is not in production yet.

wrong.

The F/A-22 is in full rate production. Over 60 have being built and delivered to the USAF, and the jet is currently operational.



posted on Dec, 5 2005 @ 03:09 PM
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Originally posted by Murcielago

mrbunnyman
I just have to ask but does anyone bother to do a little research before the post a question. I'm not trying to be confrontational but it seems to me with alot of the questins on here the answer could be found with a quick websearch on industry sites.

The same could be said about you.



mrbunnyman
For example the F-22 is not in production yet.

wrong.

The F/A-22 is in full rate production. Over 60 have being built and delivered to the USAF, and the jet is currently operational.


All maturity aside, you just got





posted on Dec, 8 2005 @ 05:58 AM
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I think my dislexia kicked in there. I read the thing wrong, it has a perfect record in A2A combat. My bad.



posted on Dec, 8 2005 @ 06:50 AM
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I'm personally not an F-22 fan, but I believe in being fair.

The F-22 Raptor is currently the most advanced fighter known to be in production. The F-22 is developed from the ATF program that started in 1981. While it was NOT a black program, ATF was, and still is Special Access under the code name: Senior Sky! This means that even though the plane is well known, many things about the aircraft such as details of the avionics, stealth features and weapons, are still Top Secret. You need to take into accout that many things about the F-22 are still unknown.

Tim



posted on Dec, 8 2005 @ 07:30 AM
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yes like things like how much DU is being used in the airframe



posted on Dec, 8 2005 @ 08:42 AM
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Originally posted by Harlequin
yes like things like how much DU is being used in the airframe


DU?


How did you come up with this? DU is Depleted Uranium. It is used to make high density armor and Armor penatrating ammunition. The F-22 doesn't have either of these two thing according to ANY source I have ever seen. Why would an F-22 have DU in the airframe? Please explain your logic Harlequin!

Tim



posted on Dec, 8 2005 @ 08:54 AM
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DU is being used in crusie missiles in the airframe , so why wouldn`t it be used in the F-22??


its used as a counter weight to the heavy front end of the missile.



posted on Dec, 8 2005 @ 06:00 PM
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Even though the F-22 is one of the most advanced fighters we have, there have been so many problems getting it into the squadrons that some people think it was already obsolete in some areas. For instance, the USAF had a bunch of problems with the HUD software locking up when it went to attack ground targets....just one of a few problems i've heard about. Tyndall AFB and Langley AFB are just now starting to form squadrons, so i guess we'll see...

[edit on 8-12-2005 by BlackThorn311]



posted on Dec, 10 2005 @ 08:32 PM
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the F/A-22 is going to be for a while one of the most technologically advanced planes the world has seen. I was at Edwards Air Force base and saw one fly over head really fast. it was awesome. Ive also seen them doing some bombing runs from far away. a great experience that i will always remember



posted on Dec, 10 2005 @ 08:56 PM
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Originally posted by Harlequin
www.signonsandiego.com...


WASHINGTON – The remains of one of two Air Force pilots who were declared missing after their F-15E fighter jet was shot down over Iraq on April 7 have been recovered and identified, the Pentagon said Friday.



well there ya go - 2 dead crew from an eagle that was shot down.


Erm, "shot down" is in reference to what exactly, Harlequin? Was it an enemy aircraft, an enemy SAM, or an Iraqi on camal-back with a rifle?

According to the very same article you linked to:


They said he was on a bombing mission in an F-15E Strike Eagle over northern Iraq when the plane went down under undetermined circumstances.







seekerof



posted on Dec, 10 2005 @ 09:20 PM
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The problems with the F-22 thus far have been software based. Those can be worked out by the software engineers. I'm sure it will be fine, the contractors who have been building planes for the US for years havent let them down yet(ie the F-16, F-14, F-15, and F-18). Which all have very nice combat records. I have no worries that the F-22 will be any different, a quality plane to keep control of the skies, it will fill the role just as well as the F-15.



posted on Dec, 10 2005 @ 09:23 PM
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Originally posted by Harlequin
DU is being used in crusie missiles in the airframe , so why wouldn`t it be used in the F-22??


its used as a counter weight to the heavy front end of the missile.


The F22 is not a cruise missile and since it's a Stealth Aircraft armour isn't needed or even wanted I'm thinking.



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