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Video shows Oregon officer repeatedly punching homeless man as he shouts 'I'm not resisting'

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posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 02:50 PM
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a reply to: jburg6

Is the punching justified? I don't believe that it is, as there are myriad other ways to get someone to comply with the simple need to get their arm behind their back that do not necessitate striking the individual, especially when they are already on the ground.

That said, he WAS resisting by refusing to put his arm behind his back when the officer was attempting to do so--and he continued resisting that action by the officer.

Like others have noted, just because he says he isn't resisting doesn't necessarily make it reality. I'll admit, the guy was about as polite about his "not resisting" as he could have been, which is why I feel that the officer's strikes to the head were unnecessary (dude was communicating rationally, not beligerantly), but if he would have just simply complied with the arrest in the first place, the strikes to the head most likely would not have happened.

See, here's the thing: Actions speak much louder than words, and if you refuse to comply with an arrest, you are resisting, even if your mouth is saying otherwise. When an officer says that you're under arrest and to put your hand behind your back, and you yell, "No...NO!," and fight the officers' attempts to cuff you, you are resisting arrest.

Again, he didn't deserve multiple strikes to the head, IMO, but he certainly wasn't right to resist, either.

But, the specifics of the "why" behind police confronting him matters:

Deputy Ethan Griffith said 28-year-old Kevin Straw, a transient who has been living in Detroit, was arrested after he continually entered the command post and disrupted crews.

Griffith said Straw was making so much noise that rescuers were unable to hear and communicate with search and rescue personnel. After he refused multiple commands from deputies to leave, they arrested him.

In a statement, the sheriff's office said Straw physically resisted, so deputies used force to take him into custody. Deputies also found a large fixed-blade knife in Shaw's possession.

K GW8

I mean, if you're making so much noise as to be interfering with police business concerning a search and rescue operation, yes, you have earned physical removal from the vicinity. If you choose to resist the arrest, you better hope that you don't get Officer Emotionally Immature as an arresting officer, if that's the game that you choose to play.

I hope that the officer gets officially punished for this, and if this is just another in a summation of prior excessive-force incidents, he needs to be fired.




posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 02:56 PM
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originally posted by: DexterRiley

Once again, we need to make sure that there are trained and designated officers who should be handling these types of incidents. Bear in mind that some forms of mental illness skew the afflicted person's view of reality. And what seems to be clear and straightforward instructions from the authorities could be construed by the mentally ill person as some kind of attack.

Just to clarify, you're not implying that officers should be able to diagnose mental issues on the fly and then, if they assume that there is a mental illness, completely redo how they interact with someone 'just in case,' are you?

Their job--the job of the average police officer--is not to diagnose mental illness, it is to handle incidents of lawlessness swiftly and appropriately for the situation or to respond to crimes after the fact. We cannot expect them to suddenly become instantaneous psychologists.

Resisting arrest is resisting arrest, regardless of one's mental state--and to be fair, mentally disturbed people can be even MORE dangerous than the average citizen, so controlling the situation, even with force, can be an even more immediate necessity in those instances.



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 02:59 PM
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Only fair thing to do here is to restrain the officers involved, give the homeless guy a billy club and let him go to town for a few minutes.



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 03:09 PM
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I don't see anything wrong with the arrest after reading the details of what led up to it. He was resisting, no matter what he said.

I do think the officer that lost control should find a new profession. He deserves whatever happens to him.



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 03:10 PM
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WTF is wrong with people nowadays? That's so over the line and totally unnecessary. I hope that cop gets his ass handed to him some day.

I've seen murder suspects get better treatment than that.
edit on 6-6-2018 by mtnshredder because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 03:15 PM
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a reply to: SlapMonkey

I appreciate your point. Especially concerning the fact that someone who is mentally ill can be even more dangerous than someone who isn't so affected.

However, in this case, and many others as well, there were indications that the man wasn't acting rationally. But there's no indication from any evidence that we have available to us that he was an immediate threat.

I think officers trained in dealing with mentally ill perpetrators should be deployed in those cases where there's no immediate threat, or in cases where there is evidence before the encounter that the person of interest may be mentally ill. In those cases, specific procedure can be utilized to help subdue the person humanely; without injuring or killing them unnecessarily.

If an officer encounters someone acting in a manner that is dangerous and poses an immediate threat to the LEO or other civilians, I expect him or her to take all necessary actions. In fact, it is possible in such cases that lethal force may have to be deployed where it would not otherwise be required for someone who is mentally stable.

Hope that clarifies my position.

-dex



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 03:36 PM
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It is human instinct to defend yourself when being pummeled and cops use that as an excuse to keep hitting.



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 03:59 PM
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originally posted by: DexterRiley
a reply to: SlapMonkey

However, in this case, and many others as well, there were indications that the man wasn't acting rationally. But there's no indication from any evidence that we have available to us that he was an immediate threat.

You don't have to be an immediate threat to be arrested. The dude was being disruptive of apparent police search and rescue operations and was told to leave numerous times, and he refused. Then when that refusal led to him being arrested, he refused to comply with orders to put his hands behind his back many, many times and for an extended period of time.

Threat or not, he wrote his own script that day--unfortunately, Officer Punchalot was present and acted unprofessionally in the face of such poor decisions. It was a lose-lose at that point.


I think officers trained in dealing with mentally ill perpetrators should be deployed in those cases where there's no immediate threat, or in cases where there is evidence before the encounter that the person of interest may be mentally ill. In those cases, specific procedure can be utilized to help subdue the person humanely; without injuring or killing them unnecessarily.

Waiting for such specialized officers could take a long time, and it only takes a split second for an encounter to turn violent or deadly for officers or bystanders in any given situation.

But like I noted in my initial comment in this thread, there are easily other ways to get his hand behind his back than repeatedly striking him in the head--all that does is make the guy want to keep his hand up to protect his head, which is a subconscious human response to protect the brain.

This was an obvious instance of poor professionalism and possibly poor training, but I don't think that making assumptions about people and then having to wait for a specialized officer is the best approach.


If an officer encounters someone acting in a manner that is dangerous and poses an immediate threat to the LEO or other civilians, I expect him or her to take all necessary actions. In fact, it is possible in such cases that lethal force may have to be deployed where it would not otherwise be required for someone who is mentally stable.

Yes, but like I noted, all it takes is a snap of the finger for a situation to turn deadly. These situations are impossible to predict and often impossible to be fully prepared for, so like I say, taking up position and holding until a specially trained officer arrives WITHOUT detaining the individual would be a poor approach to a potentially very dangerous situation.

I appreciate the level-headed dialogue, though--that's often hard to find on these threads.



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 04:01 PM
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a reply to: dragonridr

As an oregon resident I'm glad to hear the officer was suspended, but honestly it doesn't go far enough. If the officer lost his cool and assaulted the man he deserves to go to jail. Police should hold a higher standard and be punished when they don't. They are trained to hurt/kill people and that power must not be in the hands of people who fly off the handle nor in politicians who would defend it.



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 04:43 PM
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a reply to: SlapMonkey

You make some very valid points. We can second guess the actions of these officers all day long. It's easy to criticize them while we're sitting on the couch with the TV playing in the background. Our lives are not on the line.

That's one of the reasons that I generally don't jump on the bandwagon and condemn the actions of these police officers without knowing all of the facts. Even then I try to take into consideration input from the LEO netizens of our ATS family.

One area that I've seen may be applicable to having a trained person at the scene is when officers are dispatched to handle someone who is known to be mentally ill and acting irrationally when they're at home, or some other non-public venue. We've seen a couple of cases where officers were sent out on humanitarian calls to check on, or subdue, someone who is acting irrationally because they've come off their meds; or experienced a mood change because of environmental reasons. In the cases that come to mind, there appeared to be ample time to get a trained officer on the scene before action was taken. The end result was the sick individual sustained fatal or severe injuries.

In another case I remember that an officer was harassing a mentally ill homeless man who turned on him. He dumped a whole magazine in the guy to stop him. In a recording of the call from the officer to dispatch after the incident, he sounded like he had just done battle with Lucifer himself. LOL. Maybe with a little training that officer might have behaved a little differently. At the very least, if he had some backup he could have save a dozen or so rounds of ammo.



I appreciate the level-headed dialogue, though--that's often hard to find on these threads.

Same here. I've learned in the years that I've been here that I can learn a lot from "listening" to people who have very different perspectives and opinions than I do. And that's a lot easier to do with respectful interchange than with a knee-jerk defensive response.

In the end, a "conversation" should at least end with a respectful agree to disagree. That sets up the next interchange where those participants can learn from one another, rather than vociferously argue their own perspective.

-dex



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 04:57 PM
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a reply to: Thirty6BelowZero

And likewise, the police often shout "stop resisting" as they are beating the piss out of a person.



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 05:07 PM
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The Police know only too well that once you physically take hold of a suspect and take them to the ground, they will automatically stiffen up. It's an auto response which the body does automatically.

In all my years of service I never had one takedown that I can recall where the suspect went floppy or totally compliant in the first few seconds following restraint.

You will see hundreds of videos where the suspect is shouting that they are not resisting, when clearly there arms are taught, as the officer is unable to bend the joint. The suspect truly believes they are not resisting at all because the muscle stiffening is not a conscious action. The trained officers will no doubt be aware of this but once the adrenaline starts pumping, sometimes training goes out the window.

If I had punched a suspect like that and in those circumstance, I would have been sacked, 100% and I believe I would have deserved it too.
I'm disgusted.



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 05:40 PM
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How can any of you who watched that think the officers actions were acceptable, clearly that was excessive force which a citizen would be arrested for and charged.

That's sick behavior, and if it was an ad for the U. S it would have the caption " land of the free to be beaten into submission "



posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 07:56 PM
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After all those blows to the head , he is still resisting arrest .
Why didnt he just put his hands behind his back for the zip ties or cuffs ?
He was already told he was under arrest.
Dang
"Momma always said , stupid is as stupid does" - Forrest Gump.




posted on Jun, 6 2018 @ 11:27 PM
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originally posted by: DexterRiley

If an officer encounters someone acting in a manner that is dangerous and poses an immediate threat to the LEO or other civilians, I expect him or her to take all necessary actions. In fact, it is possible in such cases that lethal force may have to be deployed where it would not otherwise be required for someone who is mentally stable.



All right.

So, if an officer comes across four armed, roided up goons beating on a homeless man, he should draw his weapon and say "Freeze!" or something similar. If the four armed goons make any threatening moves he should probably start shooting. Right?

Now, let's suppose the the officer is just an average, armed citizen and the armed, roided up goons are wearing uniforms. The citizen should take the same action, right?

In both cases, the individual is trying to prevent an attempted murder.



posted on Jun, 7 2018 @ 03:53 AM
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Portland/Beaverton cops...

Have a long history of killing first, ask questions later...

Along with handing out t-shirts of "just smoke em' don't choke em"
edit on 7-6-2018 by Komodo because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2018 @ 04:03 AM
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originally posted by: studio500
The Police know only too well that once you physically take hold of a suspect and take them to the ground, they will automatically stiffen up. It's an auto response which the body does automatically.

In all my years of service I never had one takedown that I can recall where the suspect went floppy or totally compliant in the first few seconds following restraint.

You will see hundreds of videos where the suspect is shouting that they are not resisting, when clearly there arms are taught, as the officer is unable to bend the joint. The suspect truly believes they are not resisting at all because the muscle stiffening is not a conscious action. The trained officers will no doubt be aware of this but once the adrenaline starts pumping, sometimes training goes out the window.

If I had punched a suspect like that and in those circumstance, I would have been sacked, 100% and I believe I would have deserved it too.
I'm disgusted.


I think, not a doctor, but, I know when I'm getting my head & face beat on, my arms most certainly stiffen up around my head,

That's definitely a natural reaction for me to defend myself, cops or not. (Sarcasm)




posted on Jun, 7 2018 @ 05:18 AM
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originally posted by: Gothmog
After all those blows to the head , he is still resisting arrest .
Why didnt he just put his hands behind his back for the zip ties or cuffs ?
He was already told he was under arrest.
Dang
"Momma always said , stupid is as stupid does" - Forrest Gump.



Uhh, maybe because they're pulling at him from every direction, ripping at his clothes, cutting his items up, and having goons kneel on his face after being bashed numerous times by a scared little boy.

Stupid is not resisting. I refuse to be a slave.



posted on Jun, 7 2018 @ 05:21 AM
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originally posted by: VictorVonDoom

originally posted by: DexterRiley

If an officer encounters someone acting in a manner that is dangerous and poses an immediate threat to the LEO or other civilians, I expect him or her to take all necessary actions. In fact, it is possible in such cases that lethal force may have to be deployed where it would not otherwise be required for someone who is mentally stable.



All right.

So, if an officer comes across four armed, roided up goons beating on a homeless man, he should draw his weapon and say "Freeze!" or something similar. If the four armed goons make any threatening moves he should probably start shooting. Right?

Now, let's suppose the the officer is just an average, armed citizen and the armed, roided up goons are wearing uniforms. The citizen should take the same action, right?

In both cases, the individual is trying to prevent an attempted murder.


Most civilians in that situation would act, I'd hope, and not feel good about being on paid leave while their chums 'investigate ALL the facts" to then be put back on beat duty with another notch on the gun barrel.

How these people can sleep at night, knowing what sort of 'civilian' they would make... as they say, they put on the uniform and their personality completely changes. Suddenly good ol' jim, the laid back family man, is now Judge Dredd.



posted on Jun, 7 2018 @ 05:01 PM
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originally posted by: VictorVonDoom

originally posted by: DexterRiley

If an officer encounters someone acting in a manner that is dangerous and poses an immediate threat to the LEO or other civilians, I expect him or her to take all necessary actions. In fact, it is possible in such cases that lethal force may have to be deployed where it would not otherwise be required for someone who is mentally stable.



All right.

So, if an officer comes across four armed, roided up goons beating on a homeless man, he should draw his weapon and say "Freeze!" or something similar. If the four armed goons make any threatening moves he should probably start shooting. Right?

Now, let's suppose the the officer is just an average, armed citizen and the armed, roided up goons are wearing uniforms. The citizen should take the same action, right?

In both cases, the individual is trying to prevent an attempted murder.


Given the scenario you've proposed, in principle, I would say yes.

However, the reality of the situation would be quite different. If an average citizen attempted to intervene in a case where 4 cops are giving another average citizen a beat down, if he opened fire, he would almost certainly be shot, or at least arrested and prosecuted. He would likely be found guilty of capital murder, and executed in those states that still practice that form of punishment.

-dex



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