It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

STOP with the COMMON SENSE gun control pleas – just STOP! - falling on deaf ears

page: 2
36
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 07:35 AM
link   

originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: DexterRiley


1. Restrict some mentally ill people from being able to quickly purchase firearms. Of course, a timely and efficient appeals process should be available.

In theory, I like this idea. The issue that I have with it is not the idea itself, but a recent tendency to attribute any behavior not in line with what others are thinking as evidence of "mental illness." Oppositional Defiant Disorder stands out in my mind as a prime example of how anyone can be targeted as "mentally ill." I realize it is considered limited to children at this time, but so was ADHD at one time; now it can affect adults as well.

If there were some way to ensure that someone would not use redefinition to circumvent the common sense in the proposal, I might could get on board with this.


That's a nice try at the whole list. They really need individual attention. I'm interested in #1: Restrict some mentally ill people from being able to quickly purchase firearms. Of course, a timely and efficient appeals process should be available

We hear this a lot lately often coupled with the idea shootings are related to medication. Take your example: Oppositional Defiant Disorder (aka bad attitude.) Is this really how these kids behave? I had the impression they were more withdrawn but I don't really know what's true. I can think of some other labels that could apply. Psychopathic, possibly. Judging by the medication they receive, most are diagnosed with depression. If there is some test or way to diagnose this tendency to mass murder, the relevant professionals clearly are not using it.

So how can we use the mental health approach if there is no known way to diagnose the condition? We need to develop that. If it's true that normal common sense by teachers, gun instructors or anyone else can screen these kids out we wouldn't be where we are today. The reason is these kids do not present as mass murderers. They present as depressed. Until they take the drugs which exacerbates their condition and sets them on a murder spree. We need to be able to sort this person from all the other depressed out there.




posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 07:41 AM
link   
a reply to: toms54

Whomever decides the list of what makes one mentally ill will be a huge slippery slope IMO. That list of items that qualify might get Orwellian and the method of deciding will become the way to sneak around and change the narrative to whatever they want. "you took pics of the perps coming into a court"/ suspended sentence; do it again 13 months without a fair trial? "he is a bigot and deserves..."

"Danger Will Robinson!"



edit on 2-6-2018 by Justoneman because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 07:47 AM
link   

originally posted by: Justoneman
a reply to: toms54

Whomever decides the list of what makes one mentally ill will be a huge slippery slope IMO. That list of items that qualify might get Orwellian and the method of deciding will become the way to sneak around and change the narrative to whatever they want.

"Danger Will Robinson!"


You are a little late with that observation. There is already an entire army of mental health people out there trying all sorts of dark arts. Remember lobotomies and sterilization of mentally ill? I have no doubt they are doing something equally horrific today.



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 08:01 AM
link   
If common sense existed,

The Constitution wouldn't suffer misinterpretation nor abuse.

The clause stating what states rights and peoples rights consist of specifically says,

"all others are reserved to the states and the people respectively" which speaks specifically to the subject of unenumerated rights, no way if read correctly instead of wishfully does it allow modification or abridgment of any enumerated right.

That is an exclusionary statement regards the enumerated rights of the constitution - to wit - to be left alone, unmodified, unedited, unabridged and inalienable.

Just common sense and understanding the English language.

Courts, Lawyers and Legislature, foolhardy opinion, populism and media manipulation be damned - Constitution covers that subject too!

One has to be an absolute dolt, uneducated or agenda driven or sheep like to read Constitution otherwise.

edit on 2-6-2018 by Phoenix because: add comment



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 08:03 AM
link   

originally posted by: Whoisjohngalt
a reply to: MarlbBlack

What is an assault weapon?


Sticks, stones bats, guns, knives, forks too (they hurt), fists, a big bad dog.....

Gun control would be to just stop shooting at each other. Other countries have guns too, but they don't seem to be as out of control.
I've also noticed that gun safes are getting bigger. A person could probably fit 3 or 4 bodies in them, they're so big...they'll hold even more guns.
edit on 2-6-2018 by snowspirit because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 08:04 AM
link   
This is my number one issue and my “line in the sand” no compromise, no negotiation item. I would rather talk about socialized medicine than gun control. It is akin to the Left agreeing to “common sense” abortion laws which also isn’t going to happen,

Leave guns and abortions out of the discussion and pretty much everything else is on the table. I won’t be negotiating my rights away and I don’t expect those on the Left to give up their freedoms either.

Above all else is allowing others their freedom and right to live their life according to their values and their priorities. Ultimately I am only opposed to something when I am forced to be complicit in someone else’s scheme.

Forcing is bad.


edit on 2018/6/2 by Metallicus because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 08:10 AM
link   

originally posted by: toms54

originally posted by: DigginFoTroof

First off, we do not need children telling us what laws we need when it comes to the fundamentals of our country. Most of us remember being that age and how many of us thought we were much more intelligent and wise than we actually were. The thing is, that SOME of us grow out of that, the rest join the Democratic Party and put victimized & traumatized children in front of camera's to push their agenda.


Right there is where I stopped reading. Did the s+f thing then went back to finish. Thank you for expressing the frustrations shared by millions.

Of course the Dems must know this. The whole thing is a massive troll meant to annoy us.


Thanks for quoting that part as it made me re-read what I wrote. I think I may have not stated my view in the most tactful manner, trying to be somewhat blunt. I don't want to minimize what the children go through or what they feel nor what they think needs to be done in order to fix the problem. The thing is that with age, for most people, comes experience and that will show the reasons why some things will work and others won't. What may seem like a common sense approach to someone naive of the situation may prove to be completely useless and burdensome and someone with experience may know this and would oppose the idea.

The opinions of youth can be a tricky thing b/c at that age you don't have the experience to know when others may have a better idea based on time/experience/wisdom or when you are just being ignored b/c you are young and the elders just want to keep their power or not be bothered and this often leads to confrontation and the wrong option being chosen just to ease the situation.



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 09:06 AM
link   
Common sense light bulb options? CFL’s versus incandescents. Wasn’t even a public discussion. Want those same people deciding on your ability to own a gun and limitations of operation?

Is there such a thing as common sense control of anything in a free society?



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 09:13 AM
link   
Just a few ideas:

1) Stiffen up laws to keep people in asylums until they can be diagnosed as not a threat to the community.
2) Enforce gun laws - no plea bargains.
3) Stop broadcasting gun violence 24/7 when it happens - people seeking notoriety believe it's the best way to be noticed and remembered.
4) Present more stories about people defending themselves with firearms, put it in the heads of the bad guys that people are not meek sheep.
5) Turn 'gun-free zones' into 'gun-regulated' zones. Post a sign saying that authorized personnel and citizens are armed.



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 10:03 AM
link   
I've been saying this forever. Why argue something that isn't going to change? Not only the OP's reason, why do gun supporters also argue what's not going to change? For the sake of it? All of you should use your energy on something more productive. I've posited education as a good replacement for the gun arguments.



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 10:59 AM
link   

originally posted by: intrepid
I've been saying this forever. Why argue something that isn't going to change? Not only the OP's reason, why do gun supporters also argue what's not going to change? For the sake of it? All of you should use your energy on something more productive. I've posited education as a good replacement for the gun arguments.


Yes education not indoctrination is a key element needed to get back to the spirit of a constitutional republic as intended, including facing a reality that includes personal responsibility, risk, positives and negatives and not walk but run away from nanny statism and all its police state ways.

A dumbed down, drugged up, severely distracted, all about me people, are nothing but putty.

A massive Q-ball of a paradigm shift is on horizon so all this may change rather surprisingly and rapidly - seen by most as big pendulum swing.
edit on 2-6-2018 by Phoenix because: add comment



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 11:07 AM
link   


IDK exactly what it is other than to try to establish a foothold in the public mind that there are in fact "evil" guns or guns which don't belong in general society.


Yes that is part of it and it's logical. There is no reason to have them in society except for ego, and I personally think peoples' lives are far more important than conservative's desire to feel manly by having a deadly weapon.


edit on 2-6-2018 by CB328 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 11:31 AM
link   

originally posted by: CB328


IDK exactly what it is other than to try to establish a foothold in the public mind that there are in fact "evil" guns or guns which don't belong in general society.


Yes that is part of it and it's logical. There is no reason to have them in society except for ego, and I personally think peoples' lives are far more important than conservative's desire to feel manly by having a deadly weapon.



It has nothing to do with "feeling" whatever - just as second amendment has nothing whatsoever to do with hunting.

Its an abrogation of everyone's rights to limit the best tool for the job.




posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 11:53 AM
link   
a reply to: CB328

NASCAR as a sport is the direct result of moonshine runners tinkering with their cars. Target shooting and three gun competions (a form of target shooting) is a sport because people can own guns. While neither may be your cup of tea, it doesn’t mean they should be eliminated for those that enjoy them.

I don’t care for NASCAR and don’t participate. Street Racing is illegal and dangerous. Fans of the structure of the NASCAR points system and regulated modifications typically don’t advocate renegade styles of racing. Just as gun owners don’t advocate for public mass shootings. Why can’t you do the same? Why must all firearms or certain firearms be eliminated for your satisfaction?

The gun control issue has very little to do with guns to be honest, do they?



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 11:59 AM
link   
On the other side, republicans and especially the NRA stop any sort of talk about guns. I think some of you forget that it's all about money and buy into NRA talking points.



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 12:42 PM
link   

originally posted by: blueman12
On the other side, republicans and especially the NRA stop any sort of talk about guns. I think some of you forget that it's all about money and buy into NRA talking points.


I don’t want to talk about guns because I won’t negotiate my gun rights away. Talk about something else that will affect the prosperity of Americans and their families.

This absolutely is NOT about money it is about a non-negotiable right.



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 01:18 PM
link   
a reply to: CB328


Yes that is part of it and it's logical. There is no reason to have them in society except for ego, and I personally think peoples' lives are far more important than conservative's desire to feel manly by having a deadly weapon.

Well, talk about the OP being correct!

If I walk outside and see a rabid coon, what do you want me to do? Throw rocks at it, while it charges, bites, and infects me? If I walk outside and see a mountain lion staring hungrily at my wife, what do you want me to do? Reason with it while it eats her alive? If someone breaks into my home in the middle of the night, what do you want me to do? Run away naked and let them have the place?

This is exactly why the OP is so spot on: there can be no negotiation as long as people like you keep making inane and fantastical statements like that without even stopping for a moment to consider that the neural impulses spinning through your head might not reflect reality. I approached this thread with an open mind, and even tried to post meaningful concerns which could possibly be addressed. Now, however, thanks to you, I am firmly standing beside Metallicus: it's my damn right and get your hands off my guns! My life matters too, like it or not!

Way to derail any hope of reaching a reasonable position.


TheRedneck



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 01:25 PM
link   
a reply to: Justoneman

hey stop that is just common sense, we can't have that around here. isn't that the topic of the op?



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 01:30 PM
link   
a reply to: Allaroundyou

Really? Should we bring up the fact that up until the resent decades the go to gun was always an AK styled rifle, then as soon as the wars over seas became unpopular with the masses the AR was called is as the boogie weapon of the month?



posted on Jun, 2 2018 @ 03:11 PM
link   

originally posted by: Metallicus

originally posted by: blueman12
On the other side, republicans and especially the NRA stop any sort of talk about guns. I think some of you forget that it's all about money and buy into NRA talking points.


I don’t want to talk about guns because I won’t negotiate my gun rights away. Talk about something else that will affect the prosperity of Americans and their families.

This absolutely is NOT about money it is about a non-negotiable right.


Exactly. Its never the supposed compromise they call it or a trade. No one on the left is saying "oh well if you agree to universal background checks, we will vote for conceal carry reciprocity or removing suppressors from NFA". Its just one side whittling away at your rights. Its like going up to someone and asking them for a millions dollars and then after they refuse, you ask them for a thousand and call it a compromise.
When the english model is endgame, what incentive is there to compromise, when each compromise just moves you closer



new topics

top topics



 
36
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join