Canada to hit U.S. with retaliatory tariffs in response to Trump’s steel tariffs

a reply to: luthier

Ah, the usual left fear mongering.

Yawn.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

The greatest middle class, with the highest purchasing power in history was formed in the USA during the manufacturing boom of the mid 20th Century. I disagree with your opinions on the science of economics. History doesn't support your positions.

That's just it though. It's history. Societies evolve. Economies change as a result. The world changes. What worked then may not be feasible today.

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

The greatest middle class, with the highest purchasing power in history was formed in the USA during the manufacturing boom of the mid 20th Century. I disagree with your opinions on the science of economics. History doesn't support your positions.

Luhier's posts strikes of sheer desperation. The points made in rebuttal are obvious, yet he clings to his mantra. This Canada-U.S. issue will work out rather quickly.

The last time I can recall a significant spat between the U.S. and Canada was a personal dislike between JFK and Diefenbaker. Just before the Canadian election, I believe, '61 or 62', (the Canadian Dollar was traditionally about 10% or more stronger than the U.S. Dollar). The U.S. made a move that devalued the Canadian Dollar to about 92 cents to the U.S. Dollar.

A fake, 'dDefenbaker Dollar was printed and distributed around Canada called the 'Diefenbaker Buck'. It showed 0.92 cents as it's denomination.

Diefenbaker lost that election........

JFK was also a brilliant man. So there is that.

Your posts wreak of blind idolatry.

originally posted by: intrepid

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

The greatest middle class, with the highest purchasing power in history was formed in the USA during the manufacturing boom of the mid 20th Century. I disagree with your opinions on the science of economics. History doesn't support your positions.

That's just it though. It's history. Societies evolve. Economies change as a result. The world changes. What worked then may not be feasible today.

Ding ding ding.

Manufacture today is done with automation. It would literally limit the number of jobs to move into a manufacturing based economy.

But surely people know this. They are just hoping for the glory days when you pull a lever and pull out a part thousands of times a day.

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: luthier

Ah, the usual left fear mongering.

Yawn.

Taxes areally a left policy. Countries with high tariffs are socialist democracies with high taxes.

a reply to: luthier

Commodities have changed as well. When something became popular they ended up lower priced and companies put more money into it to milk it while it lasted. More jobs. And the person working would have an ownership in his job out of self interest. The better we do the better I do. Today the price the # out of things and have them made, well, you know how that worked out. I'd like to know the % of people that have that type of attitude today.

originally posted by: intrepid
a reply to: luthier

Commodities have changed as well. When something became popular they ended up lower priced and companies put more money into it to milk it while it lasted. More jobs. And the person working would have an ownership in his job out of self interest. The better we do the better I do. Today the price the # out of things and have them made, well, you know how that worked out. I'd like to know the % of people that have that type of attitude today.

I am a libertarian when it comes to trade. The best model is the market itself can react and correct faster than politics with other motives. Usually cronyism. I am not a zealot and full on mises but generally speaking that is the best approach and has been proven so by time.

Tariffs are like any other intervention. They make things less efficient, have less freedom of choice, and less competition.

Now if he wins the war we have a tiny net gain. Cnc programmers get more work and we losee net jobs because manufacturing isn't about one person or a machinist anymore. Factories only need a few machinists. They need a few programmers, etc. They are not a man at every machine with skilled training in machining. Those days are done. Unless you live in the third world.

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: intrepid

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

The greatest middle class, with the highest purchasing power in history was formed in the USA during the manufacturing boom of the mid 20th Century. I disagree with your opinions on the science of economics. History doesn't support your positions.

That's just it though. It's history. Societies evolve. Economies change as a result. The world changes. What worked then may not be feasible today.

Ding ding ding.

Manufacture today is done with automation. It would literally limit the number of jobs to move into a manufacturing based economy.

But surely people know this. They are just hoping for the glory days when you pull a lever and pull out a part thousands of times a day.

Wait, wait, wait... more dichotomous bunkum from you. First you claimed that the model didn't work in the 50s, now you're agreeing with someone who says "what worked in the 50s may not work today." Which is it? Never mind, question was rhetorical... we both know which it is: it's spitballing. You dislike the plan, you dislike the people behind the plan, therefore any argument against the plan will be supported by you. You rail against tribalism, yet I am left to wonder if you lack mirrors in your home.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: intrepid

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

The greatest middle class, with the highest purchasing power in history was formed in the USA during the manufacturing boom of the mid 20th Century. I disagree with your opinions on the science of economics. History doesn't support your positions.

That's just it though. It's history. Societies evolve. Economies change as a result. The world changes. What worked then may not be feasible today.

Ding ding ding.

Manufacture today is done with automation. It would literally limit the number of jobs to move into a manufacturing based economy.

But surely people know this. They are just hoping for the glory days when you pull a lever and pull out a part thousands of times a day.

Wait, wait, wait... more dichotomous bunkum from you. First you claimed that the model didn't work in the 50s, now you're agreeing with someone who says "what worked in the 50s may not work today." Which is it? Never mind, question was rhetorical... we both know which it is: it's spitballing. You dislike the plan, you dislike the people behind the plan, therefore any argument against the plan will be supported by you. You rail against tribalism, yet I am left to wonder if you lack mirrors in your home.

Try ro keep up. I said the model of the 50'same doesn't work today. I have reasons why it worked then.

Let this sink in chief.

The national average salary for a Factory Worker is $27,310 in United States. Filter by location to see Factory Worker salaries in your area. Salary estimates are based on 1,782 salaries submitted anonymously to Glassdoor by Factory Worker employees.

a reply to: xuenchen

They turned off Niagara falls.

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

The greatest middle class, with the highest purchasing power in history was formed in the USA during the manufacturing boom of the mid 20th Century. I disagree with your opinions on the science of economics. History doesn't support your positions.

Luhier's posts strikes of sheer desperation. The points made in rebuttal are obvious, yet he clings to his mantra. This Canada-U.S. issue will work out rather quickly.

The last time I can recall a significant spat between the U.S. and Canada was a personal dislike between JFK and Diefenbaker. Just before the Canadian election, I believe, '61 or 62', (the Canadian Dollar was traditionally about 10% or more stronger than the U.S. Dollar). The U.S. made a move that devalued the Canadian Dollar to about 92 cents to the U.S. Dollar.

A fake, 'dDefenbaker Dollar was printed and distributed around Canada called the 'Diefenbaker Buck'. It showed 0.92 cents as it's denomination.

Diefenbaker lost that election........

JFK was also a brilliant man. So there is that.

Your posts wreak of blind idolatry.

My posts are for the American workers. Yes, low unemployment now. Largely the service industry or entry level jobs. Be content with that, you imply with your jsutification of those numbers. I would see at least a partial return to a thriving middle class and a return of potential upward mobility for those that desire it.

Not your status quo mentality. Yes there are risks. We will and are taking them, irregardles of your fear mantra.

We will win this.In spite of you and your ilk. I'm done with this.

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: xuenchen

They turned off Niagara falls.

Not likely. That moneymaker alone could solve this dispute.

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: intrepid

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

The greatest middle class, with the highest purchasing power in history was formed in the USA during the manufacturing boom of the mid 20th Century. I disagree with your opinions on the science of economics. History doesn't support your positions.

That's just it though. It's history. Societies evolve. Economies change as a result. The world changes. What worked then may not be feasible today.

Ding ding ding.

Manufacture today is done with automation. It would literally limit the number of jobs to move into a manufacturing based economy.

But surely people know this. They are just hoping for the glory days when you pull a lever and pull out a part thousands of times a day.

Wait, wait, wait... more dichotomous bunkum from you. First you claimed that the model didn't work in the 50s, now you're agreeing with someone who says "what worked in the 50s may not work today." Which is it? Never mind, question was rhetorical... we both know which it is: it's spitballing. You dislike the plan, you dislike the people behind the plan, therefore any argument against the plan will be supported by you. You rail against tribalism, yet I am left to wonder if you lack mirrors in your home.

Try ro keep up. I said the model of the 50'same doesn't work today. I have reasons why it worked then.

Let this sink in chief.

The national average salary for a Factory Worker is $27,310 in United States. Filter by location to see Factory Worker salaries in your area. Salary estimates are based on 1,782 salaries submitted anonymously to Glassdoor by Factory Worker employees.

The GDP increases with higher wages, wages increase with demand, demand for domestically manufactured goods increase with import tariffs, import tariffs increase with conservative national protection policies. Try to catch up, water gatherer.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: intrepid

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

The greatest middle class, with the highest purchasing power in history was formed in the USA during the manufacturing boom of the mid 20th Century. I disagree with your opinions on the science of economics. History doesn't support your positions.

That's just it though. It's history. Societies evolve. Economies change as a result. The world changes. What worked then may not be feasible today.

Ding ding ding.

Manufacture today is done with automation. It would literally limit the number of jobs to move into a manufacturing based economy.

But surely people know this. They are just hoping for the glory days when you pull a lever and pull out a part thousands of times a day.

Wait, wait, wait... more dichotomous bunkum from you. First you claimed that the model didn't work in the 50s, now you're agreeing with someone who says "what worked in the 50s may not work today." Which is it? Never mind, question was rhetorical... we both know which it is: it's spitballing. You dislike the plan, you dislike the people behind the plan, therefore any argument against the plan will be supported by you. You rail against tribalism, yet I am left to wonder if you lack mirrors in your home.

Try ro keep up. I said the model of the 50'same doesn't work today. I have reasons why it worked then.

Let this sink in chief.

The national average salary for a Factory Worker is $27,310 in United States. Filter by location to see Factory Worker salaries in your area. Salary estimates are based on 1,782 salaries submitted anonymously to Glassdoor by Factory Worker employees.

The GDP increases with higher wages, wages increase with demand, demand for domestically manufactured goods increase with import tariffs, import tariffs increase with conservative national protection policies. Try to catch up, water gatherer.

Lol. No. Not even close.

You want to artificially raise wages which increase prices. Same exact problem as raising minus wage quickly. Deflation and inflation are both dangerous. But hey you got the simpleton guide to economics.

a reply to: luthier

Wow, you disagree with the backbone of all modern economic theory: supply and demand. Good job being rebellious against proven science.

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

Wow, you disagree with the backbone of all modern economic theory: supply and demand. Good job being rebellious against proven science.

That isn't what tariffs do but nice strawman

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

Wow, you disagree with the backbone of all modern economic theory: supply and demand. Good job being rebellious against proven science.

That isn't what tariffs do but nice strawman

Tariffs work within the structure of supply and demand, so no, not a strawman. Tariffs work because demand is high (which it certainly is) and the tariffs on imported goods reduce the supply, which results in domestic businesses coming in to increase supply thanks to robust demand. This, in turn, results in a demand for more workers within what is essentially a steady-state supply (not precisely, but damn close when viewed in the short game, year-to-year worker pools). When demand increases in a system displaying a finite supply, prices go up... in the case of labor, that equals higher wages to woo workers into areas where demand exists. This has an overall positive effect on the nation's economy PLUS it equals more dollars remaining within America, which is excellent for the domestic side of the economy. The only losers are the multinationals, foreign manufacturers, and global investors who, frankly, can diversify or go pound sand because they're not the backbone of the main street economy in any way.

The difference between what I'm pushing and what you're pushing is real growth versus growth on paper. So tell me, how long have you been a hedge fund investor?

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: luthier

Wow, you disagree with the backbone of all modern economic theory: supply and demand. Good job being rebellious against proven science.

That isn't what tariffs do but nice strawman

Tariffs work within the structure of supply and demand, so no, not a strawman. Tariffs work because demand is high (which it certainly is) and the tariffs on imported goods reduce the supply, which results in domestic businesses coming in to increase supply thanks to robust demand. This, in turn, results in a demand for more workers within what is essentially a steady-state supply (not precisely, but damn close when viewed in the short game, year-to-year worker pools). When demand increases in a system displaying a finite supply, prices go up... in the case of labor, that equals higher wages to woo workers into areas where demand exists. This has an overall positive effect on the nation's economy PLUS it equals more dollars remaining within America, which is excellent for the domestic side of the economy. The only losers are the multinationals, foreign manufacturers, and global investors who, frankly, can diversify or go pound sand because they're not the backbone of the main street economy in any way.

The difference between what I'm pushing and what you're pushing is real growth versus growth on paper. So tell me, how long have you been a hedge fund investor?

I make guitars and teach martial arts. My wife is a research scientist. We do just fine.

You have no idea how supply chains work, how long they take to reorganize or if that is possible..

How long have you been a commie?

Free trade is always better.

originally posted by: luthier
How long have you been a commie?

Oh thank you for that laugh. It felt good on a long Friday morning...

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck

originally posted by: UnBreakable
Oh no, I'll have to pay more for my pancake syrup and that carbonated urine Molson. Damn that Casper Milquetoast Justin Trudeau.

Something that has not been mentioned here is the cost of all these shenanigans to the American tourist industry. I noticed that New York's Finger Lakes region had a 4-page spread in the Toronto Star this past weekend. I'm guessing that they are hurting because a lot of Canadians who normally headed south for their vacations are choosing to spend their tourist bux elsewhere. I was talking to a friend the other day who had chosen a Rhine River cruise because she has she has vowed not to spend any money on U.S. visits until Trump is gone. Another spent a month in a DR resort rather than their normal Florida winter rental for the same reason. America used to be a friendly place. Now, not so much. Sure...piss off Canadians...but it's not just the government who retaliates.

Your right. It's not just the government that retaliates. Guess what? That's a two way street. So go ahead, Mr Trudeau supporter, piss off Americans....

You're going to cancel your annual trip?
I know we're going to do a quick drive-through instead of sticking around this summer.