Ireland Votes To Repeal Abortion Amendment In Landslide Referendum

This is a good thing! I am not pro abortion but I am pro choice. Abortion being illegal does NOT mean there are less abortions. There won't be more abortions because of this. There simply is no downside to the vote.

I ignored the other thread about this but thought I'd add my 2 cents in this one.



Years from now a survey vessel will find microbial organisms on the planet Mars.


The headlines will scream, "LIFE! LIFE has been discovered!"

But here on earth? A developing human person?


Not so much.

a reply to: DBCowboy

A fetus isn't a sentient life.

originally posted by: RowanBean
a reply to: DBCowboy

A fetus isn't a sentient life.

Cognitum Ergo Sum?

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: RowanBean
a reply to: DBCowboy

A fetus isn't a sentient life.

Cognitum Ergo Sum?

If a bacteria on Mars says that I'd freak out for real.

originally posted by: Metallicus
People who are for abortion were in fact born because their mothers ‘chose’ life. An irony that is lost on most of the baby killers.

Exactly. I love the excuses....but but but, I am too old to have kids .... I dont have enough money ... I just can't seem to take personal responsibility for my actions...

I am 8 years behind my other siblings. I was a mistake. I thank reality every single day that my parents weren't 'progressive' and 'woke'. I thank reality every single day that I wasn't considered a 'non life form' and sucked out with a vacuum cleaner.

Then there are those that say 'don't get down on those that made these piss poor decisions', 'they pay every single day in guilt from their self chosen actions'. Doesn't the overriding guilt tell you something? Why are you still encouraging others to go down the same path when you know the consequences?

a reply to: DBCowboy

We consider ants "life" and have no qualms about exterminating them.

originally posted by: Atsbhct
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

The majority of abortions consist of a mass of cells.

Where are the people crying about spontaneous miscarriages. Why do you all care so much what a woman does with her body?

Maybe intent here is the key. Even a miscarriage carries a certain amount of guilt, which I have seen amplified to the extreme when it goes from non intentional to willful killing.

Does it matter if that 'mass of cells' will develop into an individual life form?

Maybe the key to people's opinions will be whether they believe in the soul. Maybe when a person thinks the body and spirit are nothing but electrical signals that completely end once a person dies, there isn't anything wrong with killing a 'mass of cells'.

What if everyone's actions build this reality? What if there is a morphic resonance that shapes human development and we are all tied in together some how.

Why is it that if a woman is murdered while pregnant, it is considered double homicide regardless of the fetal development period? But if a woman willing chooses to murder their unborn child, 'you go girl'?

This isn't even religion talking, this is just common sense.

a reply to: ClovenSky

Because it's HER BODY.

originally posted by: RowanBean
a reply to: DBCowboy

A fetus isn't a sentient life.

So when is it life? when the hands and feet are moving... when the kid smiles on an ultra sound... or only once its born?

I am curious what you think, for years I approached this topic with the same words of Admiral Stockdale, what a woman does with her own body is her own D@#$ business...but since I have watched my son develop seen the movements, the smile on his 20 week ultrasound, heard the heart beat.

I honestly don't feel I can continue to have that stance... *shrugs* so enlighten me when does the fetus become a living being?

a reply to: Atsbhct

Once that egg is fertilized, it is no longer just 'her' body. Kind of simple.

What if the actual act of fertilization is a soul choosing that host to become theirs?

a reply to: ClovenSky

Yes it is. It's part of her body that she's growing. It's none of anyones business. They arent going to extract it and grow it and lovingly raise it.

a reply to: Irishhaf

I really have no idea but I would go with what scientists say. Personally I am pretty neutral when it comes to abortion but what I do know is that I have no right to dictate what women do with their bodies.

originally posted by: Atsbhct
a reply to: ClovenSky

Yes it is. It's part of her body that she's growing. It's none of anyones business. They arent going to extract it and grow it and lovingly raise it.

How sure are you of that? You would have to be 100% sure of that comment, because if you weren't, why wouldn't you choose the side of caution?

But but but .... sex .... i mean, come on .... sex ... how could anyone live without SEX. Isn't it sad that we still think sex is the only way to experience the spiritual between two life entities? The spiritual feeling itself is the prize and the only way for people to get even a taste of that energy is to get as close as possible to the centers of chi.....bumping uglies.

It is too bad that people don't understand the power of spirituality and the best orgasms to be had are those between two people resonating their energies back and forth, without ever going below the belt.

Keep on telling yourself the other 'theories' though. Maybe in another 1000 iterations, you might be able to convince yourself that it is just a 'mass of cells'.

I still can't understand why you would bring such potential karma upon yourself by singing that tired old story.

a reply to: ClovenSky

Religion is hands down the WORST way to convince people to not have abortions.

a reply to: Atsbhct

Good thing I have never used religion to approach this subject as I am an agnostic.

Common sense will tell you more strongly, compared to any religion, that this is wrong.

But hey, your body right? Just in case we are all tied into this reality together, I will continue down my path trying to get people to just think a little bit before they make this decision that there is no turning back from. I am selfish and wish to live in the best world possible.

Have fun with the consequences of believing it is just 'your body'. As you said, it is completely your choice and no one else. It is good that you accept the full self responsibility of your actions. I have a feeling one day, information will be freely available on how this reality works. But by that time...... ?

a reply to: ClovenSky

Oh, I'm sorry..."spirituality".

originally posted by: ClovenSky
a reply to: Atsbhct

Good thing I have never used religion to approach this subject as I am an agnostic.

Common sense will tell you more strongly, compared to any religion, that this is wrong.

But hey, your body right? Just in case we are all tied into this reality together, I will continue down my path trying to get people to just think a little bit before they make this decision that there is no turning back from. I am selfish and wish to live in the best world possible.

Have fun with the consequences of believing it is just 'your body'. As you said, it is completely your choice and no one else. It is good that you accept the full self responsibility of your actions. I have a feeling one day, information will be freely available on how this reality works. But by that time...... ?

As an atheist - - I really do not understand agnostic as a stand alone.

No one knows. Everyone is agnostic. Either agnostic atheist or agnostic believer. Agnostic is just the default position of I Don't Know.

Anyway, YES! My body. And I have made that decision. The consequences? I was able to give a better life to my 2 LIVING CHILDREN.

a reply to: Annee

No problem. It is certainly your body. I just question. That is all. Is it wrong to question?

As for definitions of beliefs, I really wish ATS had some type of wiki where certain views could be clarified.

We will never be able to even have a worthwhile discussion of beliefs because the terms people choose are all over the board. When you can't even agree with the terms, the following conversation is almost rendered useless.

For me:

Atheist = no god. nothing beyond the veil. We are just a materialistic form of cells that are animated through electric signals. Once our life form ceases to function ... nothing. No soul, no afterlife ... just nothing.

Religious = there is god and a afterlife, thus there is a soul or something that continues after this life end that is individual and personal ... the ego

agnostic = who knows. knowing isn't possible because of the veil between this reality and the next.

If we could but simplify and clarify it would be much easier.

Added:
Good for you and those 2 wonderful children. I hope you never have to meet the one unfortunate soul that is waiting for you on the other side that will simply ask 'why'?

a reply to: ClovenSky

Added: 
Good for you and those 2 wonderful children. I hope you never have to meet the one unfortunate soul that is waiting for you on the other side that will simply ask 'why'? 

So you believe in "karma", but think this "soul" will just be waiting around until Annees soul sees it in the nothingness so it can question her and guilt her?
If anything, a karmic individual will have moved on. If it ever asked Annee why, and she said, to support my living children, it might think her wise and prefer the other life it was given.
So presumptuous and conceited to think a "soul" would be so worried that another soul decided they weren't compatible.