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School Shooting Indiana Middle School One Dead So Far

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posted on May, 25 2018 @ 01:48 PM
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a reply to: luthier

Oh i see it now, you are perfectly right!
I must have been temporarily completely
blind.

Carry on please?




posted on May, 25 2018 @ 01:51 PM
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a reply to: Edumakated
Just like the insane challenges and the suicide pacts.

I was so very pleased to see that the last two local suicide pact events were not even mentioned on TV. I am hoping that the young people will get the message that they will not get their 15 minutes of fame postmortem.

This obsession with social media and the obsession for likes, clicks, whatever method of validation that is presently the "in thing", is troubling.

Black Mirror's "Nose Dive" came so close to getting it all the way right.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 01:53 PM
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originally posted by: Edumakated
It isn't one single thing, but notice how the school shootings seem to increase the more the media started covering it as an issue since Columbine.

School shootings are infinitesimally rare. However, one cannot ignore that media coverage might give that rare nut job a motivation to do it for the attention it garners. Schools are also woefully soft targets.

I know libs don't like it, but there is a reason these shootings don't happen in banks, police stations, and other places with high security.

Have to agree here. A kid that is bullied feels marginalized. They may often be told to suck it up. Boys will be boys after all. Schools do jack to deal with bullying despite all the hand waving and liberal feel good "anti-bullying" sentiment bandied about.

The media makes stars of these shooters. What does that do to someone that feels marginalized? It's their moment to feel powerful. Their time to feel like they're someone who finally matters and is seen by others. Even though this attention is horrible and negative, the effect is the same in the end. They go out with a blaze of glory and take their "enemies" down with them.

Anyone who can't see this isn't looking hard enough. There isn't a person out there who can't get their moment of fame in the media. All it takes is something sensational enough to get the media's attention. What better way than to air your grievances in a spectacular manner. People will listen then when all they did before was turn away or pump these kids with anti-depressants or worse.

Still, I'm firmly of the belief that many of these kids are pushed into this by outside forces. How many of the most deadly acts of violence in the US have been committed by people who had links to the CIA and MKUltra?

James Holmes - Aurora theatre shooting. Holmes was one of six recipients of a National Institutes of Health Neuroscience Training Grant at the University of Colorado Anschutz and has had a number of links to U.S. government-funded research centers. Holmes's past association with government research projects has prompted police and federal law enforcement officials to order laboratories and schools with which Holmes has had a past association not to talk to the press about Holmes.

Unibomber Ted Kaczynski - voluntarily took part in mind control experiments at Berkely

Timothy McVeigh - OKC bombing - Was involved in highly classified projects in the military that to this day have never been revealed. People around him noticed changes in his demeanor. He became distant and uncommunicative.

Stephen Paddock - Las Vegas mass shooter - had ties to the military and the CIA if links are to be believed.

How many of these school shooters are sleepers of some sort? They're the perfect vehicle target. Bullied, depressed, marginalized, outsiders.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 02:02 PM
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We took God out of schools and now act shocked when the system flies off the rails.
Say what you want about crusades and so called bigotry, religion is our best tool to instill a sense of right and wrong, good and evil, moral and immoral in youth. But we took it for granted and said we didn't need it, we believeed we could teach right and wrong with out a belief in something bigger than ourselves, and now that self ego has taken hold, our only solution we can come up with is to remove liberties.
René Descartes nailed it centuries ago, and yet further into this brave new world we go.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 02:08 PM
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a reply to: GenerationGap

They put God in schools and governments in the Middle East and Africa and we act shocked when their system flies off the rails.
Just giving you a different perception.




posted on May, 25 2018 @ 03:07 PM
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originally posted by: GenerationGap
We took God out of schools and now act shocked when the system flies off the rails.
Say what you want about crusades and so called bigotry, religion is our best tool to instill a sense of right and wrong, good and evil, moral and immoral in youth. But we took it for granted and said we didn't need it, we believeed we could teach right and wrong with out a belief in something bigger than ourselves, and now that self ego has taken hold, our only solution we can come up with is to remove liberties.
René Descartes nailed it centuries ago, and yet further into this brave new world we go.


There is no proof of this. Violence is on the decline.

We don't need religion. There is no proof we were better off. Vermont is doing fine. Why? They have strong community and good parenting.

Religion is not a necessary construct and has led to Violence, manipulation, and enslavement.

The biggest problem is resilience and how easy everything is compared to when people struggled. Ironically those before us worked hard and sacrificed so we didn't have to..

Religion is not a failsafe and there is no evidence it is.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 03:30 PM
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a reply to: luthier




There is no proof of this. Violence is on the decline


You mean since this morning?




We don't need religion. There is no proof we were better off. Vermont is doing fine. Why? They have strong community and good parenting


Are you looking for answers or proof?




Religion is not a failsafe and there is no evidence it is


Don't need evidence we need answers.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 03:35 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: luthier




There is no proof of this. Violence is on the decline


You mean since this morning?




We don't need religion. There is no proof we were better off. Vermont is doing fine. Why? They have strong community and good parenting


Are you looking for answers or proof?




Religion is not a failsafe and there is no evidence it is


Don't need evidence we need answers.


Violence is on the decline as a whole.

I do my part..I am a USA wrestling coach. I teach valuable tangible lessons. I also teach judo.

Therefor everyone should learn wrestling and judo because they work to make people better and more resilent.

Or no there are literally thousands of waus to teach people ethics and morality.

Many that don't require faith as well. They use logic.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 03:37 PM
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First of all its time to quit using our past school experiences as a baseline, I know cause I've done it with my kids, it's a different time and its going to take solutions tailored for whats happening now.

The pressures on a kid being bullied don't end at the end of the school day anymore. You see this with the kids boys and girls killing themselves over being harassed at school and it being continued through social media. Hell even if you are targeted and ignore it, there are usually going to be a classmate there to bring it up to remind them. These school shooters are just an offshoot of that alienation process these kids go through. All it takes is for it to hit that individuals breaking point.

Just look back at all the times that you thought were a big deal in high school, now they seem so trivial. It takes a very attentive parent to not dismiss whats going on in a kids life that might be torturing the kid on the insides. Thats even if they let you in on it. Lots of times a kid might have a good relationship with their parents, the kid might think they are great and really just not want them to worry or burden them with their problems. It's all a very complex and there are multi faceted reasons one person snaps and the other one doesn't. A parent sends their kid off to school thinking its a relatively safe environment and sometimes for some individuals its just a pressure cooker. Until you have a way to relieve identify that pressure it will build up to critical mass. Everybody matures or learns coping skills at a different rate, some kids act out some kids hold it in till they explode. Schools have got so regimented with testing and limiting recesses there is no escaping for a kid thats struggling for what ever reason.

Not sure how to even address this part of the problem, but gun bans doesn't nor does perimeter fences and metal detectors. I do think a increased off duty police presence might help and even better more monitoring adults through out the school, having someone keeping the BS in between classes and lunch breaks to minimum. Hell it could be unpaid interns that need points for college credits maybe, just another set of eyes and ears to be on the look out for the harassing and bullying.

The private vs public school comparisons bring up issues, that would have scoffed at when I was a teenager. Among them school uniforms, in these hyper sensitive hyper critical times might be time to dress them the same this would eliminate the teasing or comments on what an individual is wearing and the pre judging in brings. Just have 1-3 variations and maybe a casual day once a month. Adults have these restrictions in most of todays work environments not going to hurt having it in school.

Lets face it schools in addition to learning were supposed to be places where kids were be able to learn social skills, team work etc. etc. If there is one thats pushed over the top, there are probably a few more on the brink that need help too. Certainly a trained individual or 3 or 4 on campus should be able to identify some of these students and reach out out to them and let them know they aren't alone and somebody is watching out for them. Or maybe going to a 4 day week with the 5th day an online, home assignment day where the student has to logon and complete timed questions or studies.

Definitely think its time for there to be let certain schools or districts to try different out of the box ideas and see if it has a negative effect on learning or is something that can be implemented elsewhere. I'm reminded of the school district that began bringing local produce for lunches and it was supposedly very successful. Doing the same old same old isn't working.
edit on 25-5-2018 by putnam6 because: wording



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 03:55 PM
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a reply to: luthier




Therefor everyone should learn wrestling and judo because they work to make people better and more resilent.


You know if you stopped teaching wrestling
and judo and there was a massive spike in
violence not long after you ceased?
I would be thinking your wrestling and
judo lessons might well have been a
good thing. Even if I liked jeet kun do much
more. Priorities



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 04:15 PM
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originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: Butterfinger

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: randyvs

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: randyvs

Was that when hanging women for witch craft, marital rape, owning slaves, hanging blacks was all happening?


Our founders literally based the constitution on two treaties of government by John Locke.


Anything for the topic?


Yes your weak theory of causation makes no sense. Progressive education began at the turn of the century (late 1800's)

Morality and ethics don't need religion.

In fact religion gave people the belief to do immoral acts because God said it was OK.


Atheism does the same thing; with no God there really is nothing stopping you from doing anything besides some secular law about not killing people.



That isn't true. There is the social contract which is what our nation was based on.

There is the categorical imperative. There is philosophy and ethics.

God also yells people to kill the other people.

Atheism isn't a moral code. That comes from philosophy.


Come now...

What is the basis of secular morals? An arbitrary agreement that can be broken at any time because: Human=Animal.

As any atheist knows, every religion is false, and therefore is only a fancy social contract.

A social contract is only worth the paper its printed on, or just a meme in our collective reality we entertain, for now.


edit on 5252018 by Butterfinger because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 04:19 PM
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originally posted by: Butterfinger

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: Butterfinger

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: randyvs

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: randyvs

Was that when hanging women for witch craft, marital rape, owning slaves, hanging blacks was all happening?


Our founders literally based the constitution on two treaties of government by John Locke.


Anything for the topic?


Yes your weak theory of causation makes no sense. Progressive education began at the turn of the century (late 1800's)

Morality and ethics don't need religion.

In fact religion gave people the belief to do immoral acts because God said it was OK.


Atheism does the same thing; with no God there really is nothing stopping you from doing anything besides some secular law about not killing people.



That isn't true. There is the social contract which is what our nation was based on.

There is the categorical imperative. There is philosophy and ethics.

God also yells people to kill the other people.

Atheism isn't a moral code. That comes from philosophy.


Come now...

What is the basis of secular morals? An arbitrary agreement that can be broken at any time because: Human=Animal.

As any atheist knows, every religion is false, and therefore is only a fancy social contract.

A social contract is only worth the paper its printed on, or just a meme in our collective reality we entertain, for now.



This is true of anyone. Look at the middle east, famine etc. When we are stressed beyond hunger most people don't follow religion. They return to a state of nature.

God tells you its OK to kill theme. They are not us.

The social contract is the only thing that holds society together. And always has whether or not it was cosciously created.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 04:21 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: luthier




Therefor everyone should learn wrestling and judo because they work to make people better and more resilent.


You know if you stopped teaching wrestling
and judo and there was a massive spike in
violence not long after you ceased?
I would be thinking your wrestling and
judo lessons might well have been a
good thing. Even if I liked jeet kun do much
more. Priorities


I was being sarcastic. Jeet Kwon doe doesn't have competitions.

Just explaining there are lots of lessons out there that aren't all about God told you so you better listen.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 04:33 PM
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originally posted by: TinySickTears


I think it has to do with meds 100% . No one was mentally ill before everyone got on meds




I think they started out with some level of autism, and as part of Bush's no child left behind program you have people with behavioral/mental issue dumped into main stream school. The autism made them strange to others while preventing them some dealing with normal social interactions and all this ends up as a mass shooter in the end.

And of course drugs are always a part of this so that is just icing on the cake.


edit on 25-5-2018 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 04:35 PM
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originally posted by: vinifalou

It's almost daily now, huh?

How do you guys still take your kids to school?

Just saw on twitter that there are at least 4 shot and 1 suspect in custody.


How do you ever drive or get in a car with 80,000 injuries and 115 deaths per day?



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 04:35 PM
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a reply to: luthier




Just explaining there are lots of lessons out there that aren't all about God told you so you better listen


Irrelevant.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 04:48 PM
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Did they hide all of the shooters social media pics before we could see them?

I want to see what weird symbols he was sporting.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 06:48 PM
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originally posted by: Jefferton

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: Jefferton
People grasp on to anything for an excuse.

Guns. Media. Hollywood. Video games. Religion.

Murder pre-dates all of them.

Enjoy the show.



so the level of school shootings has remained constant over the years? Kids are the same as they have always been?

I have no idea. I do find it interesting that we are both in the "guns aren't the problem" crowd, yet you are squaring off with me as an opponent. I can't imagine why.

Enioy your blessed Country. I'm off to go outside, where I can go safely.



Don't you mean the safety of avoiding that very question you asked first? ( as I type this outside in complete safety in the U.S.)



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 06:54 PM
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originally posted by: underwerks

originally posted by: toms54

originally posted by: TinySickTears




I think it has to do with meds 100% . No one was mentally ill before everyone got on meds


Pretty stupid statement


These SSRI drugs are very popular. Most people never have a problem with them. Consider that depression is not one simple disease but a collection of disorders that present similar symptoms. This is why there are so many different antidepressants. No single drug works for everyone. A psychiatrist often must try several different drugs before they get one that works. As for a GP, who knows if they even know much about them at all.

Now we know that in a certain subset of young people, the SSRI drugs actually exacerbate the depression and makes them more likely to commit suicide. It seems difficult to diagnose this beforehand so the doctor must either observe them closely or avoid giving this drug to them. What if there is a group that tends to kill others rather than commit suicide? The drug could activate this tendency like it does with the suicidal patient.

The fault really lies in the lack of ability to provide a precise diagnosis. These mass murders are such a severe side effect that maybe they should ease off these drugs until they can use them properly.

I believe drugs that act on the serotonin system are not the right drugs to use as anti-depressants. Psychopharmacology has been a hobby of mine for while, studying and reading everything I can about the brain and the way drugs interact with it.

The elephant in the room is dopamine. But thanks to the ingrained moral panic (for lack of a better word) for any substance that directly acts on dopamine receptors we are stuck with SSRI’s. And it isn’t a coincidence that the only useful SSRI’s are the ones that indirectly affect dopamine regulation.

God forbid we give people drugs that actually work and take away depression. We can’t have anything tickling those dopamine receptors directly, because drugs that make you feel good are bad, so just use these SSRI’s with a range of other side effects that really only work because they indirectly effect dopamine receptors..

I want to bang my head into the table sometimes when I realize how oblivious most of the medical community is to what is happening right in front of us.


I've also had an interest in psychopharmacology. I studied it in college then worked in a lab for a couple of years. That was years ago, I'm retired now. One big advantage for me was that my second wife was batshi# crazy and I got to speak to her psychiatrists on a regular basis. I still try to keep up on new developments. Maybe we will end up in a future thread where this isn't so off topic.



posted on May, 25 2018 @ 07:22 PM
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originally posted by: conspiracy nut
a reply to: network dude

You guys always come up with these stupid comparisons. when you go on a plane or go in the ocean there is some danger involved there shouldn't be any danger involved from going to school.


Glad you feel that way. It's significantly less. I'm not downplaying the issue at all, but to try to frighten people of public schools, well, it just doesn't need to be done. Perspective is key.



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