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Trump has exposed Democratic hypocrisy on prison reform

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posted on May, 24 2018 @ 11:41 AM
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originally posted by: karmicecstasy
As soon as I read that Meek Mills was not attending the prison reform summit because Jay Z called him and told him the optics would be bad if he went. I knew that certain factions on the left were gonna go into overdrive and double down on more nonsense.

Prison reform is needed. Who cares whose name is behind the effort. Or if there is a little D or R next to their name. All that matter is that the reform starts to happen. But you know the optics are bad so lets shoot ourselves in the foot.


That example was a clear example of how politically ignorant the black community is... we vote 95% for Democrats and get nothing in return. When questioned about this most will say because Republicans don't do anything for us.

My response is of course they don't do anything for you. You don't vote for them! Why should they care...

Then a Republican comes along and shows an interest in something that is important to the black community. Instead of saying, lets sit down and come up with some solutions.... they go run crying about racism or telling people not to go! Now at the end of the term, they will say Republicans don't do anything for us!




posted on May, 24 2018 @ 11:44 AM
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Here's your reform. Is this a good idea?

Trump Sets Private Prisons Free



www.globalresearch.ca...


www.newyorker.com...


edit on 24-5-2018 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 11:58 AM
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a reply to: nwtrucker


No, I'm not against rehabilitation programs in prisons, but I think that there are already such programs, as well as work programs, in place. But, I am happy to see that the bill is addressing the policy shackling pregnant women in labor to their beds, and access to tampons and sanitary napkins.

What does this administration have against sentencing reform?


Thu February 15, 2018

Senators of both parties on Thursday moved forward their long-odds legislation to enact some degree of reform for the federal criminal justice system.

By a vote of 16-5, and amid protests from some senators that the bill would likely face hurdles too high to pass, the Senate Judiciary Committee backed the Sentencing Reform and Corrections Act, a package to reduce some of the strictest federal sentencing rules along with reforms for the federal prison system.
Ahead of the vote, Chairman Chuck Grassley expressed anger with Attorney General Jeff Sessions, who he called a friend, for coming out against the bill.



Cornyn and Democratic Sen. Sheldon Whitehouse of Rhode Island expressed skepticism a week before the committee markup that the comprehensive package would make it into law, given Sessions' express opposition.
Democratic Sen. Patrick Leahy of Vermont said Sessions' opposition "can't be excuse for inaction," and GOP Sen. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina said that of the two major components, "I don't see how you do one without the other."
"I am for prison reform, but I am also for reform of why people stay in jail so long," Graham said.
www.cnn.com...


Why don't they just include Sentencing Reform and Corrections Act with this prison reform act, and make everyone happy?


S. 1917: Sentencing Reform and Corrections Act of 2017:
A committee has voted to issue a report to the full chamber recommending that the bill be considered further
www.govtrack.us...



edit on 24-5-2018 by Sookiechacha because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 12:06 PM
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a reply to: Sookiechacha



Why don't they just include Sentencing Reform and Corrections Act with this prison reform act, and make everyone happy?


Because politics. It makes it very easy to get people worked-up with propaganda, such as what was used in the OP.

That outrage is good for creating narratives and agenda. That outrage is good for votes on election day.



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 12:08 PM
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a reply to: Sookiechacha


Yet zero prison reform when you guys were on power. You lose all credibility with it. Sorry



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 12:30 PM
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a reply to: nwtrucker


That's not true. Obama severed ties between for profit prisons and the federal government, but Trump brought those arrangements back. Trump also rolled back the LGBT protections that the Obama Admin had established.

Obama order the Justice Department to lay off medical and recreational marajuana states, and recomended federal prosecutors charge fewer people with low-level, nonviolent drug crimes and instead focus on more serious, violent crime.

Obama banned solitary confinement for minors and limited it for adult inmates. He opened college grants for 12,000 more inmates. He made it easier for felons to reenter society and the work force by banning the box that required them to admit they are felons to prospective landlords and employers. Giving them a clean start after paying their debt to society.



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 12:47 PM
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Van Jones has come out in support of this. I'm paraphrasing him here, but he basically said that too many times leftists took an all or nothing stance in the Obama years ended up with nothing. That's interesting, as is this little article...
www.blacktalkradionetwork.com...



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 12:50 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: nwtrucker


That's not true. Obama severed ties between for profit prisons and the federal government, but Trump brought those arrangements back. Trump also rolled back the LGBT protections that the Obama Admin had established.

Obama order the Justice Department to lay off medical and recreational marajuana states, and recomended federal prosecutors charge fewer people with low-level, nonviolent drug crimes and instead focus on more serious, violent crime.

Obama banned solitary confinement for minors and limited it for adult inmates. He opened college grants for 12,000 more inmates. He made it easier for felons to reenter society and the work force by banning the box that required them to admit they are felons to prospective landlords and employers. Giving them a clean start after paying their debt to society.



So where's the rehab? Where's the dropped return rate to prison? No rapes or murders in private prisons. They'd be sued if that happened. Public sector unions control that Obama string. Sorry, this legislation is an improvement.

Everything you cite should be in this legislation could have been done in Obama's time...and didn't happen.

That is a fact no matter how hard you try, cannot be ignored.
edit on 24-5-2018 by nwtrucker because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 12:50 PM
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In theory Prisons do have reform programs still in place but it has become a hoop dance to use the programs .
See I was behind on child support even THOUGH its civ court even though my x was not there ( civil court teh plantif MUST be present in person or by phone or the case is dismissed ( Unless your a corrupt system who just wants a rovoling door .

anyway so in for 45 days at 10 days left they had us goto a your getting out program ( its more or less mandatory )
All It was ( was some preacher telling every one how every thing is all your own falt and how god will fix it .

Now sure its was my falt not being able to work and make money . Sure its was the other guys falt sealing plastic junk from walmart .
Now the question is What do these people do to keep it from happing again ?

Having NO money NO job and many times NO home even to goto after you get out sure is NOT incentive to be crime free .



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:05 PM
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a reply to: TrueBrit

The far left are not going to fix this country. With them it is "you are either with us or against us" which is evident in how the left and Hillary were slamming everyone for not voting for her, even calling women traitors.

You do not live in this country, I do, I see some far left people on a regular basis. They are pushy, shoving their beliefs down others throats, actually taking over communities and making everyone's life complicated way more than any conservatives ever did. I have half a dozen people I know well that have flipped far left.

I see more problem with the kids of these far liberals than any other group. They have a big head because their parents are into local politics and wind up either getting in trouble with drugs and alcohol or they wind up depressed because their parents work and are always busy doing community political stuff. I know half a dozen locals who are into the communities and the standard left and right are all right, the far right get overpowering but there are only a couple of them here. There are a lot more far left hitting local politics here than strong conservatives.

I want to make something clear, I have always been left, all my life. Even the lefts shunned the far lefts around here. What you think far lefts are is based on your comprehension formed in the UK. The UK is more conservative, the far lefts there are probably comparable to the left here. Have you met really pushy liberals over there that can only see what they want to see? Since I was always liberal, I have lots of liberal friends, hardly any conservative ones. I get along fine with conservatives though, avoiding politics is necessary to keep being their friends and I am extremely aware how the Liberal Democrats in politics can take a great idea and make it expensive and a failure. So, I have the understanding to talk to these stern Republicans.

But lately, I have gotten a bad feeling from what I have been seeing in the Democrats around here, all of them not just the liberal ones. They are being convinced by media to take a side, a side that is touting deception and twisted evidence to cause a stronger division between the people locally. Politics never used to come up at all in our pinnacle league, now there are people who are dragging this stuff into the conversations, I try to change the subject. I hear more discussions of politics at the club we are playing at, that never used to be a topic discussed in the regular bars.

I see major problems in the making locally, not just on the internet. We used to talk about places to eat and fishing and hunting and stuff like that, now the conversations get dragged into politics. I am never the one to start a political conversation here, I will make some mild comments though, mostly bashing both sides for their idiotic ways and inability to work together for the better of society.

So now I am considered on the conservative right because I think that the change they are trying to do is not well thought out and it makes our citizens lives more controlled in areas that it does not need to be controlled. I have not changed at all, other people have gotten sucked into the left farther. So the midground has changed shifting me to the right more.

Change has to be done very carefully on everyday basis events, we got slammed into change too fast, leaving conservatives risk assessments tossed aside. This started probably twenty years ago but it got worse under Obama by a long shot for some reason. You have to look at history of economics and government to make sure that mistakes made in the past do not get made again.

People think they are smarter now than their parents and grandparents, that is a mistake. People running things now are not as smart as they were forty years ago, knowledgeable verses intelligence/ wisdom are not the same thing. The schools teach knowledge not wisdom, wisdom is formed by observation and comparison of things you see and hear. There are a lot of meds and food chemistry that lower wisdom in our society. That makes us easier to accept deception by the ones who want to control us. If you have good spidey sense, they give you medications so you don't care anymore about your debt and lower income than your parents earned.



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:10 PM
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a reply to: underwerks

More like you're dehydrated and want ice water but they only give you water so you refuse to drink it.



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:14 PM
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a reply to: introvert

Then the correct response is we support that and we have additional reforms we want you to support.

Instead anything Trump does is wrong.

Rather than praise Trump for taking up the issue they want to make sure he doesn't get credit so they will oppose anything he does.



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:14 PM
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a reply to: nwtrucker




Sorry, this legislation is an improvement.


I'm not saying it isn't. I haven't read it and am not familiar with it. All I know is that lawmakers think it should include sentencing reform too. So, what's the problem with adding it? It was a bi-partisan bill that overwhelmingly passed the house.


edit on 24-5-2018 by Sookiechacha because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:17 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha

originally posted by: Metallicus

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: nwtrucker


Schools don't put kids in jail. Judges do. That's where the sentencing guidelines and requirements come in.


Judges don’t put people in jail...people that commit crimes put themselves in jail.

Also, if you want to stop prison overpopulation then don’t criminalize victimless crimes. Unless there is a victim of person or property there shouldn’t be a crime.


The Judicial Dept and Judges put people in jail. There are tons of white collar criminals who judges choose not to imprison. So, your mantra, people put themselves in jail, doesn't work.


Typical, let’s remove every aspect of personal responsibility for what happens to us, right? I don’t worry about going to jail because I don’t commit crimes. That is actually the way it is for most Americans regardless of identity politics.



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:20 PM
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originally posted by: TamtammyMacx
The Dems have been introducing bills to allow felons to vote. Just as in Europe. What happens in Europe happens in the states. They know this is all about a new voting demographic.


Felons who have served their sentences, not Felons still serving. A big distinction, but of course you knew that and just choose to spin things to serve your agenda.



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:37 PM
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originally posted by: toysforadults

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: Grambler

Trump should come out as "Pro Oxygen" so leftists would stop breathing.



glad to see the lexicon changing from liberals to leftist


I've been pushing that on every site I go to. Language matters and we have to stop using the wrong terms.

Another example is Antifa. When people say "Anitfa are the real Nazis" it must be corrected. They are communists and are acting like communists.



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:38 PM
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originally posted by: underwerks

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: underwerks
a reply to: Grambler
Thanks for posting the actual Democrat response. It seems in reality the Democrats wanted better prison reform than Trump was willing to offer, but somehow you’ve spun that into Trump exposing Democrat hypocrisy.

I think you’d make a great republican politician.



Yes they wanted more, so they are against things they want.

It is hypocrisy.

If trump says "I want Obamacare rolled back and I want abortion made illegal!"

And the democrats say "Ok we will roll back Obamacare"

It would be hypocritical nonsense for Trump to say "I refuse to accept your rollback of Obamacrae, because it doesnt give me everything I want!"

It would be clear at that point that Trump wanted to play politics more than he cared about helping people from rolling back Obama care.

I guess if you’re thirsty and somebody pees in a glass and hands it to you and you don’t drink it, you’re a hypocrite.

Hypocrite!



A better analogy would be if you demand water but all the other person has is iced tea and you refuse to drink it because its not exactly what you want.
edit on 24-5-2018 by Carcharadon because: Spelling



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:47 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Grambler


Do you have link to the statement that the Democrats put out?

From I've read in your article, it seems that Democrats want more from the bill. They want it to address HOW people get to prison in the first place by addressing sentencing guidelines and requirements. For me, the school to prison pipeline is very disturbing.


Could just be me, but I think prison reform and justice reform are two separate issues, each big enough to be addressed separately. Problem with both parties is they want everything to be “perfect” before they’ll support positive change (for Dems especially if current POTUS is involved).



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:47 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: nwtrucker


Schools don't put kids in jail. Judges do. That's where the sentencing guidelines and requirements come in.


I'm pretty sure it's the individual that put's themselves in jail by their criminal behavior. I could be wrong on that.

That and the lack of parenting and proper role models. But then again, everyone in jail is innocent.


Judges arrive after the deed is done.

Which specific sentencing guidelines are ones you are looking to change. Lets take the easy Crack vs Regular coc aine ratio's off the table. The sentencing for those Should be equal for the same quantities.

What other ones do you find in need of adjustment?

I await your answer.
edit on 24-5-2018 by pavil because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 24 2018 @ 01:47 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: nwtrucker




Sorry, this legislation is an improvement.


I'm not saying it isn't. I haven't read it and am not familiar with it. All I know is that lawmakers think it should include sentencing reform too. So, what's the problem with adding it? It was a bi-partisan bill that overwhelmingly passed the house.


You haven't read it and aren't familiar with it but here you are arguing with people about it.

SMDH.

Do you routinely argue with people over things you know nothing about?



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