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Hero mom saves the day killing gunman outside school

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posted on May, 20 2018 @ 08:54 PM
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originally posted by: TheLotLizard
99.9999999999% of conceal carry owners would be too cowardly to do anything.

And the fact that she was almost shot herself shows how stupidly she reacted. If he would have pointed his attention tthen her.2 seconds earlier and saw her going through her purse he would have gotten her first. And she was a trained person.

Putting an average citizen in this situation they would have gotten shot 9 times out of 10.


I won't disagree that many with a ccw/chl would have the nerve if confronted with a similar situation.
However, I may disagree with your stats. There are many that continue their journey beyond the ccw/chl to prepare for such situations.





posted on May, 20 2018 @ 08:55 PM
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a reply to: TheLotLizard

I now a few veterans, usually the last thing they do is pull the whole veteran card. But hey, you have it, so might as well play it.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 08:56 PM
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originally posted by: Outlier13
a reply to: TheLotLizard

Legally armed citizens can make a difference. They can also not make a difference. However, if you were in a situation where someone drew down on you with a fire arm would you rather have someone nearby who was legally carrying or would you rather not?




That depends.

If the person knows WHEN to react then sure.

But if the person doesn’t then you’re going to have Innocent people going home in a body bag for a failed strategic mistake.

If it’s the latter I’d happily give up my wallet to the thief than to get shot while someone attempts to be a hero.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 08:58 PM
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originally posted by: subfab

originally posted by: Outlier13

originally posted by: subfab
a reply to: Outlier13

i'm pro 2nd amendment.

but a gun in the hands of an untrained person is just as dangerous as the attacker.
this woman was trained and had experience in the field. this is not the same as a concealed carry citizen.


in my opinion, people need to be trained if they are going to carry in public.


Not 100% true. Some of the least well trained people who carry guns are police officers. I'm not LEO and I have quite a few LEO friends who regularly come to me for training. This is concealed carry too. Everyone I know personally who carries concealed trains on a regular basis. Come to think of it I have never known anyone who carries concealed to not train regularly. Even something as little as 30 minutes a month at the range is enough to keep the edge honed.


30 minutes a month shooting at targets is good, but it isn't near enough training.
it is a whole different ball game when you are faced with a life or death situation.
having the resources to defend yourself is good.
not knowing how to handle a high stress situation is bad. i'll never tell anyone they can't exercise their right to carry or purchase a firearm. but i hope that anyone who does decide to carry get trained.

trying to figure out if your safety is on is all the time an attacker would need to hurt you.

my point is, just because you carry doesn't mean you are prepared for a violent situation.





Ok, you don't train, that means no one else does???
Do you carry? Do you know anyone that carries?

I'm not being a douche, just wanting to understand.




posted on May, 20 2018 @ 08:58 PM
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originally posted by: TheLotLizard

originally posted by: MisterSpock
Thelotlizard:

Don't project your own cowardice on other people. Aka, speak for yourself and keep the bogus stats for your next CNN garbage opinion piece.


Um what? I’m a veteran, unlike you I’ve seen the whites of a mans as his life fades away from the bullets ripping through his chest.

Now until you have something constructive to come out of your mouth I ask you to go politely into your hole.


I'm a vet too and I spent more time than I care to remember in hostile environments. Both during my military service and after. Carrying concealed in public is a night and day difference than carrying at the ready in a combat zone while on a patrol or during a mission. I had to completely retrain myself when I became a full time civilian. From mindset to action. I find training a civilian who has never handled firearms infinitely easier than training ex military or LEO because from first hand experience as prior service I had to unlearn a lot of institutionalized learning heavily ingrained in me.

The easiest civilians I find to train are in fact women.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:00 PM
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a reply to: Outlier13

Well, of course cops are better trained than civilians to deal with criminals because cops. How you can argue this point is beyond me. As far as your job training cops, what do you do and do you also train civilians in the same manner? Your post tells me nothing.

And correction to my original post, she was an off duty military cop.

www1.folha.uol.com.br...

edit on 20-5-2018 by Swills because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:00 PM
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originally posted by: TheLotLizard

originally posted by: Outlier13
a reply to: TheLotLizard

Legally armed citizens can make a difference. They can also not make a difference. However, if you were in a situation where someone drew down on you with a fire arm would you rather have someone nearby who was legally carrying or would you rather not?




That depends.

If the person knows WHEN to react then sure.

But if the person doesn’t then you’re going to have Innocent people going home in a body bag for a failed strategic mistake.

If it’s the latter I’d happily give up my wallet to the thief than to get shot while someone attempts to be a hero.


Mate you're creating too many "ifs". Bottom line if your life is being threatened by an active shooter you better damn sure want someone nearby legally carrying. That is going to be your best chance period.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:01 PM
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a reply to: Outlier13

This off duty police officer potentially saved the lives of children because she was legally allowed to conceal carry as an off-duty officer.

An off duty POLICE OFFICER. Someone trained in the use of guns. Someone who trains regularly in the proper USE OF GUNS. Someone who has been trained. Properly.

Unlike say, 90% of the 'cold dead fingers' bunch in Durrica.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:02 PM
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a reply to: subfab




shooting at targets is not the same as being involved in a violent confrontation. it just isn't.


No, it isnt, nothing is.......trust me ive been shot at quite a bit....but I tell you what it does do.....it helps your reaction time and your aim......and there are also classes out there you can take that train for situations like that....they are offered tons of places here....

But the point is, NOTHING is the same as being shot at or having a gun pointed at you except when it happens...




even police officers get nervous when they have to draw their weapon.


Police officers are just people, not superheroes......I know quite a few, and honestly, most of the people I know train a lot more than police for situations....

And unless your a SWAT officer or someone who specializes in that sort of thing within the department.....youre not getting ongoing training like that......


Sorry but your statements are completely unfounded and totally opinion and not fact



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:03 PM
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a reply to: Swills

True story. I took a friend who is LEO to the range recently. No BS...when we got there he did not know what ammo his firearm used. And this is not some small town I am referring to. It is a major city with a major budget for their police.

Now I'm not going to act like the left does and make a broad sweeping assumption that just because this LEO didn't know what ammo his side arm used that meant none of them did but it sure does speak to the overall training methods of the city police department. I mean come on. You are REQUIRED to carry a side arm and you don't know what ammo it uses?



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:04 PM
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a reply to: wylekat

Go back and read previous posts to correct your statement. You are making sweepingly incorrect assumptions.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:05 PM
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and sorry......but if my life is in immediate danger, or someone around me because some dude has a weapon.......im not waiting to see if the guy decides to gun someone down, while the police are "on their way"



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:07 PM
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originally posted by: Im2keul

originally posted by: subfab

originally posted by: Outlier13

originally posted by: subfab
a reply to: Outlier13

i'm pro 2nd amendment.

but a gun in the hands of an untrained person is just as dangerous as the attacker.
this woman was trained and had experience in the field. this is not the same as a concealed carry citizen.


in my opinion, people need to be trained if they are going to carry in public.


Not 100% true. Some of the least well trained people who carry guns are police officers. I'm not LEO and I have quite a few LEO friends who regularly come to me for training. This is concealed carry too. Everyone I know personally who carries concealed trains on a regular basis. Come to think of it I have never known anyone who carries concealed to not train regularly. Even something as little as 30 minutes a month at the range is enough to keep the edge honed.


30 minutes a month shooting at targets is good, but it isn't near enough training.
it is a whole different ball game when you are faced with a life or death situation.
having the resources to defend yourself is good.
not knowing how to handle a high stress situation is bad. i'll never tell anyone they can't exercise their right to carry or purchase a firearm. but i hope that anyone who does decide to carry get trained.

trying to figure out if your safety is on is all the time an attacker would need to hurt you.

my point is, just because you carry doesn't mean you are prepared for a violent situation.





Ok, you don't train, that means no one else does???
Do you carry? Do you know anyone that carries?

I'm not being a douche, just wanting to understand.



i had a carry permit. but i no longer carry.
i practiced with the pistol i had. but not enough to be prepared for a violent confrontation. i know many people who carry. not one of them trained for or practice frequently enough to be able to handle a violent situation. if you have never been in a life or death situation you just won't understand. ask a military veteran who experienced combat. ask them if shooting at clay targets is the same as being in a violent confrontation.

i don't get what you don't understand.
training is just as important as the license to carry.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:07 PM
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originally posted by: Outlier13
a reply to: Swills

True story. I took a friend who is LEO to the range recently. No BS...when we got there he did not know what ammo his firearm used. And this is not some small town I am referring to. It is a major city with a major budget for their police.

Now I'm not going to act like the left does and make a broad sweeping assumption that just because this LEO didn't know what ammo his side arm used that meant none of them did but it sure does speak to the overall training methods of the city police department. I mean come on. You are REQUIRED to carry a side arm and you don't know what ammo it uses?



That would freak me out.
You should not be able to carry if you don't know what your carrying.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:10 PM
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a reply to: subfab





i practiced with the pistol i had. but not enough to be prepared for a violent confrontation


Your personal choices on your training frequency isnt indicative of everyone else.....



ask them if shooting at clay targets is the same as being in a violent confrontation.


Youre using a pistol to shoot at clay targets? Something just isnt adding up here.....



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:11 PM
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a reply to: Outlier13


To be honest she made a couple near fatal mistakes.

The biggest mistake is when she pulled the gun her line of Fire was directly into a child and if he had not dodged but held his ground she couldn’t have gotten her shot off without potentially injuring them. If she had known that her line of Fire was compromised and withheld fire she would be dead.

I understand that what she did worked out for the best but it boils down to luck between his attention and his actions.

To me it looks as if she would have fired anyway without checking what was behind him. Showing that even police aren’t the most trained in these situations.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:12 PM
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a reply to: Outlier13

So do the police departments pay for your services to train their officers or do you just know a few cops and hang out with them at a gun range?
edit on 20-5-2018 by Swills because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:13 PM
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originally posted by: subfab

originally posted by: Im2keul

originally posted by: subfab

originally posted by: Outlier13

originally posted by: subfab
a reply to: Outlier13

i'm pro 2nd amendment.

but a gun in the hands of an untrained person is just as dangerous as the attacker.
this woman was trained and had experience in the field. this is not the same as a concealed carry citizen.


in my opinion, people need to be trained if they are going to carry in public.


Not 100% true. Some of the least well trained people who carry guns are police officers. I'm not LEO and I have quite a few LEO friends who regularly come to me for training. This is concealed carry too. Everyone I know personally who carries concealed trains on a regular basis. Come to think of it I have never known anyone who carries concealed to not train regularly. Even something as little as 30 minutes a month at the range is enough to keep the edge honed.


30 minutes a month shooting at targets is good, but it isn't near enough training.
it is a whole different ball game when you are faced with a life or death situation.
having the resources to defend yourself is good.
not knowing how to handle a high stress situation is bad. i'll never tell anyone they can't exercise their right to carry or purchase a firearm. but i hope that anyone who does decide to carry get trained.

trying to figure out if your safety is on is all the time an attacker would need to hurt you.

my point is, just because you carry doesn't mean you are prepared for a violent situation.





Ok, you don't train, that means no one else does???
Do you carry? Do you know anyone that carries?

I'm not being a douche, just wanting to understand.



i had a carry permit. but i no longer carry.
i practiced with the pistol i had. but not enough to be prepared for a violent confrontation. i know many people who carry. not one of them trained for or practice frequently enough to be able to handle a violent situation. if you have never been in a life or death situation you just won't understand. ask a military veteran who experienced combat. ask them if shooting at clay targets is the same as being in a violent confrontation.

i don't get what you don't understand.
training is just as important as the license to carry.



I agree, training beyond the carry license is essential. I did not want to assume anything about you without asking.

True, many cannot keep their heads in a stressful situation. That is why they offer advanced classes that go beyond the clay targets.




posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:17 PM
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originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: subfab





i practiced with the pistol i had. but not enough to be prepared for a violent confrontation


Your personal choices on your training frequency isnt indicative of everyone else.....



ask them if shooting at clay targets is the same as being in a violent confrontation.


Youre using a pistol to shoot at clay targets? Something just isnt adding up here.....


when did i say anything about comparing my training frequency to anyone else? my point is there are courses out there to prepare people as best they can to handle a violent situation. if someone is going to carry, it would be a good idea to get that training and maintain that level of proficiency.

paper targets, clay targets.... does it matter? when someone is trying to hurt you or someone you care about, it is a whole different ball game. not the same as the shooting range.



posted on May, 20 2018 @ 09:18 PM
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originally posted by: Im2keul

originally posted by: subfab

originally posted by: Im2keul

originally posted by: subfab

originally posted by: Outlier13

originally posted by: subfab
a reply to: Outlier13

i'm pro 2nd amendment.

but a gun in the hands of an untrained person is just as dangerous as the attacker.
this woman was trained and had experience in the field. this is not the same as a concealed carry citizen.


in my opinion, people need to be trained if they are going to carry in public.


Not 100% true. Some of the least well trained people who carry guns are police officers. I'm not LEO and I have quite a few LEO friends who regularly come to me for training. This is concealed carry too. Everyone I know personally who carries concealed trains on a regular basis. Come to think of it I have never known anyone who carries concealed to not train regularly. Even something as little as 30 minutes a month at the range is enough to keep the edge honed.


30 minutes a month shooting at targets is good, but it isn't near enough training.
it is a whole different ball game when you are faced with a life or death situation.
having the resources to defend yourself is good.
not knowing how to handle a high stress situation is bad. i'll never tell anyone they can't exercise their right to carry or purchase a firearm. but i hope that anyone who does decide to carry get trained.

trying to figure out if your safety is on is all the time an attacker would need to hurt you.

my point is, just because you carry doesn't mean you are prepared for a violent situation.





Ok, you don't train, that means no one else does???
Do you carry? Do you know anyone that carries?

I'm not being a douche, just wanting to understand.



i had a carry permit. but i no longer carry.
i practiced with the pistol i had. but not enough to be prepared for a violent confrontation. i know many people who carry. not one of them trained for or practice frequently enough to be able to handle a violent situation. if you have never been in a life or death situation you just won't understand. ask a military veteran who experienced combat. ask them if shooting at clay targets is the same as being in a violent confrontation.

i don't get what you don't understand.
training is just as important as the license to carry.



I agree, training beyond the carry license is essential. I did not want to assume anything about you without asking.

True, many cannot keep their heads in a stressful situation. That is why they offer advanced classes that go beyond the clay targets.



exactly!!







 
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