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The issue with atheism

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posted on May, 12 2018 @ 08:22 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: peter vlar

I gotta admit Pete I admire your persistent
faith. But without eviidence what you
believe?


this is quite fascinating. what is it that I believe Randy? Apparently you are more privy to my private thoughts thank i myself am. I would love to know what it is that’s I believe in that is devoid of any cidence



Is the hokiest ga damn notion
I've ever heard. Crap just piece'n itself
together no lab in hostile environment pay
no mind to the billions of years
impossibility.


could you translate that from crazy christian into english for me? Are you trying today that I believe that Abiogenesis is definitively how life on Earth began? If so, that belief is as incorrect as the rest of your rant. Abiogenesis is a hypothesis. it hasn’t been demonstrable in a lanoratory setting, hasn’t been independently reproduced or any other aspect of the scientific method.


Look at what you actually
believe? It's insanity. Even a strawman in
the mix wouldn't make it more believable.
And you call that intelligent? I said it years
Ago in a thread titled "Aheism is stupid"


Look at what I actually believe? Are you referring to the irrational beliefs that you attempt to ascribe to me? Because what you have written doesn’t actually line up with my personal beliefs. But hey... ad hominem attacks as opposed to discussing science that apparently is way over your head is easier. I have to ask also, what the hell does atheism have i do with the his? My views are much more agnostic than atheistic. Furthermore, how do oh account for devout Christians like Frances Collins from the Human Genome Project and his adamant support for the MES? He doesn’t quite fit into your cookie cutter stereotyping. what ad hominem straw man will you use to mock him? i’m genuinely curious so I can get his take on your thoughts the next time I see him.





But you can believe what ever you want.
Just don't mock others unless you wanna
eat crow pal.


i’m getting hungry so anytime you want to try to serve up your magic crow, feel free.im not going to i hold my breath waiting for it though. For what it’s worth, I sincerely apologize for thinking you were an adult, capable of having a rational conversation. Clearly I was way off base because instead of addressing the science, you ran wild with an insane


Pointing the finger to call attention away from
the obvious just won't work anymore.


please... enlighten me as to what it is that you think is obvious. i didn’t see anything resembling a falsification or valid science. all I se is a ranting Gish Gallop that accomplishes exactly what you accuse me of. irony is a beautiful thing.


Just jerked your lil toy away.


you are delusional if you think I had a toy for you to take in the first place.


Atheism isn’t synonymous with Evolution.
Abiogenesis likewise, has nothing to do with evolution
I don’t know how life started nor do i claim to know how or where life originated. Abiogenesis has some supporting evidence to show that it is a possible explanation. Then again so does Panspermia. Your hatred of anyone who doesn’t believe in magic must be quite a burden having to carry around so much darkness. It’s too bad.




posted on May, 12 2018 @ 08:41 PM
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originally posted by: Raggedyman

You have nothing, not even a single journal article sayin evolution is a fact, nothing


There is nothing that the scientific method says is “fact”. That’s not the way science works.

There are things that science says is “likely” or is “almost certain” based on evidence, but science is always trying to tear itself down.

That’s the beauty of science; there is always some scientist out there who is trying to pond holes in theories and hypotheses, and that’s what makes those theories stronger.

edit on 12/5/2018 by Soylent Green Is People because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 08:47 PM
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a reply to: peter vlar

Sorry Peter you can employ what ever word
Salad you like. It won't put me on your
marry go round. So just stop advocating
your know nothing admit nothing ridiculous
atheist view. I know you'll miss feeling all
superior but after all. Man is in no way the
sharpest tool in the shead. Atheism proves
that exponentially.

Life comes only from life



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 08:52 PM
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a reply to: cooperton

Context is everything. quoting one part of my earlier post while ignoring the rest is intellectually dishonest and you know it. But then again, the citations you include provide far more context than your minimalistic quote mining would lead one to believe.

Of the 3 citations, only the first one resembles your point of view on the subject but it doesntactukky support that position. The paper, written by a philosopher and not an anthropologist who focuses most of the paper on the advances i science that support evolution.

With the second one, are you really arguing that it is not factual that Bonobos diverged from Chimpanzee between 1 and 1.5 Ma?

With the third citation, after highlighting the word ‘fact’ it goes on to state that it MAY support the contention of the author. It looks like you did a lazy google for papers that have the word fact one relation to evolution with no thought as to the context or if they actually support your complaint. (they don’t btw)


In the portion of my post that you neglected to include, i discussed exactly what a scientific theory is and encompasses. So just as a refresher, a scientific theory is based on demonstrable facts and explains an aspect of the natural world within which we live. A scientific theory serves to explain the mechanisms that are working behind the scenes that allow evolution to occur. Thusly, papers supporting evolution are focused on those mechanisms. Evolution is indeed a fact but the published material on evolution encompasses how evolution occurs and the processes behind it. Of every scientific theory in the history of organized science, the MES has by far, the largest body of supporting evidence.



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 09:00 PM
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a reply to: peter vlar

Let me ask you this Peter

Do we live in a friendly or a hostile
environment?



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 09:01 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: peter vlar

Sorry Peter you can employ what ever word
Salad you like. It won't put me on your
marry go round.


of course not. you prefer willful ignorance and mockery. i get it, it’s your schtick.



So just stop advocating your know nothing admit nothing ridiculous
atheist view.


As usual, you resort to pathetic, childlike ad hominem because you are incapable of actually discussing the science because you are way out of your depth. The only person responsible for those short comings is you. Don’t blame me for your issues or try to convince people that Isctually believe orascribe to the beliefs you attempt to shove down my throat. It’s sad that an alleged adult gets his panties in such a twist over a response I wrote to someone else .


I know you'll miss feeling all
superior but after all. Man is in no way the
sharpest tool in the shead. Atheism proves
that exponentially.



no, your inability to formulate a concise argument that discusses the science involved demonstrates which part of the shed the dull tools are in. Atheism has nothing to do with it. The simple fact that you didn’t bother to attempt to counter anything in my previous reply and instead focus on character assassinating ad hominems is the most telling aspect of this little tête-à-tête.



Life comes only from life


Then your particular flavor of god can’t create it either if it isabella omnipotent, omniscient being that lives beyond our knownlaws of physics.



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 09:05 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: peter vlar



Let me ask you this Peter

Do we live in a friendly or a hostile
environment?


the answer to that depends on the ecological niche you’re referring to. each specific eco niche provides a different set of challenges or benefits to the organisms that inhabit it.

see, when we play nice, the response is equally reasonable.



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 09:08 PM
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a reply to: peter vlar

Whats the most sophisticated phenomena by
far in the universe?



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 09:11 PM
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a reply to: peter vlar

I was referring obviously to the
niche WE LIVE IN.

Hostile or friendly either or ?

You know damn well I'm always willing
to play nice.
edit on Rpm51218v21201800000028 by randyvs because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 09:24 PM
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a reply to: peter vlar

What is the purpose of consciousness?

Fundemental questions
edit on Rpm51218v28201800000006 by randyvs because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 09:25 PM
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a reply to: Soylent Green Is People

Thank you S G I P, I appreciate that
I am aware of that as well.
My issue is why so many people keep telling me evolution is a fact, it is a scientific fact beyond question
You need to understand both sides of the issue before commenting

I appreciate theory doesn't always mean theory in science, but it sure doesn't mean fact either

I get a bit bored explaining the same thing over and over and over



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 10:34 PM
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a reply to: ClovenSky



I have a feeling that you enjoy this reality and do not shy away from looking into the places where others are afraid to look, because they will then have to challenge the rock upon which they built their reality. You fear no such assessment, do you?


I try not to fear, is not easy sometimes



The conversation is the most important part, even if it doesn't accomplish anything. If the material world is here for us to use and is completely neutral, neither good nor evil. It is always the person that matters.


I don't understand the part that "doesn't accomplish anything". Doesn't that mean it was meaningless?

The material world maybe here, we are part of it, can't look at it fro outside right? I don't think it is for us to "use", we just happened to be here as part of it, the world also uses us, is not a partial thing. whatever we happen to be or do is just part of the entire thing moving on its own, existing all around

I think we only have our points of view, nothing else matters to each person and for lots of people they only care about you if you share they view, if not you are denied care or love, or help



What better way of discovering reality than to study ourselves?


As in looking into myself or in general looking at human race? when you talk to someone and they are insulting you'll learn not all people are nice or wise or educated, but how does that help you learn something about reality? i feel i'm missing something about this. i can't think properly right now, will get back later and read again



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 10:41 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Woodcarver

Explaining that molecules are inanimate?
That's your answer? Everyone knows that.
It does nothing to explain your thinking
against the only observable evidence that
life only comes from life. Did you just
abandon the scientific method? Why not
just say life doesn't come only from
life because fire engines? Quit dodging the
question?


Interesti

Ex nihilo is a Latin phrase meaning "out of nothing". It often appears in conjunction with the concept of creation, as in creatio ex nihilo, meaning "creation out of nothing", chiefly in philosophical or theological contexts, but it also occurs in other fields.
en.wikipedia.org...

n theology, the common phrase creatio ex nihilo (lit. "creation out of nothing"), contrasts with creatio ex materia (creation out of some pre-existent, eternal matter) and creatio ex deo (creation out of the being of God). Creatio continua is the ongoing divine creation.
The phrase ex nihilo also appears in the classical philosophical formulation ex nihilo nihil fit, which means "out of nothing comes nothing".
Theologians debate whether the Bible itself teaches creation ex nihilo. Traditional interpreters[4] argue on grammatical and syntactical grounds that this is the meaning of Genesis 1:1, which is commonly rendered: "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." They find further support for this view in New Testament passages such as Hebrews 11:3—"By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things that are visible" and Revelation 4:11, "For you [God] created all things, and by your will they existed and were created."
The RigVeda quotes "If in the beginning there was neither Being nor Non-Being, neither air nor sky, what was there? Who or what oversaw it? What was it when there was no darkness, light, life, or death? We can only say that there was the One, that which breathed of itself deep in the void, that which was heat and became desire and the germ of spirit," which is suggestive of the fact that Ex nihilo creator was always there and he is not controlled by time or by any previous creation.[19] en.wikipedia.org...


Creatio Ex Materia means creation from an existing matter



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 10:54 PM
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"Life can only create life."

Where did God come from?



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 10:58 PM
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originally posted by: RenderMan
"Life can only create life."

Where did God come from?


Alpha-Omega. Always was, always shall be.

'Something' cannot come from nothing[1].
'something' exists[2]
Therefore, 'something' must have always existed[3].

1) True according to 1st law of thermodynamics
2) self-evident
3) the conclusion since the premises are true.

edit on 12-5-2018 by cooperton because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 11:02 PM
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originally posted by: cooperton
You just get done trying to argue that scientists aren't so chauvinistic that they claim theories as facts, and then you say


originally posted by: peter vlar
Evolution is indeed a fact


"According to your faith, let it be so". Hence the problem with believing you're a mutant chimpanzee.


No one who has done any studying of evolution believes humans are mutant chimpanzees.



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 11:07 PM
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originally posted by: RenderMan

No one who has done any studying of evolution believes humans are mutant chimpanzees.


We theoretically evolved from some Mutant-vague-monkey-resembling-creature*

Research will find that these theoretical missing links are missing.
edit on 12-5-2018 by cooperton because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 11:15 PM
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a reply to: Raggedyman

you keep running in circles trying to demonstrate how flawed other peoples approach to science is while ignoring critical aspects. How many different ways does it have to be laid out for you that Scientific Theories are based on a large body of provable FACTS and that they serve one purpose, to show HOW these verifiable, factual, observable and repeatable phenomena occur. Is it really that difficult to wrap your head around? The FACTS of evolution inform the Theory as to how evolution occurs. It's so simple that even an Aussie should be able to grasp it.



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 11:18 PM
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originally posted by: ThirdEyeofHorus
Creatio Ex Materia means creation from an existing matter

The bible doesn't teach Creatio Ex Nihilo or Creatio Ex Materia. It teaches Creatio Ex Deo. God is not some kind of "eternal matter" you can detect like dark matter. Now will you stop with Latin language. I really hate Septuagint or others Greek's variant Philosophy. It makes me headache.

I would prefer Hebrew or English. Lol.

edit on 12-5-2018 by EasternShadow because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2018 @ 11:30 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: peter vlar

Whats the most sophisticated phenomena by
far in the universe?


I honestly don't have a good answer for that. There are many things we don't fully understand as yet.



originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: peter vlar

I was referring obviously to the
niche WE LIVE IN.

Hostile or friendly either or ?


But humans don't live in one singular ecological niche. We live in nearly every environment and on every continent save for Antarctica and even then we have year round research stations. Some are incredibly hostile, others not so much.


You know damn well I'm always willing
to play nice.


Absolutely, hence my surprise at your hostility.




originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: peter vlar

What is the purpose of consciousness?

Fundemental questions


Why does consciousness need to have a purpose? It's a philosophical quandary more than a scientific one.




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