SCI/TECH: U.S. Still Silencing Scientists

For years I have followed research papers coming out of the different government agencies. I have to say that I agree with the sentiments of Dr. H--or I used to. For many years the research papers seemed to be very biased towards a generally liberal agenda and some of the papers were later shown to have been rigged, distorted, falsified or what have you to make sure that is what they did. However, the latest trends seem to be in the opposite direction. It's like we went from a period where any researcher could print anything they wanted to one now where only what the politicians want get published. Both extremes are equally bad and I resent the fact they are being paid for with my tax dollars.

It is flat wrong to silence researchers whose research results don't please the current controlling politicians, but it is also wrong to allow taxpayer funded papers to be published that have not been reviewed by peers and been found to be complete and accurate and non-political.

Having said I agree with Dr.H's sentiments (as I understood them), let me also say I totally disagree with his remarks about DDT.

Soficrow this is an important subject and deserves widespread discussion, thanks for posting it.

Originally posted by Astronomer68

Soficrow this is an important subject and deserves widespread discussion, thanks for posting it.

You're welcome Astronomer. :0


...Have you checked out loam's thread on the EPA decision to dump partially hydrolyzed VX nerve gas into the Delaware river?

Related if you dig methinks....

They can shut us up. They can shut us down. They can kill us.


And that should just about do it, I think.

I'm not here. You didn't hear that from me. ssshhh....

This has been a very interesting thread. Good work everyone .

Originally posted by bodebliss

They can shut us up. They can shut us down. They can kill us.

And that should just about do it, I think.

And they ARE everywhere.

But then again, so are we...

There's more than one way to silence scientists. And many, many ways to prevent scientific information from reaching the public.

Budget cuts imperil EPA library system: Research database, access to documents may be curtailed in Fiscal 2007 budget proposal

There is more censorship in the usa in relation to scientists than within teh russian bioweapons programme!



People you do realise that as a citizen of the USA you have less rights now than the population of germany did before WW2?

Originally posted by Harlequin
There is more censorship in the usa in relation to scientists than within teh russian bioweapons programme!

Never thought of that. The controls are super tight though.

Supposedly it's about bioterrorism but the lid's clamped tight on AIDS, Mad Cow, Bird Flu - all the big epidemics that involve prions.

...And bioterrorists are NOT interested in prions. The payoff is waaayyy too slow.

So what's the real secret?


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Originally posted by dgtempe
Syntaxer- you forgot unAmerican!

I wonder if this is related to the snuffed out microbiologists...who have met with death over the past years

And haven't any of you asked yourselves the question of why it seems that only scientists from the west seem to meet their demise?....

Oh, but I forgot, the U.S. government is the only one who would do this...
Wait a second, why would U.S. government officials want the demise of those scientists who could prevent them, or their families from getting sick due to a biological attack?....

Have you tried to do proper research to see who else might be behind this, or you have already made up your minds?....

[edit on 14-3-2006 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by Muaddib

Originally posted by dgtempe
Syntaxer- you forgot unAmerican!

I wonder if this is related to the snuffed out microbiologists...who have met with death over the past years

And haven't any of you asked yourselves the question of why it seems that only scientists from the west seem to meet their demise?....

Not at all, mauddib. It's a worldwide phenomenon. ...Lots of links here on ATS already.

Oh, but I forgot, the U.S. government is the only one who would do this...
Wait a second, why would U.S. government officials want the demise of those scientists who could prevent them, or their families from getting sick due to a biological attack?....

Have you tried to do proper research to see who else might be behind this, or you have already made up your minds?....

Hmmm. Most people seem recognize that the epidemic of dead microbiologists is a) international; b) related to drug and chemical multinational corporations, as well as financial institutions; and c) the US government is implicated as a front for said multinationals.

As far as biological attacks go - looks like the big ones were done back in WWI and WWII, probably via vaccines, and now we're seeing the final biological effects (chronic disease, Mad Cow, bird flu).

...The big boyz don't need mouthy microbiologists who want to save the world. As far as protecting their own health - the boyz think they have it handled.


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Originally posted by soficrow

Not at all, mauddib. It's a worldwide phenomenon. ...Lots of links here on ATS already.

Not at all soficrow, most of the dead are western scientists, although quite a few scientists have died from natural causes, from war and even from the diseases they were studying, I do believe there have been "some" who have been killed; yet some people want to make it sound as if the deaths of every scientist is a conspiracy, but you know what? scientists are people too, and as people they are mortal, they also do die of natural causes, from wars, from the diseases they are combating, etc, etc.

There are natural diseases around the Earth that can still kill anyone. I know of an archeologist who was a friend of mine and died back in 1997 from a virus he contracted on the jungles of central America. People still do die from natural occurring viruses and diseases.

Originally posted by soficrow
Hmmm. Most people seem recognize that the epidemic of dead microbiologists is a) international; b) related to drug and chemical multinational corporations, as well as financial institutions; and c) the US government is implicated as a front for said multinationals.

That's a big assumption on your part sofi to believe that most people see the deaths of scientists as you see them.

Originally posted by soficrow
As far as biological attacks go - looks like the big ones were done back in WWI and WWII, probably via vaccines, and now we're seeing the final biological effects (chronic disease, Mad Cow, bird flu).

...The big boyz don't need mouthy microbiologists who want to save the world. As far as protecting their own health - the boyz think they have it handled.

Those are more big assumptions on your part again sofi. Yes, there have been bioweapons made by mankind, but mother nature also has her own weapons, and she does not need the help of mankind to make powerful viruses and diseases. You also seem to forget that viruses are alive, and as live beings they survive by mutating and adapting, which they do a lot better than most living things do, including humans.

[edit on 14-3-2006 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by Muaddib

Originally posted by dgtempe
Syntaxer- you forgot unAmerican!

I wonder if this is related to the snuffed out microbiologists...who have met with death over the past years

And haven't any of you asked yourselves the question of why it seems that only scientists from the west seem to meet their demise?....

That's not true Maudib!

There are many instances of Russian scientists disappearing also.

Originally posted by Muaddib

You also seem to forget that viruses are alive, and as live beings they survive by mutating and adapting, which they do a lot better than most living things do, including humans.

Not at all. That's my point:

The bioweapons made and released in the early 1900's have mutated, adapted and mutated again and again - now they are out of control.


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Originally posted by bodebliss
That's not true Maudib!

There are many instances of Russian scientists disappearing also.

What makes you think that every Russian scientists would agree with any plan to release bioweapons?

Try to find which has been the country where no scientist has died of suspicious causes, then perhaps you'll realize who might be behind such a plan.

[edit on 14-3-2006 by Muaddib]

This thread is about the US Silencing Scientists.

Please feel free to start your own thread about Russian scientists and bioweapons. Great topic.

Originally posted by soficrow
This thread is about the US Silencing Scientists.

Please feel free to start your own thread about Russian scientists and bioweapons. Great topic.

You are right,

the floor is all yours sofi.

Originally posted by soficrow

There's more than one way to silence scientists. And many, many ways to prevent scientific information from reaching the public.

Budget cuts imperil EPA library system: Research database, access to documents may be curtailed in Fiscal 2007 budget proposal

Any comments on this little tidbit?

...First, we have Executive Orders and policy to silence our scientists.

Now - the research library budget is being cut.

Good science is about sharing information and research results. If scientists cannot access other scientists' work - then continuing research becomes almost pointless. Science absolutely cannot exist in a vacuum.

Nevermind that the public is even less able to see how their tax dollars are spent...

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Silencing scientists in the FDA can have a direct effect on human health:

Approval of Antibiotic Worried Safety Officials

In an internal review, a federal drug safety official concluded that a controversial antibiotic made by a French drug company should be withdrawn, according to e-mail messages exchanged among top agency officials.

The documents show that at least four agency safety officials — including Dr. Charles Cooper, Dr. David Ross and Dr. Rosemary Johann-Liang — expressed serious reservations about the safety of Ketek. Two weeks after Dr. Graham’s e-mail message, the agency announced changes to Ketek’s label emphasizing that the drug could in rare circumstances cause serious liver injury, liver failure and death. ...In addition to liver problems, Ketek can cause blurred vision and loss of consciousness. In patients with myasthenia gravis, a rare neurological disorder, it can cause death. ...More than five million prescriptions for Ketek have been written in the United States since its approval in 2004. Fourteen adult patients have suffered liver failure after taking Ketek. At least four of them have died. Twenty-three others have suffered serious liver injury. Most of the reported problems involving Ketek occurred in otherwise healthy patients.

The F.D.A. approved Ketek based partly on the company’s reported experience with the drug in other countries, which is called postmarketing surveillance. ...“For F.D.A. to refer to its being reassured by postmarketing data from Latin America and Europe as a basis for declaring ‘Ketek is safe’ is in my opinion a great abuse of such surveillance data,” Dr. Graham wrote.

An interesting article from Nicholas Russell, professor and director of the Science Communication Group at Imperial College London. Worth reading.

'The play's the thing...'

Scientists do not always work in a vacuum, and many encounter trouble when they bring their scientific findings or perspective to the general public. One might not think to look for insight into 21st century public science policy in the works of the long-departed Norwegian playwright Henrik Ibsen (1828-1906), but his drama A Public Enemy teaches some interesting lessons -- even if they are not necessarily the ones that Ibsen intended.

This play, in which a scientist uncovers a public health crisis, demonstrates that science needs careful handling when applied in wider political and social contexts. Sometimes, it takes a story to make this clear. And scientists interested in engaging the public to effect policy changes -- such as those working on global warming or GM crops -- have much to learn from this fictional lesson.

In A Public Enemy (1882), Ibsen's hero is Dr. Stockmann, the Medical Officer for the Municipal Baths at a small coastal resort. He is a misunderstood lone wolf, who uses science to uncover an uncomfortable truth: that the Baths are being contaminated by pollution from industry because the water intake system has been too cheaply built. He warns the citizens that they are poisoning the Baths, and their tourist trade is in jeopardy.