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Finally, the Trump is Putin's puppet narrative is dead... and has been

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posted on Apr, 17 2018 @ 03:59 PM

originally posted by: knoxie
a reply to: rickymouse

putin didn't meddle in our election of obama or bush, so of course trump should be tuffer!

but, NOT implementing proper sanctions isn't tuff at all, it's weak.

I think you're forgetting a key piece here, that Obama had intelligence regarding Russian meddling and sat on it.

posted on Apr, 17 2018 @ 04:04 PM
a reply to: Grambler

It was a small handful. This is dwarfed by the number and power of influence from supporters right here in amwerica of both hillary or trump.

IRA was a private company funded by private interests, and not the "Russian government" as purported by the media and their parrots.

posted on Apr, 17 2018 @ 04:12 PM

originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: Grambler

That's factually inaccurate. One, describing the dossier as "Kremlin-sourced" is misleading on several levels. (only parts are attributed to government officials, you're implying that it was a product of the Kremlin, etc)

The most damning parts that alleged criminality were in fact souirced by kremlin connected officials.

I love the double standard here. Trump people like don jr, or manafort, or page, or cohen meet with russians that were fromerly political or russian military people, and we all assume that is them meeting with kremlin people. Fair enough.

But as soon as Kremlin officials or people connected with the kremlin are the source for the dossier, now we are told well they werent neccessarily operating as the voice of the kremlin.

Hilarious. We know we know, its ok for hillarys people to pay kremlin officials for dirt, but if trumps people did that, its a crime that needs years long investigations.

Second, what part of the dossier was used in the FISA warrant?

Oh, no part of it.

This is by far the most ridiculous argument I have seen you make. I have called you out on this before.

They uised the allegatuions presented in the steele dossier from steele himself to help obtain a fisa warrant.

For you top play games and act like well because they didnt actually use the direct copy of steeles dossier then POOF! Its magic and OK and no one can say it was wrong to use the steele dossier

Its so far beneath you that it hurts the credibilitty of some of the otehr good arguments you make.

And thirdly, Carter Page was no longer part of the Trump campaign and he was the only one that was surveilled using information from Steele. But perhaps most importantly, nothing about surveilling Carter Page had anything to do with trying to disadvantage Trump or advantage Clinton. Using vague language, there's this insinuation that somehow the dossier was an excuse to spy on the Trump campaign which is just nonsense.

Pure nonsense. Just because Page was a former member, the warrant allowed access to all of his current communications he could have with anyone in the campaign, and to access all of his documents and correspondence with anyone during his time there.

We know that names were unmasked (not neccessaarily from the page warrant)of trump members and leaked to the media. We know that Obama was going around telling allies trump may be compromised by putin during the election. SDO it sures seems like there was an interest in playing politics with this.

Not putting Carter Page under surveillance would have been dereliction of duty.

You mean like selling urnaium rights to russsians while the FBI knew that people involved with russian interests in that were offering bribves?

Or allowing the Podesta group to pedlle influence with manafort from russian interests while not filing as foriegn lobbyists? Oh it seems the only duty was to look in to trumps people connections to russia.

And in fact, the FBI did more to benefit Trump then anything. First it was all the supposed leaks from the NY field office to Fox News and others. Remember that FBI gone rogue narrative? It was big on ATS right before the election. The idea that the FBI was revolting to save the country from Clinton (now you lot have done a 180 and rant about the "deep state" constantly but when you thought the "deep state" was hurting Clinton, you couldn't have been more pleased).

Show me where I said that.

Then there was Comey's decision to announce like a week before the election that a 2nd email investigation had been launched. Seems legit right? Funny he didn't seem to feel the same need to announce the FBI's investigation into people connected to Trump. Strange that the "deep state" wasn't leaking all this stuff pre-election given how much they were in the bag for Clinton.

Yes and as I said for months and comey confirmed this weak, he did what he did to make himself and hillary lo0ok good. He assumed she was a shoe in, and didnt want to be accused of witholding info and deligitimizing her presidency.

In other words he admits to acting out of political interests to lopok out for hillary. It backfired, but he tried to help her.

posted on Apr, 17 2018 @ 04:23 PM

originally posted by: theantediluvian
a reply to: Grambler

I addressed some of Greenwald's arguments in a follow up post. Trump hasn't been particularly hard on Russia at all. He's been dragged kicking and screaming to do anything, instead opting to blabber about "being friends with Russia" after they'd just meddled in the election to hurt his opponent and benefit him. (not to mention we just went through a failed "reset" with Russia where we got burned, culminating with them invading Crimea).

Well the OP outlines some of the many things he did to russia.

As I said, both trump and Obama have done things that could be considered agressive or soft on Russia. Both have done so after downlplaying russian influence, and both having evidence of some sort of it.

Yet for some reason, the very people that insinuate trumps soft stance somehow shows he is a puupet of putin never breathed a word about Obama being his puppet when he was soft on them.

Trump isn't personally hawkish on Russia at all. In fact, quite the opposite. And what happened to your argument that Trump was being forced to act by the deep state? When it's convenient, Trump is being forced to act and other times, it's no no no, he's actually very hard on Russia!


Show me where I said he was bieng forced to do this by the deep state.

Man, I swear people and their reading comprehension problems. I have trump supporters calling me a sellout, a fake conservatove and secret democrat for forcibly calling him out on his strike on syria.

Then I have people on the left saying I never called trump out, I blamed other people.

My god its frustrating.

I dont know if Trump is a war hawk, is trying to cover up for domestic issues, is being duped by the intel community, etc.

I also dont know which of those Obama was.

I said this to you just the other day.

It doesnt matter why; the buck stops with THEM!!! Now you know I said this.

But while we are on the subject of conveinently believing things...

Funny you are leaning towards the chemiocal attack not being as the intel community has said. This is what you told me the other day.

So you are critical of the intel community and think they may be lying when it comes to dropping bombs, but believe everything they say when it comes to their investigations of hillary and trump?

Oh and btw, how is that FBI look into the DNC server going. You know, the most important piece of physical evidence in what you have said is a far more serious attack that russia has never done before on our elections.

Oh whats that, they havent got around to looking at the server yet?

Sounds legit!

posted on Apr, 17 2018 @ 05:36 PM
a reply to: CriticalStinker

Their economy is tanking because of the 2014 sanctions. The sanctions that Trump coincidentally tried to remove as soon as he became president, but was stopped by Congress and is the reason why they(Congress) are trying to pass a beefed up version of said sanctions. Putin was clever in that he successfully installed a puppet(I believe with the help of Tillerson) as POTUS. His only oversight is that in America the president has to go through Congress to get anything done. As opposed to the Russian government which is ultimately a dictatorship.

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