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F.B.I. Raids Office of Trump’s Longtime Lawyer Michael Cohen

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posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 10:54 AM
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originally posted by: soberbacchus
a reply to: Xcathdra

You should answer my question.

Why do you keep saying Mueller instead of Comey whilst referring to Trump's attempt to get Comey to drop the Flynn Investigation?



Cite your info showing Trump obstructed. What elements did he violate.




posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 10:57 AM
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"I hope" is now obstruction?
One should look to comeys testimony under oath, as he was actually there.
good luck with the "I hope" prosecution.



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 10:58 AM
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originally posted by: shooterbrody
"I hope" is now obstruction?
One should look to comeys testimony under oath, as he was actually there.
good luck with the "I hope" prosecution.


It is when you are desperate. You also start raiding attorny's offices in hopes of finding something.


Trump did not obstruct. Its no different than the left yelling about the non existent crime of collusion.


edit on 12-4-2018 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 11:09 AM
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originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: soberbacchus
a reply to: Xcathdra

You should answer my question.

Why do you keep saying Mueller instead of Comey whilst referring to Trump's attempt to get Comey to drop the Flynn Investigation?



Cite your info showing Trump obstructed. What elements did he violate.


Sure.

At the time Trump asked his subordinate to cease investigating Flynn for operating as an undeclared agent of a foreign government and lying to the FBI about his conversations with Russian Agents and lying on security clearance forms etc. there was a Grand Jury empanelled for the purposes of that investigation. The FBI Director did not drop that valid investigation and Trump chose to fire him. Trump would near immediately declare to Russian Representatives in the oval office:

“I just fired the head of the F.B.I. He was crazy, a real nut job,” “I faced great pressure because of Russia. That’s taken off.”

Trump would soon thereafter re-iterate his intent to obstruct justice when asked about his reasons for firing the FBI Director on National Television in an interview:
” "And in fact when I decided to just do it, I said to myself, I said 'you know, this Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story”



Protection Of Government Processes -- Omnibus Clause -- 18 U.S.C. 1505

The omnibus clause of 18 U.S.C. § 1505 parallels its counterpart in 18 U.S.C. § 1503 in language and purpose, and most of the law construing the latter is applicable to the former.

Generally, a defendant may be found guilty under section 1505 if the government establishes that:

(1) there was a proceeding pending before a department or agency of the United States;
(2) the defendant knew of or had a reasonably founded belief that the proceeding was pending; and
(3) the defendant corruptly endeavored to influence, obstruct, or impede the due and proper administration of the law under which the proceeding was pending.
United States v. Price, 951 F.2d 1028, 1030-31 (9th Cir. 1991); United States v. Sprecher, 783 F. Supp. 133, 163 (S.D.N.Y. 1992).


United States DOJ 18 USC 1505



1730. Protection Of Government Processes -- "Official Proceeding" Requirement -- 18 U.S.C. 1512

Congress limits the coverage of § 1512 to official proceedings. 18 U.S.C. § 1515(a)(1) defines "official proceeding" as:
A.a proceeding before a judge or court of the United States, a United States magistrate, a bankruptcy judge, a judge of the United States Tax Court, a special trial judge of the Tax Court, a judge of the United States Claims Court, or a Federal grand jury;

www.justice.gov...



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 11:11 AM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

www.politico.com...
How about we just read the mans testimony under oath and see what he said.....


BURR: Director Comey, did the president at any time ask you to stop the FBI investigation into Russian involvement in the 2016 U.S. Elections?
COMEY: Not to my understanding, no.
BURR: Did any individual working for this administration, including the justice department, ask you to stop the Russian investigation?
COMEY: No.

and more



RISCH: Thank you. All right. So those three things we now know regarding the active measures, whether the president is under investigation and the collusion between the trump campaign and the Russians. I want to drill right down, as my time is limited, to the most recent dust up regarding allegations that the president of the United States obstructed justice. Boy, you nailed this down on page 5, paragraph 3. You put this in quotes. Words matter. You wrote down the words so we can all have the words in front of us now. There's 28 words now in quotes. It says, quote, I hope -- this is the president speaking — I hope you can see your way clear to letting this go, to letting Flynn go. He is good guy. I hope you can let this go. Now, those are his exact words, is that correct.
COMEY: Correct.
RISCH: You wrote them here and put them in quotes.
COMEY: Correct.
RISCH: Thank you for that. He did not direct you to let it go?
COMEY: Not in his words, no.
RISCH: He did not order you to let it go?
COMEY: Again, those words are not an order.


lol
i hope...



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 11:18 AM
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a reply to: shooterbrody

So Comey explained he was never "ordered" to cease investigating Flynn or Russian interference.

He also testified that he was "asked" by his superior to cease investigating Flynn.

Obstruction Of Justice has a legal bar of "Influence", not "order".

Whether your boss "asks" you to do something or "orders" you to do something is irrelevant for the charge.

More so when you are fired for not doing what he asked.


edit on 12-4-2018 by soberbacchus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 11:22 AM
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a reply to: soberbacchus




He also testified that he was "asked" by his superior to cease investigating Flynn.

Please site this as it goes DIRECTLY against what he testified to here(which I have already provided).



BURR: Director Comey, did the president at any time ask you to stop the FBI investigation into Russian involvement in the 2016 U.S. Elections? COMEY: Not to my understanding, no.


So please link me to where comey committed purgery.



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 11:25 AM
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originally posted by: soberbacchus

I have to ask MME, did you spot that on your own?



Yes. I've only read about half the article you posted...sounds like a reasonable take though. I"ll finish in a bit when I have time to focus.



***

ETA: And, by "focus," I mean quiet time where my 4 year old isn't asking me to tape her inside a cardboard box that's the size of a DVR.
edit on 4/12/2018 by MotherMayEye because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 11:26 AM
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a reply to: shooterbrody

You are conflating the "Russian Investigation" with "Flynn Investigation" in transcripts.

Maybe you should quote Comey's testimony regarding when Trump asked him to drop the Flynn Investigation?





edit on 12-4-2018 by soberbacchus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 11:43 AM
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a reply to: soberbacchus

I did.
Thanks for reading what was quoted.

good day.



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 11:58 AM
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originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: soberbacchus

I did.
Thanks for reading what was quoted.

good day.


I meant fully:



COMEY: General Flynn at that point in time was in legal jeopardy. There was an open FBI criminal investigation of his statements in connection with the Russian contacts, and the contacts themselves, and so that was my assessment at the time. I don't think it's for me to say whether the conversation I had with the president was an effort to obstruct. I took it as a very disturbing thing, very concerning, but that's a conclusion I'm sure the special counsel will work towards to try and understand what the intention was there, and whether that's an offense.




COMEY: I don't know well enough to answer. The reason I keep saying his words is I took it as a direction.

RISCH: Right.

COMEY: I mean, this is a president of the United States with me alone saying I hope this. I took it as, this is what he wants me to do. I didn't obey that, but that's the way I took it.




COMEY: I understood what he wanted me to do was drop any investigation connected to Flynn's account of his conversations with the Russians.




FEINSTEIN: You describe two phone calls that you received from president trump. One on March 30th and one on April 11. He, quote, described the Russia investigation as a cloud that was impairing his ability, end quote, as president, and asked you, quote, to lift the cloud, end quote. How did you interpret that? What did you believe he wanted you to do?

COMEY: I interpreted that as he was frustrated that the Russia investigation was taking up so much time and energy. I think he meant of the executive branch, but in the public square in general. It was making it difficult for him to focus on other priorities of his. But what he asked me was actually narrowing than that. I think what he meant by the cloud — and, again, I could be wrong — but the entire investigation is taking up oxygen and making it hard for me to focus on what I want to focus on. The ask was to get it out that I, the president, am not personally under investigation.


BTW - Whilst not reported much, Trump asked Comey to "lift the cloud" of the Russia Investigation just prior to his firing, in addition to the Flynn bit.
edit on 12-4-2018 by soberbacchus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 12:05 PM
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I don't think it's for me to say whether the conversation I had with the president was an effort to obstruct.

So then what do you make of that?
If he doesn't know then who would?

lol
i hope.....
did you happen to read that comey testified under oath that he does not know of a SINGLE case of charges brought for "i hope"?

lol



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 12:39 PM
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originally posted by: shooterbrody



I don't think it's for me to say whether the conversation I had with the president was an effort to obstruct.

So then what do you make of that?
If he doesn't know then who would?



A Prosecutor or Special Counsel. In the context he was testifying as a witness providing information, not a prosecutor or SC or Judge et al.

And he did not say he "doesn't know", he said it was not "for him to say".

That's a proper answer for testimony from a witness without prosecutorial power.


edit on 12-4-2018 by soberbacchus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 12:49 PM
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a reply to: soberbacchus

lol
when it was "for him to say", he did exactly jack squat about it
his actions betray your words for him

no worries
carry on with your prosecution of "i hope"
as it is all you have left



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 03:16 PM
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originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: soberbacchus

lol
when it was "for him to say", he did exactly jack squat about it
his actions betray your words for him



??? He took appropriate action? He documented in real time and contemporaneously shared the bizarrely corrupt behavior of the President in case it ever evolved into more than words, like firing the Director of the FBI.



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 04:15 PM
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originally posted by: soberbacchus

originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: soberbacchus

lol
when it was "for him to say", he did exactly jack squat about it
his actions betray your words for him



??? He took appropriate action? He documented in real time and contemporaneously shared the bizarrely corrupt behavior of the President in case it ever evolved into more than words, like firing the Director of the FBI.


The NOTES are in admissable in any court in the US because they were leaked illegally. Trump needs to have a public trial instead of this crap. In florida would be a good court system.



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 04:44 PM
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originally posted by: yuppa

originally posted by: soberbacchus

originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: soberbacchus

lol
when it was "for him to say", he did exactly jack squat about it
his actions betray your words for him



??? He took appropriate action? He documented in real time and contemporaneously shared the bizarrely corrupt behavior of the President in case it ever evolved into more than words, like firing the Director of the FBI.


The NOTES are in admissable in any court in the US because they were leaked illegally.


They weren't "leaked" because they were not structured as classified Memos.
They were shared publicly by Comey via a buddy so Comey could avoid the press.

Were you lying or just confused?

Trump’s Unfounded Leak Claim
www.factcheck.org...

Facts, Truth...you should give them a try.
edit on 12-4-2018 by soberbacchus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 04:49 PM
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a reply to: soberbacchus

NO the appropriate action was to take the issue to his boss. Comey testified under oath he did not take this to his boss. I think comey attempted to hold the notes over trumps head for use at a later date, but that is only my opinion. The fact that comey gave the notes to a civilian with the intention to leak them to the media speaks volumes to comeys character.



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 05:00 PM
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originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: soberbacchus

NO the appropriate action was to take the issue to his boss.


Who? The man Trump picked who recused himself because he lied under oath about meetings with Russians?

Right...

Comey did it solid and by the book.
edit on 12-4-2018 by soberbacchus because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 12 2018 @ 05:07 PM
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originally posted by: MotherMayEye

originally posted by: soberbacchus

I have to ask MME, did you spot that on your own?




ETA: And, by "focus," I mean quiet time where my 4 year old isn't asking me to tape her inside a cardboard box that's the size of a DVR.


Tell her you will box her up and mail her to candyland!




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