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US army of the future knocking on the door!!

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posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 11:11 AM
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There is no honor in WAR and there never has. War is all about killing as many of your enemies as you can it has nothing to do with honor.

Im sure there were some knights using swords that thought there was no honor in using guns just before they died from a musket ball going through their armour since musketeers disagreed with them.




posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 11:21 AM
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first
"my statements in no way reflect the opinions of Intel corporation"

as you may have guessed, i work for intel. i can honestly say that autonomous vehicles are still pretty far in the future. they cant even negotiate a road for more than a few miles yet. let alone have an operational weapons system.

they had a race for autonomous vehicles and we entered and went like 2 miles, CMU was also in the race. no one finished.

cant do radio controlled coz that can be pirated with the greatest of ease, and if they do make autonomous vehix the recipe for an emp's is all over the net. once you find the frequency to a certain make/model of autonomous vehicle it is rendered useless in



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 12:01 PM
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Originally posted by silentlonewolf
yeah the sub could hold 3 aircraft i believe.

personally i always liked the idea of the battle being decided by the soldiers skill. There is way too many things that could go wrong with nano tech also. I k now this may sound absurd to most people but i find no honor in sending a bunch of exploding robots to wipe out an enemy.


I would definitely agree in terms on honorable combat. However in terms of defending lives, or trying to win a war i have to agree with Shadow, and that when your life or citizen's lives are in danger.....if you have to kick someone in the junk, bite, pull hair or do whatever else is necessary to survive.........then i think that is what you have to do. I guarantee you most other enemies will be looking to do the same to survive. I study traditional martial arts and try to be the most honorable person i can, but it seems to me that in military conflicts......the person that fights with all options on the table will most likely be much more effective.



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 12:31 PM
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This has been covered elsewhere on ats but I thought I'd bring it up again here:

www.cbsnews.com...
"The machines use what the researchers called a "passive-dynamic design" that closely mimics the way humans walk. Earlier robots required powerful machines to stroll, with each leg, knee and ankle requiring motorized assistance. The effort requires a lot of energy.

"The passive dynamic design uses gravity, along with muscle-like springs and motors. The energy required is just a fraction of that needed by other walking robots, said Andy Ruina, a Cornell University researcher."


It seems like this technology could really enhance the endurance and versatility of 'walker' type hominoid robots. Rather than building a bunch of asimo type things that need large power packs... you could use this passive-dynamic stuff to cut down on weight.



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 12:37 PM
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do a research on "beam robots" they can mimic learning also and you can make them out of walkman and pager parts. they even sell a vacuum cleaner type robot that 'learns' your floorplan (made with the exact same technology).

however, the fact remains that we are still decades away from autonomous entities be they vehicle or hominid shaped.



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 02:17 PM
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Yeah.....alot of concepts are definitely still a ways out. However, we are starting to gradually work alot of newer robot concepts into the military. UAV drones for recon missions. Robotics used for de-activating road side bombs. Robotic ATVs armed with guns on patrol at some of our air force bases. A decade sounds like a long time, but it really isn't that far out for some of these concepts. I imagine if we suddenly became engaged in a major scale war........The US department of defense would activate alot of projects that we don't see now. What do you guys think?



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 02:43 PM
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Originally posted by jprophet420
do a research on "beam robots" they can mimic learning also and you can make them out of walkman and pager parts. they even sell a vacuum cleaner type robot that 'learns' your floorplan (made with the exact same technology).

however, the fact remains that we are still decades away from autonomous entities be they vehicle or hominid shaped.


I want one of those little flat round objects to vacuum my floors and then go recharge and come again when dust settles again.


I wonder how much processor capacity such type of sensor using drone use as they need to have some memory also, i mean to ask how good image about their surroundings they have in memory, is the only some simple points or real 3d enviroment with smallest details, cause i think such autonomous vehicles that can map very detailed would also total knowledge over area. Such brings lot of other options as if its mounted with weaponry how big chance there is for drone to even miss anymore? With all possible sensors and total image of surrounding area, even knowledge about materials their densitity, how could such machine fail to compete vs human in the end?

Remote controlled robots doesnt really sound effective as autonomous drone that can make decisions faster than human behind console. Of course owns would be marked somehow and i doubt it would be even big issue in the end if ever get to that level.



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 02:51 PM
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Here is a cool link to US future concepts on space projected technology involving military concepts. Check it out!!!

www.space.com...



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 06:46 PM
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Ack...well since I've now found this thread, I'll post what I was thinking on here.

With all of this ‘new technology’ do you think we’ll soon see the emergence of Battle Suits, with Nano-technology as to heal the metal/person inside. Also how many years do you think till we’ll have ‘force fields’ to use the term? And also energy based weapons?



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 07:40 PM
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Originally posted by Observer83

Originally posted by jprophet420
do a research on "beam robots" they can mimic learning also and you can make them out of walkman and pager parts. they even sell a vacuum cleaner type robot that 'learns' your floorplan (made with the exact same technology).

however, the fact remains that we are still decades away from autonomous entities be they vehicle or hominid shaped.


I want one of those little flat round objects to vacuum my floors and then go recharge and come again when dust settles again.


I wonder how much processor capacity such type of sensor using drone use as they need to have some memory also, i mean to ask how good image about their surroundings they have in memory, is the only some simple points or real 3d enviroment with smallest details, cause i think such autonomous vehicles that can map very detailed would also total knowledge over area. Such brings lot of other options as if its mounted with weaponry how big chance there is for drone to even miss anymore? With all possible sensors and total image of surrounding area, even knowledge about materials their densitity, how could such machine fail to compete vs human in the end?

Remote controlled robots doesnt really sound effective as autonomous drone that can make decisions faster than human behind console. Of course owns would be marked somehow and i doubt it would be even big issue in the end if ever get to that level.

it doesent use a processor at all, it mimics a basic nervous system. it also doesent use memory per se. like i said read up on it.



posted on Feb, 18 2005 @ 08:49 PM
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Laser Pulse weapons with rechargable E-Clips...


gundam reference?



posted on Feb, 19 2005 @ 12:32 AM
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Originally posted by ShadowXIX
War is all about killing as many of your enemies as you can it has nothing to do with honor.


Man I totally disagree with you on that. Not all wars were started for the best of reasons but sometimes it's just the right thing to do. There's all kinds of ethnic cleansing going on in Africa. People are being slaughtered by the thousands for not being born on the right side or living in the wrong area. That's a situation where war would be honorable. I spent 8 years training in martial arts where I learned a very strict code of honor. I was taught that I should not hesitate to protect those that cannot protect themselves. Here's the purple belt creed: "I shall never let pride rule my passions and will defend, with all the skill I posses, the weak, the helpless, and the oppressed. I pledge an unswerving loyalty to my art, my fellow students, and my instructor. In addition, I pledge and unending effort to earn the self-same loyalty from those who look to me for training.". Sometimes war can be very honorable, and the soldiers who fight it, even more so.

But as for all this techno stuff, all I can say is wow. There seem's to be alot of potential in all these research ideas. But what are the snags that are keeping them from working? I like the idea of armored exoskeletons. But how would these things be powered? Battery power might run out at the worst possible time, so I thought maybe it could be rechargable on solar power. But solar panels would be susceptible to small arms fire. So then they would have to pack them away for combat. And then stop to deploy these panels to recharge unless, of course, the weather was bad or there was smoke. Also, if they were solor powered, they couldn't operate at night. So I'm wondering, would it be possible to install some kind of generator onboard?



posted on Feb, 19 2005 @ 05:43 AM
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the "Manned Ground Platform" reminds me of something hehehe










(Bundeswehr)

hehehe

And those UAPs, remind of of the german UAPs, Taifun (fighting drone), KZO Brevel (artillery recon drone), Aladin (stealth recon drone, that can get transported by one soldier, and is ready to fly after 5 minutes), Drohne CL289 (far range plane drone) and Luna X 2000 (far range rocket drone (sorry, dont want to act up, but to show that those things arent that much a future thingy, and could be in your forces more widely already, but you need atm the money for the iraq war, so a modernization would cost to much, especial buying biggger amounts of newer weapons)


I think soldier robots are interesting, even more, combat robots are interesting for me, I would like to know more about them, and when the US Forces get them, the problem is: what happens after an EMP?

Will all your combat and soldier robots be destroyed and billions of dollars wasted?

Are there plans on let them fight autonome, or do you want that they get controlled from far away by soldiers in bureos?

If you want to remotecontrol them, how do you want to protect yourself of radio interfering transmitter?



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 01:33 PM
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That was probally the number of soldiers we have in our entire military in the U.S., lol, MAN!!!!



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 02:00 PM
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These vehicles look like junk to me.

How are they any better then the current designs? They just are new chassis's. They arent advertising any new features, just a new look.

I like the m113 better.

And I think all of the other vehicles are ok too. Alot of the FCS vehicles are so ugly and cheap. One of them looks like a WWII Halftrack.

Hopefully they scrap this entire project. I can make better vehicles in AutoCAD then these losers.



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 04:10 PM
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Originally posted by ShadowXIX
There is no honor in WAR and there never has. War is all about killing as many of your enemies as you can it has nothing to do with honor.


You're wrong. In fact, you couldn't be more wrong if you'd said the moon was the sun.

There was once honor in warfare, that fact is well documented.

There was single combat, the concept of champions, there were rules and strict codes of conduct. There was discipline and self sacrifice, there was nobility and duty. Vestiges, scraps of those concepts linger on, but for the most part they have died and gone.

There have always been two kinds of people who fight battles, SOLDIERS and WARRIORS.

Soldiers are mercenaries, they are paid killers; unreliable, for the most part unskilled, and as willing to stab you in the back as your enemy for a price. Soldiers are warm bodies to feed the bloody grist mill, weapon-bearing platforms with minimal training and little education.

Warriors are sublime, the dichotomy of fury and patience merged into a single terrifying aspect, they are the gods of battle, and are worth more than a thousand spears or a hundred horses. They are learned men of verse, musicians and artists as well as killers. They have achieved balance between the martial and social, and when hostilities cease, they are not a detriment to their society like soldiers often are. Warriors are poets and statesmen, painters and diplomats. Above all, warriors are honorable.

I suggest you study the Samurai, or the Aztec warrior priests, or the Smoking Mirror. I pity you, because you know so little about the art of war, you know only death, and murder.

Your concept of war is a sign of our times. Men need not 'kill as many of their enemy as they can' in order to win a war. A single display of prowess is often enough, an intimidating rout or a perfectly executed calvary charge in all its glory. War is not about killing, it's about WINNING, victory for your side - and winning can be accomplished in any number of ways besides wholesale death and destruction.

You should educate yourself before speaking on such matters.

Especially when there are warriors waiting in the wings to discredit you.

Ashigaru and Samurai are not the same, never were, and never will be.

Just because most of the the Scholar Warriors are dead doesn't mean they never existed, and damn you for being so foolish as to say just that. Have you taken it upon yourself to rewrite history? Have you made it your quest to MURDER countless millenia worth of human honor and sacrifice upon the battlefield? It appears so.

Now that I'm done with that...

If any of y'all can get access to the research forum, there is a thread on the new military with a truckload of links, and more to come.



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 05:38 PM
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Originally posted by SEAL Trident
That was probally the number of soldiers we have in our entire military in the U.S., lol, MAN!!!!


what was the intension for that post?



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 05:44 PM
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Actually if by honor you mean agreeing with your enemy that you will met on Field X tomorrow at time X and draw at the same time and fire at teach other at the same time, I don't call that honor I call that stupidity.
War is about completing your objective and saving as many lives on your side as possible. There is none of this honor BS in War, like a famous commander once said, “War is hell”.



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 05:49 PM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
Actually if by honor you mean agreeing with your enemy that you will met on Field X tomorrow at time X and draw at the same time and fire at teach other at the same time, I don't call that honor I call that stupidity.
War is about completing your objective and saving as many lives on your side as possible. There is none of this honor BS in War, like a famous commander once said, “War is hell”.


I would say the battle in northern africa in WW II was "hornorful"



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 05:51 PM
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I was so pissed off about that lame-brained attack on honor, I forgot what I was originally going to post on this thread.

Starship troopers (the book) was much different than the movie with the same name. The movie was all about hoards of infantry with crappy weapons and plastic armor. The book was about robot warriors descending on alien worlds and wiping out thousands upon thousands of the enemy with micro nukes. They had jump jets, power armor, the whole nine yards. It was immensely cool. The movie was interesting for what it was, had some great gore scenes, but the book was by far more compelling.

I think the fundamental problem (from the Pentagon's POV) with augmenting soldiers with expensive exo skeletons is that soldiers are relatively cheap and plentiful. If that were not the case, and that's the trend we're following now, these systems will become more popular.

Frankly, you shouldn't have to kill for your government to go to college, that's just sick. If there is any real change in this country that will be the first thing to go. Mandatory military service is one thing, if instituted properly, but pitching warfare to the poor in exchange for education is tantamount to bribing a donkey with a carrot. Education should be given freely, not used as a bartering tool to secure more trigger fingers attached to extraneous minority bodies. There has been for some time a trend of racism and false promises by the US (and many other countries') military, that needs to end.

That being said, I've trained my whole life to pilot a mech, lemme at 'em.

Anybody read Ender's Game? I thought for years growing up I would be winning wars of the future with my RTS skills and my FPS reflexes. If only that were the truth now, bloodshed on our side would be almost completely eliminated.

As far as rechargeable e-clips..I dunno. I've been doing a lot of research on energy systems for the new military research project, and I don't see the technology as being practical. There's heat to worry about, and there's capacity, and there's stability, and there's weight, and there's steady power supply needs. These are just some of the limitations (mostly materials based).

I think caseless ammo or gauss rifles will be the next sea change in small arms, not energy rifles.



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