Does the Bible predict a one world government?, page 1
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Topic started on 17-2-2005 @ 12:41 PM by infinite
For many years now, i keep hearing the same thing over and over. The bible predicts the new world order i.e a one world government. Members of ATS, tell me nearly daily about it being seen in the Bible, i am now searching hard in the bible to find out if this is really true. Take a look at this passage from the bible;

At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people.
- Matthew 24:11


Does Matthew state the basic stepping stones of the new world order?? it doesn't really look like it, it mainly reads about people loosing faith etc.

This site has an interesting view on this subject;


Modern Technology & Other Signs of the End

The Bible, especially the book of Revelation, is filled with allegorical stories and symbolic tales. The problem is in interpretation. Are these stories prophetic warnings for us, or social commentary for the readers of the time of their writing? Fundamentalists and conspiratorialists try desperately to stretch apocalyptic writings (that were about the politics of their time) to fit modern times. They also try to fit poetic pictures of destruction into modern technology. The most obvious of these is the idea that fire raining down from heaven means nuclear-armed missiles. Another is the idea that the phrase "every eye shall see him" (Rev. 1:7) refers to the return of Christ being seen worldwide on television.

Hal Lindsey has speculated that the demonic locusts, the plague of the fifth trumpet, represent helicopters. Here is the actual description of the locusts from Rev. 9:7-10:

In appearance the locusts were like horses arrayed for battle; on their heads were what looked like crowns of gold; their faces were like human faces, their hair like women's hair, and their teeth like lions' teeth; they had scales like iron breastplates, and the noise of their wings was like the noise of many chariots rushing into battle. They have tails like scorpions, and stings, and their power of hurting men for five months lies in their tails.


www.skeptic.com...

So, the book of Revelation is where we need to look for the signs? ok lets get a basic understanding of the book of Revelation. The book of Revelation is the last book of the New Testament; contains visionary descriptions of heaven and of conflicts between good and evil and of the end of the world; attributed to Saint John the apostle.

According to www.forerunner.com... the beast is a world dictator who will bring about the new world order. Lets have a look at Revelation 13

And I saw a beast coming out of the sea. He had ten horns and seven heads, with ten crowns on his horns, and on each head a blasphemous name. 2The beast I saw resembled a leopard, but had feet like those of a bear and a mouth like that of a lion. The dragon gave the beast his power and his throne and great authority. 3One of the heads of the beast seemed to have had a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed. The whole world was astonished and followed the beast. 4Men worshiped the dragon because he had given authority to the beast, and they also worshiped the beast and asked, “Who is like the beast? Who can make war against him?”

Ten horns and seven heads? first impression, this gives me a picture of nations joined together, which is the beast. Just my theory on the matter. Also, one of the head has a fatal wound? America after Sept.11th?. The world is meant to follow the beast, possible the war on terrorism? who knows (these are not my personal views on the matter, just theories)

Revelation seems to be the most important part of the bible, when we are looking for the new world order. Most tend to state these are where most are the signs are;


Chapter 21-22: A new world order with peace on earth, after the Battle of Armageddon, in the New Jerusalem. A thousand years of peace and prosperity on earth, after Armageddon, followed by another Armageddon. A city called the New Jerusalem descends from heaven. The New Jerusalem has twelve gates, and the walls have precious stones.


www.revelation13.net...

Revelation 21-22?? lets have a quick outline to this chapter. Revelation 21 speaks of a "New Jerusalem",


1Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. 2I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. 3And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. 4He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”


Could this be a good new world order? a peaceful government that is waiting for us after a war on Earth? Revelation 22 speaks of the river of life and the second coming of Jesus.

Overall, i can see why some are making claims that the bible forsees a new world order. It is not really detailed enough, but this is really open to debate and you can interpret the meanings in different ways.



[edit on 17-2-2005 by infinite]


reply posted on 18-2-2005 @ 10:11 AM by Nygdan
www.abu.nb.ca...
The author of the Book of Revelation implicitly is identified as one of the prophets. This may help in identifying the author if an apostle would not identify himself as a prophet in this way. If so, then the possibility of identifying this John with John the son of Zebedee is eliminated.

, Dionysius of Alexandria (died 265) still did not accept the Johannine authorship of the Book of Revelation. He correctly observed that there were substantial differences between the Gospel of John and the letters, on the one hand, and the Book of Revelation, on the other, too many, in his opinion, to allow for the attribution of Johannine authorship to the latter. The following are the differences noticed by Dionysius (as quoted by Eusebius, H.E. 7.25): [...]

Papias mentioned two Johns, one of whom was associated with the apostles (although he is also called an elder), while the other was called John the elder (although he was called a disciple of the Lord). In Eusebius' day, there were two tombs in Ephesus, both identified as John's. In Eusebius' estimation, this pointed to the conclusion that there were two men in Ephesus by the name of John, the apostle and the elder

however
hellbusters.8m.com...
Irenaeus, second generation from John the Apostle, maintained that John saw the Revelation late in Domitian's reign

although, from the same page
Had John returned from Patmos at age 90+, [in 95A.D.], consider: Clement claims John went into the wilderness on horseback and chased down a former convert turned criminal, physically capturing him, and taught him once again the truth! [7] Could John do this at age 90+; the age he would have been if Revelation was written in 94-95? [...]
Victorinus in his citation, insists that John was working in the mines of Patmos when exiled there. How could this be the case if John was well into his nineties? [9] One should be very cautious then, in maintaining the strength of the external testimony in regard to the date of the Apocalypse. The testimony is at best debatable, scant and interdependent.

More information seems to be at
www.preteristarchive.com...

It looks like, to a first degree anyway, that Ireneaus and Justin Martyr along with Tertullian, Clement and Origen beleived the author was John the Apostle, and that Eusebeus and Dionysius, along with 'Gaius of Rome' attribute it to someone else.
I don't think its entirely clear that the John of revelation is meant to be John the Apostle and there seems to be relative consensus that the author, regardless of who the church beleived wrote them, of the book of revelation and the lettters of john are two differenet people.


reply posted on 18-2-2005 @ 11:17 AM by wecomeinpeace
Nice post Infintite.

The authorship of the Book of Revelation is traditionally attributed to John the Apostle, however there are quite a few "Johns" that surround the life of Jesus and the issue of who truly penned it is still contested. It seems there is no solid proof either way, only circumstances and dates that can be used to point to a likely author.

I can't seem to find any "new world order" line in Revelation 21 as you quoted, Infinite. In all the versions I checked, it refers to a "new heaven and a new earth", as in your third quotation. E.g:
King James Version: "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea."
New American Standard Bible: "Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and there is no longer any sea."
I'm asssuming that the quote you provided is from a modern essay on the subject, or perhaps from the Mormon additions.

Originally posted by Infinite
Overall, i can see why some are making claims that the bible forsees a new world order. It is not really detailed enough, but this is really open to debate and you can interpret the meanings in different ways.
Agreed.

The apparent single-mindedness of the majority of people worshipping the Beast as written of in Revelation alludes more to a one-world religion than a one-world government, however it stands to reason that a world united under one religion would also be united politically, i.e. under the rule of the Beast. In order to turn humankind away from God en masse, and to instigate organized persecution and murder of Christians, a one-world system of rule would be an absolute prerequisite.

Also as you mentioned, popular interpretation of the Beast implies that it may well be a coalition of nations rather than a single being. A "Coalition of the Willing"? The European Union? Who knows? Some even go so far as to interpret the different animal aspects of the Beast as referring to nations that exist today; the bear being Russia, the lion being the United Kingdom, and the dragon being China. So once again, we see reasonable interpretation pointing towards some sort of new order of nations and alliances different to what we have at the moment.

Anothe popular interpretation is that the Beast is the combination of the Catholic Church and the European Union. In Revelation 17, some of the symbology of the text is defined:

9 Here is the mind which has wisdom The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits, [interpreted to mean the seven hills of Rome]

10 and they are seven kings; five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; and when he comes, he must remain a little while.

11 The beast which was and is not, is himself also an eighth and is one of the seven, and he goes to destruction.

12 The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but they receive authority as kings with the beast for one hour.

13 These have one purpose, and they give their power and authority to the beast.

The ten nations are interpreted to perhaps mean the European union.
www.contenderministries.org...
"The EU today is made up of over 25 countries, however the ten nations of the Western European Alliance have a separate status as full members, while those nations who joined subsequent to the original 10 have only associate membership, or observer status."


Since it does not appear to actually state the words "new world order" in Revelation, we have to look for apparent allusions to such.

Revelation 19:19 appears to suggest that the kings of men will be united under the Beast.
20:19 And I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies assembled to make war against Him who sat on the horse and against His army.


In Revelation 20, we see an apparent gathering of nations by Satan to make war on Jerusalem.
20:7 When the thousand years are completed, Satan will be released from his prison,

20:8 and will come out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together for the war; the number of them is like the sand of the seashore.

20:9 And they came up on the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, and fire came down from heaven and devoured them.


I could go on and on, but I'll summise by saying that IMHO, institution of a new world order will definitely be an integral part, and indeed a clear sign of the endtimes.

Great post, Infinite, and a fascinating topic.


reply posted on 22-2-2005 @ 10:23 PM by jfdarby
quote: Originally posted by Nygdan
Isn't revelation written by a different john, not john the apostle? While he was in exile, sent to exile by nero

I'll Try to help here a little but you may think me silly...

It is belived that John The Apostil, was given the Apocalypse From Jesus Christ on the Island of Patmos in A.D. 90 though 96...



quote: King James Version: "And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea."
New American Standard Bible: "Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and there is no longer any sea."

These are what John saw when Jesus show him the time periol after the 1000 year reign of Jesus Christ, and after the Great White Throne Judgment..







quote:
9 Here is the mind which has wisdom The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits, [interpreted to mean the seven hills of Rome]

10 and they are seven kings; five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; and when he comes, he must remain a little while.

11 The beast which was and is not, is himself also an eighth and is one of the seven, and he goes to destruction.

12 The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but they receive authority as kings with the beast for one hour.

13 These have one purpose, and they give their power and authority to the beast.


The Seven Heads/ Hills is the city of Rome.
The Kinge were and are the 7 world leaders, At the time of the writings, 5 had falling but Rome is the one that is at that time and the one that has not Yet, is the new/coming Roman impair. The City of the 7 hills..

The Beast is said to be a computer Which is big enough to hold ALL the records of everyone on earth, The mark of the beast is thought to be a chip that is put in your forhead or on the back of your right hand.. and the Beast will follow you all around and any busness you do will be through the chip and will go through the Beast for a record on You. Without the chip, You will not be able to buy or sale, For all trading will have to go through the Beast..

I remember back after the UN was put in, that they cut the world up into 10 peces so that they could goveren when they would lead the earth under one goverment./// ( but that will be done out of Rpme) and they will all sever the Beast.. at this time the world would be goning under one leader ( the Beast) for a short time " 7 Years". These 7 years will be the Years of Tribulation. 3 and 1/2 of not to bad then 3 and1/2 years of HELL on earth.

After the 7 years of Tribulation are over is when Christ will come a second time and rule the world for a 1000 Years and Satan will be Bound for that 1000 years time spand....
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