Trump not criminal target says Mueller

LOL LOl LOL . This was supposed to impeach him just ask silly or anti......

So how are they gonna impeach him now? The hooker?

originally posted by: notsure1
LOL LOl LOL . This was supposed to impeach him just ask silly or anti......

So how are they gonna impeach him now? The hooker?

But what happened? I thought everybody "flipped" on POTUS



It's Mueller time

a reply to: Scrubdog

You know nothing about criminal investigations.

Cute and classy.

A "target" cannot be subpeoned bc of 5th Amendment rights, and therefore you would never, ever, tell a person you want to subpoena that they are a "target."

A target most certainly can be subpoenaed. As to fifth amendment rights, which I'm not arguing, there is a handy law called Contempt of Court for just such occasions.

originally posted by: notsure1
LOL LOl LOL . This was supposed to impeach him just ask silly or anti......

So how are they gonna impeach him now? The hooker?

CNN says that it could be FAKE NEWS, lol. They won't believe it until Mueller himself makes the announcement. Arseholes.

a reply to: JBurns

it demonstrates no one has "flipped" as others have speculated or that Mueller (like FBI and HPSCI) failed to uncover evidence of a crime.

The investigation is ongoing. Neither you nor I know what has been gathered, but it's looking at everything. In addition, don't so easily dismiss the very real indictments and guilty pleas.

Looks like all of those levying false accusations of treason and Soviet bed-scares should feel pretty silly right now.

It exists, but the extent and players are still being uncovered.

a reply to: Liquesence

Sure it exists. It has existed since before the cold war. Since the Rosebergs. The scam is hawks & opportunists on the left & right pushing a false narrative to whip the populace into a frenzy to harm Trump's presidency.

Trump had nothing to do with this very common activity of political manipulation/intelligence.

a reply to: carewemust

They will believe it when Mueller releases his up & coming public report.

Mueller should be proud of himself. He nailed a handful of decades-old conspirators, and despite seemingly turning a blind eye to several others, I'd say that catching criminals is always a good thing

originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: Liquesence

Sure it exists. It has existed since before the cold war. Since the Rosebergs. The scam is hawks & opportunists on the left & right pushing a false narrative to whip the populace into a frenzy to harm Trump's presidency.

Trump had nothing to do with this very common activity of political manipulation/intelligence.

So, it's a conspiracy since before the cold war to undermine Trump's presidency?

originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: Scrubdog

Keep on believing

Whatever the cost, right?

In reality, you have no idea what you're talking about. Minus the copy/paste witness/subject/target spiel (DU).

Simply put, Mueller cleared Trump as a criminal target. Spin it however you want, but you need to accept the reality that Mueller won't end the Trump Presidency. Get used to this reality.

Besides, what happened to all of Trump's former associates "flipping" as you said many times? If they flipped, Mueller would have the evidence making him a target vs. not a target. That's yet one more theory put to rest tonight. What have I missed?

I have 20 years in criminal defense, as an attorney and wrote that off the top of my head.

Mueller didn't "clear" Trump of anything. Had he wanted to ""clear him" he wouldn't have called him a subject.

The people who flipped, are the ones that are making Trump the subject. Did you read that part in the Washington Post story? The one where he confirmed he is a subject?

But, please pretty please with sugar on it - use your vast legal prowess to volunteer to represent Trump. . No one else will, I think you are perfect for the job.

And, Mueller likely won't end the Trump presidency, bc there aren't 33 princpled Republicans in the US Senate, so I never thought that. I just want to know if the prez is a Russian agent, or if he simply acts like one bc he doesn't know better.

I suppose we can anticipate Trump leaping to the interview since he wants this over and has been cleared, right?

**There was a way to "clear" Trump, and he didn't do it. . He is trying to get Trump to an interview, you think it is all by magic that this occurred right after the lawyer who said "No, don't interview" just quit, don't you?

a reply to: Liquesence

Of course not. The objective is to use hysteria and scare-mongering to convince the people that what happened was somehow unique/unusual or otherwise an imminent threat. It has been going on for decades. 100+ years, maybe. We do it also. Along with every other major nation in the world.

It is no more-so a threat than the myriad (and I mean thousands) of other "attacks" our nation is subjected to on a daily basis. Just look at the global threat map, and see how many incidents are on-going at any given time. It is unsettling to hear some of the incidents and lingo, but innuendo and speculation played a major role in shaping public perception of an otherwise pretty mundane event.

As far as elections go, we have de-centralization and the electoral college to prevent foreign subversion.

The MSM/opportunists have spun this standard event into a world-shaking panic inducing spy novel. And it simply isn't that interesting or unusual.

a reply to: Scrubdog

The people who flipped, are the ones that are making Trump the subject. Did you read that part in the Washington Post story? The one where he confirmed he is a subject?

So you're saying there was information, it just simply wasn't good enough to warrant actually naming him as a target of the wide-ranging investigation? So we agree Trump's not in legal jeopardy?

I'd just like to know where Mueller is supposed to dig up this required evidence? Especially if Trump is smart and invokes 5A rights. Without Trump, Mueller has nothing and he knows it. And if you were really an attorney, you should know it. Legal trickery aside, innuendo, feigned outrage and speculation just isn't going to cut it.

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: Scrubdog

You know nothing about criminal investigations.

Cute and classy.

A "target" cannot be subpeoned bc of 5th Amendment rights, and therefore you would never, ever, tell a person you want to subpoena that they are a "target."

A target most certainly can be subpoenaed. As to fifth amendment rights, which I'm not arguing, there is a handy law called Contempt of Court for just such occasions.

You cannot be held in contempt of court for asserting your 5th Amend rights. You do have to show up, but if you know you're a target, you will not answer anything substantive.

He doesn't know anything, call it classless if you want, but JBurns is doing a jig bc he believes this means that Trump is cleared.

Please, no one believe me. Please please please, it is all over, truly - obviously, I don't know what I'm talking about. Get on Brietbart, and Fox, and assure Trump it's all over, he's beaten them all.

Oh, and this means that the Washington Post is now news that can be trusted, since it is their scoop.

a reply to: Scrubdog

You cannot be held in contempt of court for asserting your 5th Amend rights. You do have to show up, but if you know you're a target, you will not answer anything substantive.

Obviously. Never suggested you could. In fact, I asserted (correctly) that one may invoke their 5A right at any time they choose.

He doesn't know anything, call it classless if you want, but JBurns is doing a jig bc he believes this means that Trump is cleared.

Can't attack my argument so you attack me. That is OK. I most certainly am. Not because he was "cleared" but because Mueller admits he doesn't have evidence to charge Trump. No "flipping" provided that evidence. No digging. No investigation. No evidence is no evidence. Therefore, I'm celebrating because unless Trump moronically agrees to sit for an interview or not invoke his 5A right, Mueller can't possibly get that much needed evidence.

Ergo, he won't face any charges. 3-7 more years.

You can't use this false narrative to impeach your President's reputation any longer.

Well, you can. But you'd meet Obama's definition of a "bitter clinger." The preponderance of evidence suggests Trump will not face any charges.

a reply to: Scrubdog

Let me try to keep up with all your buzzzzzing around.

You cannot be held in contempt of court for asserting your 5th Amend rights. You do have to show up, but if you know you're a target, you will not answer anything substantive.

That would largely depend on the evidence presented and its legitimacy. Including witness testimony.

He doesn't know anything, call it classless if you want, but JBurns is doing a jig bc he believes this means that Trump is cleared.

This single statement is largely what is being pointed at:

Special counsel Robert S. Mueller III informed President Trump’s attorneys last month that he is continuing to investigate the president but does not consider him a criminal target at this point, according to three people familiar with the discussions.

Now, Mueller doesn't need to be telling the truth. Especially if it's pointed out that they are want to get Trump into an interview or perjure trap. However, that would give Trump the ability to fire him. Then Mueller could push for obstruction in a much more legitimate manner than say..Comey. BUT the ends wouldn't justify the means. So by a fairly reasoned assumption is that Trump is in fact clear.

Please, no one believe me. Please please please, it is all over, truly - obviously, I don't know what I'm talking about. Get on Brietbart, and Fox, and assure Trump it's all over, he's beaten them all.

Oh, and this means that the Washington Post is now news that can be trusted, since it is their scoop.

Oh please.

a reply to: JinMI

Their abounding non-sequiturs and logical fallacies amuse me

WAPO should never live down their BS "Democracy dies in darkness" byline. And their reputation today is about as good as CNN's: they'd rather report on the salacious rumors than on the real issues that affect this country.

Sadly journalists of the good days knew how to track down a story and blow it wide open

And they also knew how to graciously admit when they were entirely mistake

Wonder if WAPO will salvage a tid bit of its dignity by admitting this? Or if they'll take CNN's path and try to label it "fake news," forever resigning themselves to the same league as hacks like R. Maddow

a reply to: JBurns

Based on the WAPO Trump is the following:

1. Not a criminal target.

2. Also possibly looking at obstruction of justice (defeats the 1st point)

3. Still needs to be interviewed (defeating points 1 and 2)

Soooooooo...

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: JBurns

Based on the WAPO Trump is the following:

1. Not a criminal target.

2. Also possibly looking at obstruction of justice (defeats the 1st point)

3. Still needs to be interviewed (defeating points 1 and 2)

Soooooooo...

And specifically limited to "time in office" because Robert Costa just reported that Mueller team is on 2 tracks. They do not believe they can prosecute (under the law) anything committed while in office, that is for Congress and impeachment - so that is what they are preparing the report upon, the "obstruction report" that will be out in June or July for Congress. The second track is "crimes committed before office" which was NOT mentioned in the "subject" discussions, and is behavior that they do possess the power to prosecute, though it is yet to be determined whether they have to wait or not.

But, please Mr. Trump, please believe you're cleared right after the lawyer who said "Don't do the interview" quit, please believe that.

a reply to: JinMI

This is true, I just find the narrative of "incontrovertible evidence of collusion" to be significantly lacking at this point

I wonder how much the bogus dossier and pro-Clinton agents were involved with shaping the initial probe. I would like to know what evidence there has ever been that President Trump was involved in some crime, because it seems there is still none

It will be interesting to see if/when the public report is available. With any luck, it will put this entire matter to rest and the country can move on to productive things

a reply to: JBurns

Mueller can begin to take down the "Most Wanted" photos of Trump people from the dart-boards, and replace them with photos of Obama's people.