Media gun control darling Hogg embarasses himself by being uninformed

a reply to: odzeandennz

Do you like seeing a high school kid being used as a mouthpiece of the left in an attempt to eradicate the second amendment?

Theres something just not right about this kid. Seriously not right
1. Look at every pic of him ,he looks like someone ate his last lunchable.
2. All this going on and him pushing so hard has gone beyond being a "Survivor" were past that, theres so much more behind this.

Im telling you something isnt right and I hope someone has the guts to investigate it.

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: odzeandennz

Do you like seeing a high school kid being used as a mouthpiece of the left in an attempt to eradicate the second amendment?

especially when mysteriously, the kids who dont agree with them, do not get the same sounding board or activities, are always left out of events, and have tried to get on media news sites other than places like FOX and NONE WILL TAKE THEM.

No not agenda here at all.

a reply to: TrueBrit

That was a well thought out reply.

I am glad to see a Brit that shows understanding of what is involved in this American problem, and that a fix is not easy.
A star on your post, sir.

a reply to: butcherguy

I appreciate that butcherguy.

It just frustrates me that so many people are obviously motivated and inspired to act for what they see as the greater good, but so few seem to be capable of working out what that greater good actually requires. If the NRA and the Anti-Gun folks were locked in a room together (without guns), and no one would let them out until they came to an understanding with one another about their aims, they would quickly find their aims to be the same, largely speaking.

Real advocates for the second amendment, want gun owners to behave responsibly. Anti-Gunners just don't want to get shot, and the reality is that neither group will get what it wants in that regard, unless they work together to keep the lunatics away from the guns, because doing things the other way around will simply not work.

This whole thing is sad and disturbing that the news media/leftists are using these children as a political tool. I would venture to say that 90% of these kids were there just to cut class and have no opinion on gun control. The only thing they know is want they have been told by their teachers and agitators on social media.

I have raised 3 children and 5 grandchildren and I know how stupid they are at this age. They are easily motivated to be unruly and to act up at the least provocation. They are more interested it socialization than education. Went given an opportunity to get out of class any excuse will do! They will eat Tide Pods, drink alcohol to excess and wreck the family car in an attempt to act mature. They are not! Even in college they continue their reckless behavior with panty parties, frat parties and unprotected sex.

The gun control demonstration in Parkland came too quickly for the kids to have organized it themselves. The "crew cut" girl spoke as if she reading prepared script. The Hogg boy is so lost in all the fray and appears to be just looking for attention.

The FBI has some explaining to do. They dropped the ball twice in this ordeal. They dropped the ball in the Boston Marathon bombing as well. Each time they ignored warnings to the event. There was only one time that they did not. Several years ago, they apprehended a young boy from western Cincinnati that was going to attack congress. They moved swiftly to capture this young man in the gun store parking lot. Does the FBI prioritize their response to the importance of the target? There is much more to this story that I will not cover here.

a reply to: buddah6

Ah, now here we come unstuck.

The idea that the kids in the high school and school shootings, the survivors of these events, have no idea what they are talking about is frankly insulting. They know more about guns, having been shot at, than does anyone who has only ever fired one, that much is, to my mind, without doubt. They know more about what happens downrange, the important element, than most people of their age ever will, and a great deal more than most gun owners will ever know about it too, because most gun owners do not get shot at. They shoot things. There is a very big difference. The sound, the concussion... those things do not speak as loudly to shooters as they do to things and people which are down range of the fired round.

You can disagree, as I do, with their reactions to what they have experienced, but you cannot deny their experience itself.

originally posted by: gernblan
From a post I saw on Facebook:

Rachel is feeling thoughtful.
14 March at 07:09 ·
My son asked if he could walk out in protest today...here's how the conversation went...
Son: is it ok if I protest on Wednesday?
Me: protest what? Why would you do that?
Son: protests initiate change; they bring awareness to the issue
Me: yes, like what...
Son: like civil rights; people had to protest for the right to vote, etc (he went on)
Me: that's true! Protests can be a great catalyst. So what are you protesting?
Son: gun laws
Me: and what are the current gun laws?
Son: I don't know, but they need to change
Me: how do you know that if you don't know what they are? Who makes the gun laws? Whose attention are you trying to get? State, federal, local...?
Son: I don't know
Me: then no, you may not protest in ignorance. You don't protest something just bc everyone else is doing it. What is happening in our schools is wrong, and scary, and sad, and yes, some things need to change. But you must educate yourself before you can be an agent of change.
...I'm all about protesting for change, for justice, and being passionate about a cause; I'm not about blindly following the crowd in ignorance...

I saw this as well. I also saw comments from people mocking it. Just goes to show you they don't care about real solutions. If it's not banning guns, they're not interested.

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: gernblan
From a post I saw on Facebook:

Rachel is feeling thoughtful.
14 March at 07:09 ·
My son asked if he could walk out in protest today...here's how the conversation went...
Son: is it ok if I protest on Wednesday?
Me: protest what? Why would you do that?
Son: protests initiate change; they bring awareness to the issue
Me: yes, like what...
Son: like civil rights; people had to protest for the right to vote, etc (he went on)
Me: that's true! Protests can be a great catalyst. So what are you protesting?
Son: gun laws
Me: and what are the current gun laws?
Son: I don't know, but they need to change
Me: how do you know that if you don't know what they are? Who makes the gun laws? Whose attention are you trying to get? State, federal, local...?
Son: I don't know
Me: then no, you may not protest in ignorance. You don't protest something just bc everyone else is doing it. What is happening in our schools is wrong, and scary, and sad, and yes, some things need to change. But you must educate yourself before you can be an agent of change.
...I'm all about protesting for change, for justice, and being passionate about a cause; I'm not about blindly following the crowd in ignorance...

I saw this as well. I also saw comments from people mocking it. Just goes to show you they don't care about real solutions. If it's not banning guns, they're not interested.

That's similar to discussions I have with my boys.

I probe their thoughts and try to get them to actually research the claims they make. They seem to ask pretty good questions overall and have a healthy skepticism of others unproven claims.

a reply to: TrueBrit

I agree with much of what you said here, with a few exceptions. I do think it matters that the new face of the gun control movement appears uninformed, whether it was his fault or through whoever edited the video, and by extension the larger perception by gun owners that many gun control proponents are uninformed. That's a problem. How are we supposed to take these people seriously when it's obvious they have no idea what they're talking about? How do we reach a sensible solution through discussion with people who don't really understand the subject? So yeah, that is a problem, and the longer they insist on remaining uninformed the longer it will take to reach a solution.

I'd also have to disagree that both sides fail to recognize that there are certain people who don't need to be walking around free in our society, much less with a gun. That's something gun rights advocates continue to focus on, and are mostly ignored on by the gun control advocates. They want to focus on the gun. We want to focus on the people, because, as you said, if you take away guns these nutcases will just use something else. There was a woman a few years ago who went off her meds and set her 3 daughters on fire. What do you ban to prevent that? People are the problem.

ETA: Just to be clear, people being uninformed is not an insurmountable problem. People can be taught. The underlying problem is many of them don't want to learn. They just want to recite memorized statistics and senseless proposals.

originally posted by: SailorJerry

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: odzeandennz

Do you like seeing a high school kid being used as a mouthpiece of the left in an attempt to eradicate the second amendment?

especially when mysteriously, the kids who dont agree with them, do not get the same sounding board or activities, are always left out of events, and have tried to get on media news sites other than places like FOX and NONE WILL TAKE THEM.

No not agenda here at all.

[sarcasm]You're wrong. The kids pushing for gun control are totally independent and made up their own minds. No influence from teachers or parents at all.[/sarcasm]

Kindergarten gun control

my sister went to school with three people who just *pauses for effect* died im david hogg everybody, goodnight!
*applause*

a reply to: TrueBrit

Sadly, I know what it's like to be shot and shot at. I served two tours in Vietnam with the first being a heavy weapons platoon leader and two years later as a helicopter pilot. So I think I have a good grip on the gun aspect. I also speak with some authority about school children as I worked for a large metropolitan school district in southern Ohio for many years until my retirement.

I am sure that in grade 12, you were not as in tune to events around you as you are today! The 15-18 year old high schooler is not fully developed mentally as you are later in life. That is just fact! There are a few exceptions but these kids are not those. What you are seeing was organized and planned by more mature thought processes. No high schoolers could arrange for busses for trips to Tallahassee and Washington without adult assistance. This walkout was directed by school administrators, teachers and activists with political intent. Children in Kindergarten also participated...this is nothing but indoctrination at it's worst.

originally posted by: buddah6
a reply to: TrueBrit

Sadly, I know what it's like to be shot and shot at. I served two tours in Vietnam with the first being a heavy weapons platoon leader and two years later as a helicopter pilot. So I think I have a good grip on the gun aspect. I also speak with some authority about school children as I worked for a large metropolitan school district in southern Ohio for many years until my retirement.

I am sure that in grade 12, you were not as in tune to events around you as you are today! The 15-18 year old high schooler is not fully developed mentally as you are later in life. That is just fact! There are a few exceptions but these kids are not those. What you are seeing was organized and planned by more mature thought processes. No high schoolers could arrange for busses for trips to Tallahassee and Washington without adult assistance. This walkout was directed by school administrators, teachers and activists with political intent. Children in Kindergarten also participated...this is nothing but indoctrination at it's worst.

Well its been proven that the school walkouts were organized by the same people who organized the womens march against the Trump presidency, guess who?

George effing Soros.

a reply to: face23785

ETA: Just to be clear, people being uninformed is not an insurmountable problem. People can be taught. The underlying problem is many of them don't want to learn. They just want to recite memorized statistics and senseless proposals.

Because that's the easy way. Not the right way, though I suppose, totally by accident, that it could, at times, be so.

It's easier to go along than it is to forge ones own path, or think for themselves. Herd mentality.

originally posted by: buddah6
a reply to: TrueBrit

Sadly, I know what it's like to be shot and shot at. I served two tours in Vietnam with the first being a heavy weapons platoon leader and two years later as a helicopter pilot. So I think I have a good grip on the gun aspect. I also speak with some authority about school children as I worked for a large metropolitan school district in southern Ohio for many years until my retirement.

I am sure that in grade 12, you were not as in tune to events around you as you are today! The 15-18 year old high schooler is not fully developed mentally as you are later in life. That is just fact! There are a few exceptions but these kids are not those. What you are seeing was organized and planned by more mature thought processes. No high schoolers could arrange for busses for trips to Tallahassee and Washington without adult assistance. This walkout was directed by school administrators, teachers and activists with political intent. Children in Kindergarten also participated...this is nothing but indoctrination at it's worst.

As someone that's been shot at, would you agree that the mere fact that you've been shot at doesn't give you any magical understanding of guns, gun policy and gun laws? I don't see how it would. I mean, if you've never driven before and know nothing about cars and you get hit by a car, you don't all of a sudden become an auto expert. I do acknowledge your training makes you more knowledgeable than most. Your experience may make you more knowledgeable about how a gunfight unfolds, but none of these kids were in a gunfight. No one was there to shoot back at this guy.

Rather than type my thoughts here, ill just share an image that summarizes it pretty well:



There is a reason we don't let children aren't allowed to vote.

originally posted by: Allaroundyou
a reply to: face23785
And wanted to add I completely agree with you on this. Just wanted to point this out. We have to teach for them to learn.

But they have to want to learn in order to be teachable, and right now, I don't think that's their mindset.

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: buddah6
a reply to: TrueBrit

Sadly, I know what it's like to be shot and shot at. I served two tours in Vietnam with the first being a heavy weapons platoon leader and two years later as a helicopter pilot. So I think I have a good grip on the gun aspect. I also speak with some authority about school children as I worked for a large metropolitan school district in southern Ohio for many years until my retirement.

I am sure that in grade 12, you were not as in tune to events around you as you are today! The 15-18 year old high schooler is not fully developed mentally as you are later in life. That is just fact! There are a few exceptions but these kids are not those. What you are seeing was organized and planned by more mature thought processes. No high schoolers could arrange for busses for trips to Tallahassee and Washington without adult assistance. This walkout was directed by school administrators, teachers and activists with political intent. Children in Kindergarten also participated...this is nothing but indoctrination at it's worst.

As someone that's been shot at, would you agree that the mere fact that you've been shot at doesn't give you any magical understanding of guns, gun policy and gun laws? I don't see how it would. I mean, if you've never driven before and know nothing about cars and you get hit by a car, you don't all of a sudden become an auto expert. I do acknowledge your training makes you more knowledgeable than most. Your experience may make you more knowledgeable about how a gunfight unfolds, but none of these kids were in a gunfight. No one was there to shoot back at this guy.

I was responding to how the children felt after being traumatized by the shooting. That is correct that being shot at doesn't give you any understanding of gun violence. I would venture to say that most of the children in that school were unaware until they were told about what had happened. AND it doesn't make them experts on what to do.

My major concern is how these kids are being used as "useful idiots" and indoctrinated to a leftist ideology. I know from personal experience as to how this is transpiring.

Have you ever wondered how the FBI and law enforcement miss so many opportunities to stop these events? How do they get only the treats aimed at the government? Are they lazy or overworked? Are they unconcerned to only attacks that go after the government?

originally posted by: buddah6

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: buddah6
a reply to: TrueBrit

Sadly, I know what it's like to be shot and shot at. I served two tours in Vietnam with the first being a heavy weapons platoon leader and two years later as a helicopter pilot. So I think I have a good grip on the gun aspect. I also speak with some authority about school children as I worked for a large metropolitan school district in southern Ohio for many years until my retirement.

I am sure that in grade 12, you were not as in tune to events around you as you are today! The 15-18 year old high schooler is not fully developed mentally as you are later in life. That is just fact! There are a few exceptions but these kids are not those. What you are seeing was organized and planned by more mature thought processes. No high schoolers could arrange for busses for trips to Tallahassee and Washington without adult assistance. This walkout was directed by school administrators, teachers and activists with political intent. Children in Kindergarten also participated...this is nothing but indoctrination at it's worst.

As someone that's been shot at, would you agree that the mere fact that you've been shot at doesn't give you any magical understanding of guns, gun policy and gun laws? I don't see how it would. I mean, if you've never driven before and know nothing about cars and you get hit by a car, you don't all of a sudden become an auto expert. I do acknowledge your training makes you more knowledgeable than most. Your experience may make you more knowledgeable about how a gunfight unfolds, but none of these kids were in a gunfight. No one was there to shoot back at this guy.

Have you ever wondered how the FBI and law enforcement miss so many opportunities to stop these events? How do they get only the treats aimed at the government? Are they lazy or overworked? Are they unconcerned to only attacks that go after the government?

One thing I've heard a number of former agents talk about who have been interviewed is that these type of tips used to come into the local field office. Now they come into a centralized tip line, where some agents who are swamped with more work than they can handle and are understandably detached from the whole thing because they're in DC and this is in FL have to prioritize everything. This was changed decades ago to save money by not having as many or as large field offices.

I'd say it's time to go back to the way they used to do it. The agents at the field office are much closer to the situation, and perhaps if multiple tips were coming in about the same individual they would piece that together. People up in DC who are dealing with tips from all over the country are less likely to remember 6 months later hey didn't we get a tip about this guy before? when a new one comes in about the same individual. It would also be much easier for these field offices to work with local law enforcement than it is for a centralized office in DC to do it.

ETA: I'm usually a small/less government guy, but this is an area where I think a bit of expansion wouldn't be a bad thing.