Can we just stop some of this nonsense?

a reply to: CriticalStinker

Very true.

You could say I'm biased towards libertarian/independent/neutral parties/views, but it's less because of those specific view points, and more because it leaves things open-ended, open for discussion, etc. Many people honestly do have a few opposing views in them - Plenty of people on the right are okay with things like gay marriage, marijuana, etc these days, and some on the left are pro-second as anyone.

But, as stated, those aren't the popular views. Mostly depicting one specific team as the devil is popular.

a reply to: amazing

I'd say almost anyone that can get any amount of votes is probably at least somewhat corrupt. Regardless of party they are running for.

I'd love to be proved wrong, though - And am open to it.

a reply to: olaru12

You're right, I'd argue that we shouldn't get our "facts" from ats at all. This is where we should discuss and break down the "facts". Ideally, unbiased, peer-reviewed journals is where I would look first, but lacking that (not a whole lot of those in the political realm these days), as nonpartisan of a news source as possible, perhaps a news source from outside the country being discussed. Barring that option, read about the same issue from a left leaning site, as well as a right leaning site, and form our own conclusions. That last option only applies if facts aren't available, as facts aren't opinions.

Haha, praise be unto Alex Jones for warning us!

originally posted by: deadlyhope
a reply to: amazing

I'd say almost anyone that can get any amount of votes is probably at least somewhat corrupt. Regardless of party they are running for.

I'd love to be proved wrong, though - And am open to it.

Yeah, I think it comes down to who is less likely to be corrupt. We know all the democrats and republicans are but outsiders, newcomers, third party candidates..there is less likely hood of them being corrupt. So your choice is 100% corrupt like Ted Cruz, Hillary Clinton, Mitch mcConnell, Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi, Barbara Boxer, Tim Caine, John McCain, Marco Rubio, etc etc or...50/50 chance with someone unknown. I'll take the 50/50 chance on the unknown then vote a confirmed crook.

originally posted by: deadlyhope
Isn't ATS the place where we are supposed to be suspicious of anyone in power

Thank you. There must be a million forums out there where people can squabble over left versus right. It seems like this forum has lost it's direction.

originally posted by: schuyler
Complaints about ATS tend to disappear--several in the last week. Want to take bets on how long this one will last?

Exactly.... so why invest time in a response only to see it vanish. And it's a _ _ _ er to take the time to comment in earnest. Why respond with more than a word or two.... it could likely be for naught.

a reply to: deadlyhope

It's more about... We, the people, seem to choose to be solidly on one side of an argument, and double down on it regardless of anything we hear or see.

And that goes to the heart of us Dead. Each side will willingly point to the other and claim ''you are brainwashed''.
I think that is to shallow an understanding.
Sure we can blame whatever aspect of modern culture as the reasons for the ''other sides'' problems when in reality as I see it, this very point is part of human consciousness. It is baked into our genes and neuro-pathways from ages ago. In that light, the real struggle is to break from the now useless concept of the others are controlled by the devil and understand that we all are controlled by physical urges and reactions that survival mechanisms have instilled within us.

a reply to: deadlyhope


The ABSOLUTE ONLY way to escape that total energy zap is to KNOW that there isn't "2 parties" there is just "Them" and "Us". Us is the US Taxpayer that gets to foot the bill$ and these folks spend $$$ 'like it is going out of style' (Hi GrandMa)

The '2 Party Paradigm' should really be called 'The Great Divider'.

Now folks who argue about a politician™ are so deep into it that they don't realize that there is a far more likelihood that they would have more in 'common' with the person they're arguing WITH, than that of the politician™ they are arguing ABOUT. With the "common" We become 'united' and that runs against the grain of "politics™"

Stay Hydrated...

originally posted by: deadlyhope
Partisan politics shines brightly on ATS each and every day, and both sides are unwittingly the exact same as the other side...

Well, duh. That's politics for you. Bunch of people selling dreams and fairy farts to the tax-paying public.

"Yes we can"

No 2nd

It won't stop.

Quite simply.

I think this is a symptom of a few things, principally a general decline in the posting and manners standards on ATS but both sides are guilty and both sides feel wronged in someway I think by the other. Obviously I can only speak for myself and base my opinions based on my own interpretation of the current state of political debate. I although think all the talk of Libtars and Trumptards with triggered snowflakes on both sides suffering form TDS because they are brainwashed idiots who will believe anything the MSN or RT-News has created this toxic environment. All of the snide remarks, patronising posts and and generalisations that make assumptions about the left or the right also contribute. In fact I think this entire left vs right (or pro-trump anti-trump) dogma is getting rather tired and needs to be stamped out, its just too black and white and this isn't a football game.

There are a lot of problems and everyone who engages in political debate on ATS is at fault and we could all do better in how we conduct ourselves.

I think a big thing that would help would be if both sides would accept that they are never going to fully agree but that both sides of political debate have their merits. There are more than just a few people on ATS who need to admit when they are wrong on when their opinion is just that and is not a fact. There needs to be a recognition that a differing opinion is just as valid and legitimate as the opposing view however much we may disagree with it.

We have lost the skill of saying I disagree with you because x, y and z and here are my sources to back this up, but rather have defended into what is becoming quite a ugly fight where ignorance reigns supreme and each deliberately inflammatory post just pushes the other side further away making any meaningful dialogue and debate harder and harder.

In short we need to come together again, we need to forgive what has been said and start showing respect for our fellow members regardless of their views. It is possible to engage in political debate with out it descending into this nonsense, I now that because I can remember a time when threads on ATS were much more enjoyable and civil.

I think its all gone too far and its not going to change.

a reply to: deadlyhope

I consider myself a charter member of the 'leave me the hell alone' party. Basically if they aren't raising my taxes or taking my freedoms I don't care.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

You could be quite correct.

This isn't only on ATS - It's everywhere. Facebook, Twitter, Youtube, all social platforms...

I once went to God-like productions and holy sh*t that place is a sh*t show. Not sure if it stayed the same, but when I last looked it was devolved even further to the point where slander/blatant attacks on other forum members were the popular or top-most of the page posts that day.

a reply to: Metallicus

Sounds libertarian to me

"I reserve the right to change my mind as I evolve" in your signature is basically what I've been stabbing at lately. Change is something to embrace, if that change proves better than what one has been doing.

Also "More freedom, less government, no wars " resonates with me. Spending billions and billions on being the bad cop of the world is just nonsensical.

The greatest conspiracy is the one that people tell you doesn't exist.

originally posted by: deadlyhope
Spending billions and billions on being the bad cop of the world is just nonsensical.

Our crazy culture is a lot more attractive and influential than our bombs. Cheeseburgers, TV shows about super crime fighters, pizza delivery...

We should give satellite HD TVs away to countries along with the production and broadcasting facilities to make their own entertaining, profane entertainment.

a reply to: DBCowboy

Reminds me of the quote

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist"

Isn't that the definition of a conspiracy, though? An idea that others refute it's existence, something assumed upon by people based on what they perceive, etc.. There's plenty of those. The greatest truth that would be deemed a conspiracy is probably something we the common people don't know much about, and only have theories on.. That's my guess, at least.

a reply to: deadlyhope

It would be nice to see ATS come together and turn all their energy on those whom deserve it. (I have tried that a few times and it goes nowhere) But sadly, if I say hillary is a criminal who should be behind bars I will immediately have to sift through a dozen people telling me that Bush started a war so his Haliburton buddies could get rich and there never were any WMD's. Even though its off-topic, I point out that hillary, and all the other ranking democrats at the time, all said Iraq had WMD's and we needed to go after them and it falls on deaf ears.

Why does a factual statement about hillary always get a response redirected at Bush? If you try to stay on topic you get accused of ignoring the failings of your own party. On the other hand, if you throw that tactic back at people and speak to them in their own language they call you a hypocrite. From there it degenerates into ad hom attacks and false narratives.

I think ATS could actually make a difference in the world if they worked together toward a common goal. But we would have to leave our personal soap boxes behind in favor of a more accommodating platform. Not everything is about lgbt. Not everything is about race. Not everything is about illegal immigration. If we stop dragging those whipping posts into every conversation and stay on topic maybe we might actually get somewhere.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
The greatest conspiracy is the one that people tell you doesn't exist.

I don't believe you.

The Mods will tell you make a better thread.

Be the change...

Then they will 404 this bad boy in 3....2....1.....