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Elephant trophy hunting, and Trump’s confusing positions on it, explained

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posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 10:04 AM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: howtonhawky

A bullet, license fee, and gas to drive to public land. Same for any economic class.


you have it all figured out until it really counts and you hunt and hunt and realize all the food is behind fences

it cost much much more to sustain oneself on wildlife than you are able to fathom because you are too far removed from a dire need.

how much does it cost to run a freezer these days?

what will you eat while hunting and lets not even get into the family thing it cost much more than you are accounting for but it is a fun sport and a tasty one if you have the means




posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 12:34 PM
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originally posted by: howtonhawky

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: howtonhawky

A bullet, license fee, and gas to drive to public land. Same for any economic class.


you have it all figured out until it really counts and you hunt and hunt and realize all the food is behind fences

it cost much much more to sustain oneself on wildlife than you are able to fathom because you are too far removed from a dire need.

how much does it cost to run a freezer these days?

what will you eat while hunting and lets not even get into the family thing it cost much more than you are accounting for but it is a fun sport and a tasty one if you have the means





None of that is even remotely related to the OP, though. So im unsure why you are belaboring it as a point.



posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 12:37 PM
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a reply to: howtonhawky

I should point out: you know nothing about my socioeconomics or my history. This is why ATS requires you to attack the ball and not the player. My financial woes are not the topic here.

One more thing to point out: there is nothing in anyones statement here that would lead anyone to believe an argument was being made that sustenance hunting would work for everyone. Only that it works for those who do it.

One more thing to point out: selling your meal ticket is the epitome of stupid. If someone relies on wild game meat to survive, and they sell their only way to harvest wild game meat...they are by definition "stupid".



posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 12:47 PM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan




I should point out: you know nothing about my socioeconomics or my history


and you would be incorrect in making that claim cause you have stated things about yourself on here so it is not that i know nothing about you.

do not take it personal and there is no attack on you personally but an attack on the things you claim about the subject here.

facts are facts and poor people do not have money. that is what being poor means to most.
hunting cost money and that is something poor people lack.
yes there are certain situations where a poor person can get a kill under a hundred dollars but that is a minority amount of people when looking at the total number of poor people.

you have stated things about yourself such as owning a business so please do not blame me for using that as an indicator that you are not poor. It says alot about a person to own any business these days

again it is not personal

now when we look at the specific topic of the thread we can say 100% that it is a rich mans game and that the rich keep the death count of these big game trophies alive.
again it is not personal and is short sided for you do take action against my words because of the way they make you feel.

I am trying to make logical points here





and they sell their only way to harvest wild game meat...they are by definition "stupid"

that feeds right into my point that it takes money to feed yourself even if trying to live off the land.
hunting is indeed a rich mans game and to someone that has no money then everyone appears rich.

edit on 9-3-2018 by howtonhawky because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 12:56 PM
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Last year's deer season filled my freezers (250 lb) at 80 cents a pound for ground meat. Not 5$.

As always, the people who know the least about hunting, guns, or meat processing are the most opinionated about their proper use.

I've worked in a meatpacking plant. I can tell you that my venison tastes better than beef partly because I break the law: I have my meat not only quartered, but packed into one gallon bags and on ice in less than an hour. And I rinse, sterilize and heat all my vessels after a couple of hours of meat processing. Ptomaine and Botulism grow best were stainless still is chilled for months at a time. Like a meat packing plant. And the only way you get E. coli into meat is by pushing the burger cart under hanging intestines... that drip... true story.


But the real problem here is the progressive mind, that has a picture of "the good life." Political creatures believe they know what the good life looks like, and they cannot accept that anyone can have a good life without living it their way, as an urban dweller who lives in a giant filing-cabinet and takes the bus to work. They eat frozen food that what microwaved in a restaurant's kitchen; they believe that's just what food tastes like, and everyone else ought to enjoy eating snap like they do.

America used to be about freedom; about doing your own thing, baby. THAT's when America was great.


I'd like to see somebody Make America Great Again.



posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 01:05 PM
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a reply to: tovenar

i think that is good info what you say about processing and bacteria and such.

i think you fall short in your views in the rest of your post by thinking everyone looks down on your way of life. I say good on you for fulfilling your tags but i have been pointing out that hunting has become more of a bonus rather than a means of survival and that it is a rich mans game and that is a big factor in the preservation of the hunting lands and the game.

this is not the same at all as what is going on in sa with the elephants and lions. we have decimated for profit that has not been returned to the animals there as it has here in the usa. too much corruption eating the funds.

if we can get a handle on the populations and return them back to a more sustainable level down there and have more powerful game wardens and gov. that backs them better then one day the hunting will thrive again but until then we all need to deny ignorance and get involved with the animals on a level that does not kill them.



posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 01:11 PM
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a reply to: howtonhawky

I came from very poor. I dont own a business. I run businesses for rich people though. And im reasonably compensated.

15 years ago i was makimg minimum wage and raising 2 boys.

Where i come from, hunting spans socioeconomic class. Rich people just do it more extravagantly, and on private leases.



posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 01:33 PM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

yep i have been there a bit myself not very long ago raising children.

i couldn't get them to care at all so i did not force them and they were even less interested in fishing.lol

i remember when i was a kid the game warden would not even bat an eye when we were eating fresh meat in the off season cause we had too.

i can't really say i am poor either any more than i can claim you are rich.

much has changed over the years and it is now easier,cheaper,more convenient and less stressful to the system for folks to just get a snap card.

bottom line imo is that hunting is a costly form of sustenance

at the minimum it is around 1 per lb like the other poster noted if you do not include the essentials for storage insurance to get there a vehicle land weapon gear

at this point it is a sport and a bonus for most that are really needy



posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 04:10 PM
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a reply to: introvert

But you are just transferring your distaste for the killing of an animal and having an agent do it for you when you buy it instead of hunting it.

The customer is responsible for the demand and helps create and drive the market. So if you eat meat, you still had the animal killed. It's the same reason we punish those who view child abuse images

Your blanket hatred of hunting but acceptance of farming is simply myopic.

I can only assume it to be agenda driven. Oh well.



posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 05:24 PM
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a reply to: howtonhawky

The oddest story: a lady who worked in a call center i worked in was legally blind, but recieved a 3 week leave annually for hunting. They lived subsistence. The only reason she worked was because she couldn't contribute other ways around the property, so contributed cash.

But a blind woman getting LOA for hunting...it was unusual.

Places like Wyoming and Alaska aren't typical. Different kinds of folks tend to live there.



posted on Mar, 9 2018 @ 05:26 PM
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originally posted by: tovenar


America used to be about freedom; about doing your own thing, baby. THAT's when America was great.


I'd like to see somebody Make America Great Again.


True story.....



posted on Mar, 10 2018 @ 12:05 PM
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originally posted by: howtonhawky
a reply to: tovenar

i think that is good info what you say about processing and bacteria and such.

i think you fall short in your views in the rest of your post by thinking everyone looks down on your way of life. I say good on you for fulfilling your tags but i have been pointing out that hunting has become more of a bonus rather than a means of survival and that it is a rich mans game and that is a big factor in the preservation of the hunting lands and the game.

this is not the same at all as what is going on in sa with the elephants and lions. we have decimated for profit that has not been returned to the animals there as it has here in the usa. too much corruption eating the funds.

if we can get a handle on the populations and return them back to a more sustainable level down there and have more powerful game wardens and gov. that backs them better then one day the hunting will thrive again but until then we all need to deny ignorance and get involved with the animals on a level that does not kill them.


How about the irony of your white privilege, explaining how black people ought to live in Africa?

You got broad sweeping generalizations about hunting here in the states; I doubt your ideas about what hunting looks like in Africa are any more valid. But go ahead with your white-splaining of park management to people in a country you've never been to, on a continent you've never so much as vacationed in. I'm relieved knowing that they'll never have to read your missives about how they should be running their county to be more progressive, so it looks like a (white) university campus.



posted on Mar, 10 2018 @ 12:27 PM
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a reply to: tovenar

you can choose racism and hate to cover up your short comings.

it is alright with me.


With the population of the animals at all time lows surely you are not trying to claim that their wildlife programs are working?

I still do not understand how you could rationally bring racism into the debate.
edit on 10-3-2018 by howtonhawky because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 10 2018 @ 01:14 PM
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The Elephant is a long lived and incredibly compassionate animal....and the symbol of the GOP party.

Ironically nausating to me he lifted the ban.

Hopefully it doesnt pass through the REST of our Government officals.

If it does I will be seriously pissed off.
edit on 3/10/18 by GENERAL EYES because: On stupidphone



posted on Mar, 10 2018 @ 01:23 PM
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us patch



5. Elephants are quickly disappearing. A century ago, about 5 million African elephants roamed the continent, but the number of savanna elephants plummeted 30 percent to just seven years, down to 352,271 elephants in 18 countries, according to the most recent Great Elephant Census report based on aerial sightings. That report said elephant populations shrink about 8 percent a year, most often from poaching.



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