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How Fake Socialists Might Lead to Real Socialism

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posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 06:33 PM
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Socialism has been thoroughly discredited both in argument and in practice, and any existing socialist system today is a repressive, single-party state. Yet the lofty idea is enjoying a resurgence in modern times, especially among those under 30.

A majority of millennials in the US now reject capitalism. In the most recent, albeit dated polls, 49% of Americans under 30 had a positive view of socialism, while only 47% had a positive view of capitalism. In the last American election, 40% of those who planned to attend their party’s Iowa caucuses described themselves as “anti-wall street” and “socialist”. The membership for the Democratic Socialists of America has quadrupled since the 2016 primaries thanks to Bernie Sanders. In the UK, more people describe themselves as socialist (19%) than they would capitalist (16%).

Why?

Ironically, I think it’s because many of them are surreptitiously in love capitalism, but have simply continued to drink the red, socialist kool-aid. But their naiveté might bring about real socialism.

What do I mean by this? Take Bernie Sanders for example. In October of 2015, someone asked the self-proclaimed socialist to defend democratic socialism at one of his rallies. He subsequently made an argument we’ve heard countless times before:


“When you go to your public library, when you call your Fire Department or the Police Department, what do you think you’re calling? These are socialist institutions.”
Source

Oh dear. No, they are not “socialist institutions”.

The first fire brigades in England, for instance, were private insurance companies. Fire engines, fire hoses, water pumps—most were conceived by artists and inventors who sought to compete in the market. In America, private fire brigades even competed with each other, vying for insurance money. The first municipal fire brigade was established in 1824 in Edinburgh, Scotland, the same city where Adam Smith died thirty years earlier. Every subsequent advance in firefighting, whether it was fire engines or water pumps, occurred within countries and societies where socialism was just a fart in someone’s mind.

The “socialist institutions” Sanders is referring to in the United States, and all public services in all free market societies, is not in the least bit socialist, especially when they are funded by taxes collected from private wealth which was generated by capital. These are capitalist institutions, funded by capitalist money, enjoying capitalist innovation.

Rather, self-proclaimed socialists are lying, and it’s having a demonstrable impact on the impressionable youth. One day they may vote in real socialists, mistaking them for the fake ones we’re used to.

edit on 6-3-2018 by LesMisanthrope because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 06:45 PM
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I honestly prefer quali socialism over real Fascism. Thankfully I can live anywhere choose. I refuse to watch what Trump will bring; But I have faith more rational minds will prevail.
edit on 6-3-2018 by olaru12 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 07:19 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

Im not surprised. Communist rhetoric festers in colleges and is exactly what's happening in the US and other nations. Sounds nice until implemented



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 07:32 PM
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Oh nos ... society making sure we have safety nets, institutions and a watchdog so that successful private enterprise doesn't enslave?! The horror... the horror.

But I think you are picking at definition of terms... when most Europeans and United Statians say "socialism" they are thinking of capitalism with assurances... not a fascistic gulag mixing Stalin and Orwell.

At some point capitalism will have to be anachronistic due to ubiquitous wealth via tech, if nothing else.

Capitalism was/is a handy, quick tool to get to a cooperative, planned society brimming with material wealth, but a tool is what it is, not the goal. It's also making a mess that could end up exterminating us.

I think we're smart enough to pick and chose economic modes and methods ... but pure capitalism is horrible, and pure socialism has never been done, but has potential for hell, too.

Let's hope we find a happy balance between cowboy and borg.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 07:33 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

As a millennial, I don't see the appeal of socialism. The government (both state and local) and police walk and spit all over tax payers. Why give them more power, control, and wealth?



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 07:45 PM
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originally posted by: Baddogma
Oh nos ... society making sure we have safety nets, institutions and a watchdog so that successful private enterprise doesn't enslave?! The horror... the horror.

But I think you are picking at definition of terms... when most Europeans and United Statians say "socialism" they are thinking of capitalism with assurances... not a fascistic gulag mixing Stalin and Orwell.

At some point capitalism will have to be anachronistic due to ubiquitous wealth via tech, if nothing else.

Capitalism was/is a handy, quick tool to get to a cooperative, planned society brimming with material wealth, but a tool is what it is, not the goal. It's also making a mess that could end up exterminating us.

I think we're smart enough to pick and chose economic modes and methods ... but pure capitalism is horrible, and pure socialism has never been done, but has potential for hell, too.

Let's hope we find a happy balance between cowboy and borg.


Government providing safety nets is a lot different than society providing safety nets. The former is centralized, bureaucratic, and unsustainable.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 08:42 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope

And no matter how many times it is shown not to be the answer men wont listen. And when they finally get to the point of thinking they have it in their grasps it will be to late, they will have taken his mark and will die in their sins.

Man cannot bring in any sort of perfect society because men are sinners.

Christ will bring it in and the natural men born during that time will finally revolt in the end. then this world and all its men alive and dead will face judgement, the earth and the heaven will be destroyed and an everlasting kingdom will arise on a new earth and in a new heaven forever more and only then will men live happily ever after..



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 08:53 PM
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Millennials are a lost cause...
The best we can do is brace for a future of public safe spaces and an Eskimo transgender president who identifies as some type of mythical beast.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 09:02 PM
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a reply to: JAY1980

Millennials are the ones who will pick themselves up and walk away from the ashes of post modernism when the price of insulin, beta blockers, and calcium channel blockers becomes 100% unafordable.
edit on 6-3-2018 by BELIEVERpriest because: added drug class



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 09:09 PM
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I'm more concerned with the fake capitalists that seems to be leading to real corporate oligarchy.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 09:19 PM
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Because "capitalism" (to big to fail you say??) is really working out for millennials.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 09:32 PM
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originally posted by: AScrubWhoDied
Because "capitalism" (to big to fail you say??) is really working out for millennials.


Millennials love capitalism when it comes to their iPhones, Uber, and all manner of other disruptive technology.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 09:38 PM
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a reply to: Edumakated

And they wouldn't have those without Capitalism?



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 09:40 PM
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a reply to: Edumakated

Maybe some of em do, doesn't change the fact that most of em are broke.

Working out so well.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 09:42 PM
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a reply to: XAnarchistX

Yeah so there are people that are so lazy that they don't do anything without incentives.

It's difficult for them to understand that there are people that innovate out of passion.

See any random github project.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 09:49 PM
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originally posted by: XAnarchistX
a reply to: Edumakated

And they wouldn't have those without Capitalism?


No they wouldn't...

Capitalism is what drives innovation and progress.

While there are some people who invent and do things out of passion, it is capitalism (investors) more often than not that brings it to market so the rest of us can enjoy it.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 10:10 PM
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originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: XAnarchistX
a reply to: Edumakated

And they wouldn't have those without Capitalism?


No they wouldn't...

Capitalism is what drives innovation and progress.

While there are some people who invent and do things out of passion, it is capitalism (investors) more often than not that brings it to market so the rest of us can enjoy it.


Does anyone else find it ironic that the post above was typed on a machine built by Communists?



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 10:36 PM
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a reply to: Edumakated

Capitalism isn't what drives "passion" and "Innovation" if anything it stifles creativity due to production and demand, what will sell, mass produce etc, versus those who can just 'play' and create freely without the slave masters and owners controlling it



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 10:40 PM
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a reply to: JAY1980 And todays prize for a super uneducated post to you sir. Even if that is true the blame cannot be placed on them. Remember that the things they hold so dear was created through a system That your generation helped create. Instead of placing blame maybe try looking for a way to fix a problem. I am of that generation and am a problem solver. And a very darn good one I may add. Remember that placing blame doesn’t solve problems. So a solution would seem to lay on fixing something that may have broken for a long time. After the problem is solved then you move to the punishment. Seems logical to me and my daily tasks back up this idea. When something doesn’t work as a fix then you move on. The faster you solve the problem the better everything works out and the better and faster the movement of giving punishment.



posted on Mar, 6 2018 @ 11:16 PM
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Yup I am millennial and I have a government job that could be considered socialist and I hate the fact the union protects totally useless people and already after a few short years I've reached the top my pay is capped. I have a job in which I provide a service to the population and let me tell you if my job was in the private sector not only would I make a heck of a lot more money but the dead weight would be fired pretty darn fast for not making the cut.

I see people abuse their positions every day in government. The town council chambers are near by too.

Millenials arnt a lost cause either this one isn't that's for damn sure.

Socialism is the first step to communism.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

edit on 6-3-2018 by Athetos because: (no reason given)







 
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