House Democrats introduce bill prohibiting sale of semi-automatic weapons

a reply to: Xcathdra

these clowns need instead to make a bill on term limits for congress of no more than 8 years.

If you banned the future sales of the AR15 platform, or any other guns, just what are you going to do about the 350 million weapons already in circulation?

Just wondering what peoples thought are on this?

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: Krakatoa

Give me another alternative then. Something other than...nothing

Read a few posts back.

originally posted by: matafuchs
If you banned the future sales of the AR15 platform, or any other guns, just what are you going to do about the 350 million weapons already in circulation?

Just wondering what peoples thought are on this?

After the ban is in place, and there are more shootings, confiscation will be the next agenda item.

But no one wants to ban and confiscate.

originally posted by: matafuchs
If you banned the future sales of the AR15 platform, or any other guns, just what are you going to do about the 350 million weapons already in circulation?

Just wondering what peoples thought are on this?

Or the boost it would make in black market sales to all those that probably shouldn't have one. I would expect to see a spike in them being smuggled into this country making the problem vastly worse.

But, according to some, that is OK. We can all feel warm and fuzzy "we did something" even if it was a disaster and cost more lives than it saves.

Morons, all of them, with zero foresight.

a reply to: face23785

And the GOP won't support this latest bill. So we are back to ... nothing.

What else? What about this mental health problem that the GOP says is responsible for all the problems? What is the GOP's solution for that?

a reply to: matafuchs

Better bump that number a bit. Sales were so good under Obama we went from 37% ownership to 40% by all realistic estimates. So might be closer to 400 million now. I used 370 million for my 2014 calculations in another thread. Boils down to the odds (using inflated numbers) of being murdered by another person with a gun intentionally or not at about 1 in 25000. Winning the Pick 4 by straight pick (exact numbers in order) is 1 in 10000. Meaning you are 2.5 times as likely to have the machine spit out a winning auto picked ticket than being killed by someone with a gun. More guns and less murders only makes for longer odds so mine is just a best guess really, despite both of which have happened since 2014.

But you know, guns kill. Think of the children. I am more morally right...whatever.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: face23785

And the GOP won't support this latest bill. So we are back to ... nothing.

What else? What about this mental health problem that the GOP says is responsible for all the problems? What is the GOP's solution for that?

They won't support this ridiculously overarching bill, no. You won't even get all Democrats to support a ban on ALL semi-autos with detachable magazines. That's the majority of self defense handguns sold in the US right now. That's absurd. And that's not the only bill in the works. There's a number of different proposals being run through right now.

The GOP had a bill to improve mental health reporting to NICS back in 2013 and Democrats filibustered it. A lot of information simply doesn't get loaded in NICS. NICS and background checks are useless if there's no data in it that would red flag someone who should fail the check. That needs to be fixed. You can even pass a Universal Background Checks bill and it's useless if NICS doesn't have the proper data in it. Everyone can agree that needs to be fixed.

a reply to: Ahabstar

I agree with all of that.

But, that harsh lesson, NFA passage, is brought up in every discussion I've ever taken part in, including this one, that concerns gun confiscation, which is what this is.

NFA was/is a travesty, and in an ideal world would never be repeated. Which is why noisy folk like myself can not ever be silent, as silence implies consent.

a reply to: kaylaluv

Breaks my heart that it won't pass. Truly it does.

As for the solution of the mental health aspect? Time will tell. Probably nothing. State and local organizations would probably have better luck coming up with something. Less one size fits all solutions will have better chances of success.

originally posted by: face23785


The GOP had a bill to improve mental health reporting to NICS back in 2013 and Democrats filibustered it..

I'm not aware of that, so I guess i'll just have to take your word for it. Why did Trump overturn Obama's effort to make it harder for mentally ill people to get guns?

What about beyond just reporting to stop them from legally getting guns? They can still illegally get guns. What do we do to help mentally ill people not want to shoot up a bunch of strangers?

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: face23785


The GOP had a bill to improve mental health reporting to NICS back in 2013 and Democrats filibustered it..

I'm not aware of that, so I guess i'll just have to take your word for it. Why did Trump overturn Obama's effort to make it harder for mentally ill people to get guns?

What about beyond just reporting to stop them from legally getting guns? They can still illegally get guns. What do we do to help mentally ill people not want to shoot up a bunch of strangers?

Because
A) It was unconstitutional since the president cannot make laws unilaterally (Sorry President Obama, some as a Constitutional Law expert, right).
B) It was BADLY written and included people who were perfectly sane, but decided to have someone else (that would have a finance degree for example) manage their finances for them as they get older.

Unlike many other forms of government, the position of United States President is NOT allowed to make laws (in case you were not aware of that fact). That is a good thing. Bad stuff (as we have seen historically) comes form that level of power being in the hands of a single person. That is why we have 3 branches of government. And the executive branch (where the president job is located) cannot make laws....at all....period.

How uniformed are you on our government processes that you had to ask that question?

The heartlessness I understand, but ignorance? In this day and age, with the information we have at our fingertips?

a reply to: Ansuzrune

My thick skull. Taking bets on my rape. Okay, nice. I should know better than to engage with conservative gun lovers. It always ends up violent.

Done here. Don't worry. Nothing will be done. Just like you guys want.

How is it people are not smart enough to realize every single gun is a semi-automatic unless it fires not stop........Why the NRA refuses to go along with democratic bills.

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: face23785


The GOP had a bill to improve mental health reporting to NICS back in 2013 and Democrats filibustered it..

I'm not aware of that, so I guess i'll just have to take your word for it. Why did Trump overturn Obama's effort to make it harder for mentally ill people to get guns?

What about beyond just reporting to stop them from legally getting guns? They can still illegally get guns. What do we do to help mentally ill people not want to shoot up a bunch of strangers?

That is a dangerous slippery slope. The Soviets back in the day would tag someone mentally deficient and they ended up in these torture hospitals. No again NEVER LET GOVERNMENT HAVE THESE POWERS OF DECISION OVER OUR LIVES.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: Ansuzrune

My thick skull. Taking bets on my rape. Okay, nice. I should know better than to engage with conservative gun lovers. It always ends up violent.

Done here. Don't worry. Nothing will be done. Just like you guys want.

We want REAL legislation that preserves the constitution AND saves lives. Doing "something" is not a basis of good government. Doing something bad is worse....and will kill more people than it saves.

More suffering that you obviously cannot see through your veil of emotion and ignorant half-truths you live by these days.

My last word is, let ME decide how best to protect myself and family, and I will let you make your own decisions.

Agreed?

originally posted by: kaylaluv

originally posted by: face23785


The GOP had a bill to improve mental health reporting to NICS back in 2013 and Democrats filibustered it..

I'm not aware of that, so I guess i'll just have to take your word for it. Why did Trump overturn Obama's effort to make it harder for mentally ill people to get guns?

What about beyond just reporting to stop them from legally getting guns? They can still illegally get guns. What do we do to help mentally ill people not want to shoot up a bunch of strangers?

You don't have to take my word for it. Here.

Meanwhile, the GOP plan, written primarily by Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa), pushes more resources to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System but doesn’t expand the universe of mandated background checks. His measure would also revise legal definitions on who is banned from owning a gun due to mental-health concerns. It also was blocked in the Senate, 53-47, rejected by nearly all Democrats but also Kirk and fellow Republican Sen. Cory Gardner of Colorado. Sen. Joe Donnelly (D-Ind.) supported the measure.

Again, it wasn't everything the Democrats wanted, but what happened to "if it saves one life"? Any improvement in mental health reporting so people get flagged in NICS when they should is something we should all want.

As for the executive order, that got axed because it was too broad. President Obama issued an overarching executive order that labeled a lot of people who aren't actually mentally ill as mentally ill. No one should be a fan of that. What other constitutional rights would you be okay with people losing because they were unfairly lumped in with a group of people they don't really belong to?

Illegal guns is a totally different story. The most common way people illegally get guns is through straw purchases. What that means is if I would fail a background check because of a felony conviction but you have a clean record, I go to you and ask you to go buy a gun for me. That's already illegal and carries a pretty hefty penalty. You could get up to 10 years in federal prison if I'm not mistaken. I'm all for increasing the penalty, although I'm not sure how much that would help. Most gun rights advocates and even the evil NRA support stiffer penalties for people convicted of gun-related crimes. There's only so much you can do to make something that's already illegal illegaler.

An overall crackdown on crime in this country might be a good idea. If you look at how we compare to other countries, there's actually no correlation between gun ownership and gun homicide rates. Some countries have low gun ownership and low gun homicide rates, while there are others that have low gun ownership and still have high gun homicide rates. Some have high/low and some have high/high. It's all over the place. This tells you guns aren't the primary factor. One correlation that does show up though, is that pretty much every country that has high gun homicide rates has a high overall crime rate.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: Ansuzrune

My thick skull. Taking bets on my rape. Okay, nice. I should know better than to engage with conservative gun lovers. It always ends up violent.

Done here. Don't worry. Nothing will be done. Just like you guys want.

You know it's unfair to use him to paint us all. Don't be like that.