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Does more guns = safer....

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posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 10:53 AM
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originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: Jefferton

I am not responsible to what someone else does.

There is laws against it.

There are more laws infringing my rights as it is.

Why are YOU trying to make me answerable to a capital or otherwise infamous crime I have nothing to do with?

You personally? No. Your idealism? Maybe so.

Edit to add: I seem to remember the Muslim religion blamed for all acts of terrorism, and not the individuals commiting the acts.

Just seems familiar.
edit on 23-2-2018 by Jefferton because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 10:55 AM
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a reply to: Jefferton

It's really simple American believe that the 2nd Amendment protects us from an overreaching Government. Our forefathers want to insure that Government should always be a servant to the people not the other way around. We as master of our Government must be armed in case we need to beat down any tyranny that may take root to enslave us. Here it is recognized that to be armed is our Birth Rights and not a privilege that Government can take away. This Freedom like all other freedom comes with danger of it's own, true, but that does not mean it is not valid or should not be cherished.

One other thing Gun Control people try to ignore is that guns do save lives. According to many studies, even the recent one commission by the CDC under Obama in 2013, all concludes that gun saves many times more lives each year in Defensive gun use than kill in Gun homicides.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 10:56 AM
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a reply to: neo96

The failure of society to stop a mass shooter before he ever exists is on all of us my fellow citizen.


Those around nicholas thought the way you do. Not their problem. Well nick made it their problem didn't he.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 10:58 AM
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a reply to: Jefferton

Nope.

The problem are those willfully ignoring the civil liberty of their next door neighbors.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 10:59 AM
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originally posted by: scraedtosleep
a reply to: neo96

The failure of society to stop a mass shooter before he ever exists is on all of us my fellow citizen.


Those around nicholas thought the way you do. Not their problem. Well nick made it their problem didn't he.

And yet, the memory will fade, and be repeated over, and over.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 10:59 AM
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a reply to: scraedtosleep




The failure of society to stop a mass shooter before he ever exists is on all of us my fellow citizen.


No it isn't.

Society is a failure when they turn innocent people in to criminals.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 10:59 AM
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a reply to: PerfectAnomoly

IMO, here is the goal vis-a-vis the 2A & life in America in 2018 to make it as safe as possible. Every law abiding mentally fit person who wishes to exercise their right to own a firearm should be allowed to continue doing that - everyone who falls outside that category of being mentally fit and not a criminal does not get to own one.

Now, how do you achieve that? I'm not too sure either but every vested interest should have a seat at the 'legislation' table because there are a number of factors that need to be considered besides guns when it comes to safety - this can't be ignored, lest peril come your way through other means and you are left mopping up after a bomb/truck/car/knife/chemicals.

Any real adjustment to the American gun culture will only come about through dialogue and understanding - without those 2 driving factors present, it will be a waste of time.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:02 AM
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originally posted by: Jefferton

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: Jefferton

I am not responsible to what someone else does.

There is laws against it.

There are more laws infringing my rights as it is.

Why are YOU trying to make me answerable to a capital or otherwise infamous crime I have nothing to do with?

You personally? No. Your idealism? Maybe so.

Edit to add: I seem to remember the Muslim religion blamed for all acts of terrorism, and not the individuals commiting the acts.

Just seems familiar.


I remember it differently. It was Muslim EXTREMISTS that we were all blaming for the killing. You just weren't allowed to say it like that, it wasn't PC. And stupid me, still thinks that EXTREMISTS who want to kill infidels are a bit wacko.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:02 AM
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originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: Jefferton

Nope.

The problem are those willfully ignoring the civil liberty of their next door neighbors.

I'm sure in your mind, that sentance actually makes sense.

I'm done here.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:02 AM
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a reply to: Jefferton

Maybe not this time.

The students met with the president and I watched (even here on ATS) as repubs and dems came together to finally talk about this up front. It gave me a little hope.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:03 AM
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a reply to: network dude
We don't have school shootings because Americans have guns.

That is the argument being used to push the gun control agenda. If the kid had used another method, would we then have to say we have school attacks because we have schools?

The root causes for the school attacks are not being addressed because it doesn't help with painting the picture they wish to paint.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:05 AM
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a reply to: Jefferton

It makes a lot of sense to those that actually bother to read the constitutional amendments that deal with due process.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:06 AM
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originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn
a reply to: network dude
We don't have school shootings because Americans have guns.

That is the argument being used to push the gun control agenda. If the kid had used another method, would we then have to say we have school attacks because we have schools?

The root causes for the school attacks are not being addressed because it doesn't help with painting the picture they wish to paint.


By that same token its easier to acquire a knife (cheaper at least), so why did the student use an AR-15 if a knife or other weapon would have been equally effective? I thought the thrust of the argument was that guns are the superior killing tool and that's why these folks are using them.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:08 AM
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Much safer.

When outlaw criminal gangsters with totally illegal machine guns were firing at a home 200' away from ours, we were glad we were inside and had more then just a phone and a broom stick to defend ourselves with.

The police took 15 minutes to arrive, and they were all scared. I had to come out and show them where one of the shooters were so they could arrest him.

Much much safer



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:15 AM
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a reply to: PerfectAnomoly

So, given the data, most of the US counties are quite safe.

crimeresearch.org...



Murders in US very concentrated: 54% of US counties had zero murders. (Of any type / cause)

The Distribution of murders
The United States can really be divided up into three types of places. Places where there are no murders, places where there are a few murders, and places where murders are very common.

Murders actually used to be even more concentrated. From 1977 to 2000, on average 73 percent of counties in any give year had zero murders. Possibly, this change is a result of the opioid epidemic’s spread to more rural areas. But that question is beyond the scope of this study. Lott’s book “More Guns, Less Crime” showed how dramatically counties within states vary dramatically with respect to murder and other violent crime rates.

Conclusion
This study shows how murders in the United States are heavily concentrated in very small areas. Few appreciate how much of the US has no murders each year. Murder isn’t a nationwide problem. It’s a problem in a very small set of urban areas, and any solution must reduce those murders.


edit on 23-2-2018 by infolurker because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:16 AM
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a reply to: Wayfarer
I don't think it is a weapon of choice because it is a superior weapon. I think they used that gun because it is the gun that is most advertised and talked about. The media makes it a weapon of choice.

From the looks of it, most of the recent shooters have followed pretty much the same script that the media keeps putting out there. From YouTube to CNN, a step by step primer is laid out, so it is just easier to follow the crib notes.

Social media and MSM are strong players in the creation of kids that feel this is an easy way to get their time in the spotlight. They make them legendary.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:21 AM
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a reply to: PerfectAnomoly

See my Jefferson quote below.

No one is claiming that more firearms will abolish all violence, but it's better in a society with a right to keep and bear arms and already has an established base ownership of weapons that outnumbers its 321-million-person population to allow those willing to be able to arm themselves so that, in the unlikely but real event that something like this happens to them, they at least have a means to attempt to protect themselves and their students.

With that amount of guns in the U.S., no law will ever keep guns away from criminals (obviously).

And as for another quote from someone smarter than me: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." -- Benjamin Franklin

Gun-control measures are nothing but a false sense of security, but often times, so is gun ownership. But even so, we have a right to arm ourselves, regardless if the rest of the world can comprehend why we would want to.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:24 AM
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a reply to: PerfectAnomoly

America is safer, not because of guns, because of the two giant Moats, the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.

We pretty much bully our way around the world with impunity.

Sidenote: all those firearms in private hands worn't protect us from our Gubments misdeeds.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:29 AM
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a reply to: PerfectAnomoly

Well if we are being honest, most of these mass shootings are in gun free zones.
That is an obvious indicator that less guns don't make us safer.



posted on Feb, 23 2018 @ 11:35 AM
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originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: Jefferton

It's already against the GD law.

Beyond that?

Ban people.



a lot of things that happen with guns may not happen if the person had no gun.

not saying take them all away and i do not have the answer but imo there are way too many guns out there. they are too easy to get. they are too easy to transfer. they are too easy to make their way hand to hand.
this is a problem.

i just think the system needs work from what you can have to how the screening works because it is not effective all the time and needs to be.
people that should not be able to pass the check do pass the check and are handed a gun.

this is a problem

i think there are many parts to this problem.

some people look at the right to bear as some god given thing however that would be possible but its not. it was thought of and written by man.
does not have to be taken away but i think it needs to be broken down and reconstructed so # gets tightened up.

for a start



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