Why the left hates individual preparedness/rights

a reply to: JBurns

It's NOT my job to prevent myself from being shot.

PREAMBLE TO THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Thomas Hobbes, "Right of Nature" have you even READ IT?

originally posted by: murphy22
a reply to: ScepticScot
Murder "per capita". Murder by what? "Per Capita"? Murder, is murder! Guns are not a reason, anymore than being choked to death by a good necktie.
What easy access? Tell me, how easy it is to get a "legal" "gun" in The USA?
Anything else, is "illegal".
So are you speaking from experience? Or are you just parroting what you have heard?

Murder by capita = murder per head of population.

The US has far higher rate than any comparable country.

Are you really denying that it's easier to get access to a firearm in the US than in other developed countries.

In all fairness you could also argue that it is those on the right who hate individual rights.

Consider this:

1) which side of the political spectrum seeks to limit the rights of individuals to marry whoever they wish, in the pursuit of liberty and happiness?

2) in states where marijuana has become legal for individual use...which side has most often generally opposed it?

3) which side seeks to limit how a woman or a family can manage an unwanted pregnancy, despite ruling of the Supreme Court?

4) Which side seeks to limit the ultimate democratic action...voting by the poor:and/or minorities?

You have got to admit that those on the right are just as, if not more guilty of trying to limit the rights of individuals. Frankly, the only Libertarians (and in some cases Democratic Socialists and some Constitution Party candidates) have real moral high ground when it comes to attempts to limit individual rights and freedoms. The only thing that is different is/are the right/s in question.

It's arguably intellectually vapid and bankrupt to suggest otherwise and is certainly hypocritical.

a reply to: ErrorErrorError

Not everyone does, and they're free to feel that way, and not have one.

Just as I'm free to have them for the usefulness of having a tool to use so I don't have to do that hand to hand combat thing...I'm gettin' too old for that crap. Or to just spend an afternoon at the range making holes in paper, or putting food in my freezer after spending a day in the field and bringing home a few pheasant or grouse.

Do as you will, if it harms none. What's so hard to understand there??

originally posted by: dothedew
a reply to: ScepticScot

Just because you don't agree with a statement doesn't make it any less true, nor does labeling it as such make it any less apparent. That's like the equivalent of calling someone a bigot because you don't have a follow up argument.

We have high murder rates due to guns, yes. Excluding suicide that would be done regardless, excluding justifiable police shootings against dangerous suspects, we are left with about 5,000 firearm murders per year.

Also, between the years of 2009 and 2015 we were ranked #12 in mass shootings, behind countries such as Belgium, Austria, and France.

We could through out other fun facts, such as that :

We have a much lower violent crime rate than other comparable countries.

Our school shooting rate has increased 4 fold since the gun free some act of 1990 was passed.

98% of all mass shootings happening in gun free zones, whether they be federally or local/state mandated.

Studies done during previous administrations have shown that private firearm ownership prevents roughly 2.5 million vuolent crimes per year, be it via stopping the individual, firing warning shots, and sometimes simply by brandishing the firearm.

Your accusations of drivel are drivel in themselves. If you really think none of the above means anything, that we should willfully allow sitting ducks in classrooms because a party platform says it's in our best interest, then you need to reevaluate your thinking process.

History shows that disarming law abiding citizens leads to higher rates of crime. Having gun free zones leads to criminals having open targets with zero chance to defend themselves, thanks to policy. Then, these same idiot politicians that voted for this policy decide we need MORE policy, and the cycle continues.

A list of points none of which were included by the OP so not sure how they make registered in anyway to of his post

Still since you have actually provided some points let's deal with then.

The actual firearm homicides in the US I brought is closer to 10k on average not 5k. Happy to be corrected if you have a source the shows different.

2009_2015 is a rather strange period to pick, is it possibly because there was a couple of high casualty mass shootings in Europe in that period. It's like looking at 2001 and declaring that the US has the worst airline safety record.

Also not sure only being 12th worst is much of an accomplishment.

Comparing violent crime across countries is problematic as different countries treat diffent crimes as violent. (Unlike homicide were there tends to be a more consistent metric). When you actually look at crime victim surveys the claim the USA has less violent crime falls apart.

I would actually agree that gun free zones don't work.( Unless you are willing to spend billions enforcing them).

The 2.5 million figure is also dubious. It seems to be the top end figure from a single source and there are a number of studies showing lower figures or that increased gun ownership leads to increased violent crime.

Good god, another day, another 'why the Left hates....' post on ATS.

Can you not give it a rest? These are always badly researched hitpieces from alt-right sources, clearly written by somebody who has never actually spoken to somebody on 'the left'.


Clearly this is just an attempt to farm stars and flags from the ATS circle jerk. And adds precisely zero of use other than to stir divisions.

a reply to: JBurns

I actually had an ATS member chastise me in another thread yesterday for daring to bring up facts/logical arguments with nullified their anti-gun rant. Not surprising, in the least. This is the same crew who seeks to ban free speech (calling it "hate speech") and ensure that criminals can make the rest of us victims like them.

No. You tried to spin my words and somehow vanished as I expanded on that to present you with another angle.

You must be a very brave fella. I mean... look at this thread! All the old talkingpoints are here, your crew must be the finest around. Ya know... the one with the ... talknetwork.com. Can I have my talkingpointtextbook.com back now?

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: luthier
Oddly enough more people live off the grid in liberal states or mixed libertarian liberal states.

In California, it's called being homeless, not living off the grid.

That is funny

However I meant people who live from agriculture, solar, have composting toilets etc...

If you want to go there there are plenty of homeless and jobless in red states, plenty of welfare in red states, and plenty of red states that require federal money for their budget and don't raise enough revenue to pay their bills.

a reply to: JBurns

Star for you. Nice thread!

originally posted by: dfnj2015
a reply to: JBurns

Meaningless hyperbole.

Great response!

Now, In what way would banning guns have helped this situation? Evidently Cruz had 30+ visits from law enforcement prior to that day. The FBI received at least two tips on him months prior. And the deputy at the school did nothing.

When government fails you, what recourse are you left with? Should it just be part and parcel of living in a gun free nation?

a reply to: JBurns

It is strange. The left act in such a bizzare way that it appears they will do anything to # down anyone else’s point of view. They decide what is or isn’t right. What is or isn’t politically correct. What people can and can’t protest about or do.

To my way of thinking the left really are the facists here. But try telling them that.

a reply to: Painterz

Good god, another day, another 'why the Left hates....' post on ATS.

Good question!

Care to answer it ?

Why does the left hate me and 300 million other Americans that are not in violation of any law?

Maybe they should stop being so bigoted, and instituting legalized discrimination.

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: Painterz

Good god, another day, another 'why the Left hates....' post on ATS.

Good question!

Care to answer it ?

Why does the left hate me and 300 million other Americans that are not in violation of any law?

Maybe they should stop being so bigoted, and instituting legalized discrimination.

They don't, any other strawman questions?

a reply to: ScepticScot

Funny how they think us law abiding gun owners are just three fifths of a person.

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: ScepticScot

Funny how they think us law abiding gun owners are just three fifths of a person.

Really, who said that?

a reply to: ScepticScot

The 14th amendment that says that.

Ya know that piece of paper the usual suspects refuse to read.

why does the right-wing here love to tell us what the left hates?.....maybe the left here "hates" how you make up s**t about the left

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: ScepticScot

The 14th amendment that says that.

Ya know that piece of paper the usual suspects refuse to read.

The 14th amendment says that law abiding gun owners are three fifths of a person? Are you sure you have read it correctly?

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: ScepticScot

The 14th amendment that says that.

Ya know that piece of paper the usual suspects refuse to read.

you mean the "emoluments clause" in that "piece of paper" that prohibits trump from making money off the presidency, that the usual suspects refuse to read....2 can play this game

a reply to: jimmyx


As I'm certain the "right wing" enjoys being told the same by the left...

Perhaps it would be wise for "both sides" to stop putting words in others mouths, or attributing ideas/thoughts to individuals that never expressed said ideas or thoughts.