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No, Australia's gun ban didn't reduce violent crime

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posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 07:33 AM
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originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: JohnnyCanuck


Not diluting or deflecting, and I don't care how it looks. Facts are more relevant than your attempts to exploit knee-jerk emotions.

Fact is, the FULL context needs to be discussed in order to avoid tear-jerkers like yourself pushing through a hasty and frankly unwanted agenda.

As I stated, I think it has been made perfectly clear by the firearms community that illegal and unconstitutional confiscation will never be tolerated.


Thanks for the laugh! There will be people that will refuse to give up their guns for sure, but that won't last long IF the US government decided to ban them. It won't happen so I don't know what the hubbub is all about. You want guns, you got em, and everything that goes with them. School shootings, mass shootings, suicide, fear.

I feel bad for my American brothers and sisters, I couldn't handle living in fear my whole life to the point where I constantly needed protection from possible death.




posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 07:52 AM
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Why do so many people from other countries think "we live in fear of being shot everyday" I don't get it, seems a bit xenophobic.

I've lived in this country my whole life, and have never worried about being shot. There are certain cities and areas I won't go in for obvious reasons, and since I have traveled to other countries, I know you all have those areas as well (as I was told from the people that live there).

Honestly, you are so much more likely to die in a car accident, that includes "the children", than you are to die being shot, among other things.

This is due to the breakdown of the family, in my opinion, not the guns.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 08:05 AM
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originally posted by: artnut
Why do so many people from other countries think "we live in fear of being shot everyday" I don't get it, seems a bit xenophobic.

I've lived in this country my whole life, and have never worried about being shot. There are certain cities and areas I won't go in for obvious reasons, and since I have traveled to other countries, I know you all have those areas as well (as I was told from the people that live there).

Honestly, you are so much more likely to die in a car accident, that includes "the children", than you are to die being shot, among other things.

This is due to the breakdown of the family, in my opinion, not the guns.




If you own a gun, and do not use it exclusively for hunting or target shooting, what other need is there for a gun besides fear of being attacked?

Edit: you need a license to drive a car, does that stop people from using it as a weapon? No, but, I've never heard of someone smuggling a car into a school to run down children. I never get why people compare gun deaths to anything else. If you don't own a pool, there is 100% chance that no one will drown in your pool.
edit on 22-2-2018 by superman2012 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 08:13 AM
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a reply to: JBurns

Look specifically and narrowly at gun murders, then get back to us.

Since that is the statistic they were looking to get under control, it makes no sense to look at any other classifications of criminal behaviour.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 08:22 AM
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a reply to: superman2012


I don't know why others own guns, none of my business.


Do you own a car? Do you have insurance? If so, do you live in fear daily of getting into an accident if someone hits you and kills you? Probably not, but again, you are much more likely to die that way.


I look at it as an insurance policy. The only time our guns see the light of day, is when we go to the range, we enjoy target practice. But again, I don't live in fear when I get in the car, and I don't own guns out of fear. I don't live in fear about much of anything.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 08:24 AM
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a reply to: artnut


I have a fire extinguisher at home.


Guess I'm paranoid and worry about fires.




posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 08:29 AM
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originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: JBurns

Look specifically and narrowly at gun murders, then get back to us.

Since that is the statistic they were looking to get under control, it makes no sense to look at any other classifications of criminal behaviour.


Its a stupud stat. Dead is dead. Thats the point.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 08:30 AM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Sure it is, but dead would be dead by any other means, regardless of the availability of guns.

Point is, comparing arson deaths with shooting deaths, is like comparing road accidents to falling from a ladder.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 08:35 AM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: artnut


I have a fire extinguisher at home.


Guess I'm paranoid and worry about fires.



What other reason is there?? lol



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 08:38 AM
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originally posted by: artnut
a reply to: superman2012


I don't know why others own guns, none of my business.


Do you own a car? Do you have insurance? If so, do you live in fear daily of getting into an accident if someone hits you and kills you? Probably not, but again, you are much more likely to die that way.


I look at it as an insurance policy. The only time our guns see the light of day, is when we go to the range, we enjoy target practice. But again, I don't live in fear when I get in the car, and I don't own guns out of fear. I don't live in fear about much of anything.



I have insurance because I fear that I cannot afford to replace a car.
I have life insurance because I fear that I will die before my children move out.

All insurance is based on fear. I just can't imagine living a life where I had to carry/own something to protect my life. What a scary way to live. Like I said, I feel bad for my brothers and sisters south of the border.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 09:23 AM
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I've lived in the US for most of my life. There's only one time I've ever felt the need to have a gun for self protection. That was as a white male taking public transportation through west Philadelphia after 11pm at night. I didn't have a choice about my transportation at the time. I had friends who lived in west Philadelphia that would try and get me a ride to a safer SEPTA station than the one I had to use.

Once I was being given a ride and didn't really know where I was in the city. I noticed we were passing a SEPTA station and I told my friend to drop me off and he replied, "No way, you wouldn't live 5 minutes if I dropped you off there."

With all that being said, even taking public transportation through west Philadelphia, I never had to draw my gun. Only once did I even have to move my hand toward it (I had a concealed carry permit, and the gun was completely out of site in a shoulder holster under a heavy jacket. It was a small, eight shot, .380.) and as soon as I moved my hand, the "gentleman" immediately stopped, apologized, and got off the bus at the next stop.

This is the only incident I ever ran into in the US where I felt I needed a weapon to protect myself.

Now another story...

The only time I have ever had a weapon pulled on me was in Germany, and it was a hand gun. I don't really understand why the weapon was pulled on me, but the person was a passenger in a car that pulled up behind me while I was buying a soda from a vending machine. The "gentleman" said to me, "I bet you're pretty scared of me now." To which I replied, "No" and turned my back on him and continued buying my soda. At the time I had made the mental calculation that he was either going to shoot me or not, but there was nothing I could do about it. I didn't have a weapon of my own, there was no cover for me to duck behind and there was no way I could run away fast enough to avoid getting shot. I figured I'd go out with a little dignity and not admit my fear of the man with the gun pointed at me. He then replied to me, "You're one crazy mother #er." and then they drove away. Needless to say, I was relieved.

I'm in my mid-40s and these are the only two times where I have had an encounter that involved a weapon. I do not believe the US is so unsafe that we have to go everywhere with a weapons to protect ourselves. I do believe that there are specific places that are that unsafe and should just be avoided, if possible.

What I believe is that Americans are bombarded on an almost constant basis with stories of violence. With the media charging forward with the policy of "if it bleeds, it leads" we can't escape the constant flow of tragic news. So, as a people, we are withdrawing from one another in an effort to limit our exposure to the possibility of violence. The problem with this is that our continued striving for a safe place has isolated ourselves from our fellow citizens so much that we no longer view each other as a part of a community. We are isolating ourselves from our communities in the misguided assumption that this will protect us. It only makes us weaker and more vulnerable. If we want to reduce the number and frequency of tragedies like these school shootings, we need to stop isolating ourselves and others.

We don't need to push diversity or unity. What we need to do is relearn respect for one another. We need to learn to disagree without being disagreeable. We need to listen to one another. The simple act of showing respect to another person can often diffuse any animosity. Respecting someone doesn't mean you agree with them, it just shows that you are willing to listen. And respect should be returned with respect.

We often hear the phrase, "Respect needs to be earned." That is a load of crap. Respect should be assumed. Always treat others with respect. Respect doesn't mean deference, it means treating someone else the way you expect to be treated. Respect doesn't need to be earned, but it can be lost.

I think I've ranted off topic.... I think I'll let it go at this.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 09:50 AM
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originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Sure it is, but dead would be dead by any other means, regardless of the availability of guns.

Point is, comparing arson deaths with shooting deaths, is like comparing road accidents to falling from a ladder.


The method makes no difference.

I fail to see the logic the leads one to think it does.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 09:52 AM
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a reply to: JBurns

yep gun bans don't stop murders people will find away. we started out with hands ,then rocks and sticks and so on and so on and now we have nukes and killer viruses . bans don't stop anything just creates a black market.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 10:21 AM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Simple.

These controls are nothing to do with reducing the numbers of violent deaths. They are to do with reducing the number of SHOOTING deaths. The success of the legislation is not measured in how many fewer deaths result of malicious actions on the part of a perpetrator, but in how many of those deaths occurred as a result of a shooting.

The people in charge know, that if you stop people getting a hold of firearms, all that happens is that people kill people in new and more interesting ways than they used to, and that this is the ONLY result of banishing armaments, be they swords or rifles, be they pistols or SMGs. Can't shoot it? Fine, blow it up then.

But you CAN stop people SHOOTING other people, and if that is the sole aim of your policy, and it happens to function in that way, then you can turn to your people and go "Behold! Your saviours have succeeded!".

It does not MATTER that people continue to die. What matters is that they cease to die from gunshot injuries.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 12:08 PM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: JBurns

Taking away the tool will not stop the desire to harm.

That being said;



Australians are known for their beer, tough attitudes, their Swiss alps, and being the birthplace of Hitler.


So maybe they shouldn't be allowed to have guns.



The desire to harm , is easily turned into bloodshed , when
you get a machine gun in every box of cereal ....

Also , Australia is NOT Austria .
Please study a little geography sometime ....



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 01:18 PM
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originally posted by: radarloveguy
a reply to: JBurns
Also , Australia is NOT Austria .
Please study a little geography sometime ....

I do believe our friend was just being a little facetious.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 01:22 PM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
I believe they claim zero new school shootings not reduced violent crime.

Have a nice night.


Exactly. Took the words right out of my mouth.

I love the way the OP totally ignores this to pursue his own agenda though.

And before any genius claims I don't know what I'm talking about, remember that I am Australian living in Australia and I have a first person view of the massive effect that our common sense gun restrictions have had.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 01:22 PM
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a reply to: TrueBrit

LOL

Got it.

I was just curious if there was something obvious i was missing. Seems there isn't.



posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 01:27 PM
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originally posted by: artnut
Why do so many people from other countries think "we live in fear of being shot everyday" I don't get it, seems a bit xenophobic.



Perhaps because the majority of people who yell and scream about needing to keep their guns use the reasoning that they need to protect themselves?

Funny that the rest of us would make the assumption that "you live in fear of being shot every day" when that's the exact reasoning used to defend their right to keep big guns hey!!!




posted on Feb, 22 2018 @ 01:32 PM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: JBurns

Australians are known for their beer, tough attitudes, their Swiss alps, and being the birthplace of Hitler.


So maybe they shouldn't be allowed to have guns.


Tell me you're joking. Please?

If not then it is rather worrying that you would claim to know what you're talking about when you clearly confuse AUSTRIA with AUSTRALIA.

To be honest, after that massive mistake, I will find it difficult to take ANYTHING you say seriously EVER AGAIN.

Wow. 2 thumbs up for total ignorance hey?




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