It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Are boys 'broken'?

page: 16
36
<< 13  14  15    17 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 04:38 PM
link   

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: soberbacchus

I'm not.

I am pointing out that we have whole threads here devoted to the subject of what's wrong with MEN. Feminists scream endlessly about toxic masculinity as if it is a disease, but it has a counterpart which is very much NOT a media phenomena.

Why is that?


A) "Toxic Masculinity" is not "Masculinity" anymore than sexual assault is consensual sex. Don't conflate the two.
B) "Toxic Masculinity" get's more airtime because it is expressed though power and Men rule the halls of power at this time in history. It often creates an echo chamber where bad behavior is applauded or concealed rather than confronted.

That's how we end up with a secret taxpayer funded slush-fund in congress for Men who treat women like meat and get into indefensible legal trouble.


edit on 21-2-2018 by soberbacchus because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 04:40 PM
link   

originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: IAMNOTYOU

originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: TinySickTears

originally posted by: Wayfarer
Apologies if I've missed something obvious, but have there been any mass/school shootings perpetuated by females?


I don't like Mondays. Look it up

And op I don't envy any child or teen that has to navigate today's world. Been thinking about it a lot. My daughter is 5 so she is just starting. Could not imagine dealing with the social bull# of today.


www.statista.com...

I'm just reaffirming that while y'all are getting your panties in a bunch over the article, there seems to be evidence to suggest this is almost entirely a male driven issue. Has anyone actually bothered to understand what the article is saying or did your brains just shut off at the title?


So because 93 males has committed mass shootings, ALL boys are broken?? well, 3 females has also committed mass shootings, so ALL females must be broken too...
Maybe it is just humans that are broken?

How many incidents like the florida shootings was there if you go 100 years back? or even 50? cause maybe it is our society that is broken...

But yeah, it is so much easier to just generalize and make all out to be the same. Was he a male?, check, must be a male problem then, was he white? check, oh, must be white males then, did he have ears? check, then it most be all white males with ears that is the problem in our society, NOTHING else...

Cant have anything to do with the environment around the people that commits these horrible crimes, cause our society is perfect, right?


ETA: who raises the boys? their mothers you say? hmm, i smell a conspiracy here...




Nobody said all boys are broken (except you).

You have listed the statistics but apparently failed to formulate a logical assessment of them. All the numbers show is that roughly 96% of these events are perpetrated by males, which implies that there are factors indicative of gender that are playing a roll...

edit: Lol, i didn't even realize but you have (unbeknownst to yourself) actually affirmed what the article in the OP was saying, that the environment in which boys are raised is likely a contributing factor to what the author labels 'toxic masculinity'.


What YOU are saying, is that if a girl was given the exact same raising, raised like a boy, living the EXACT same life as the perpetrator, she wouldnt have done it, just because she is a female.

I ask you again, why didnt these sorts of things happen 100 years ago? guns where even easier to get a hold on back then, and there was lots of males around then to, so why is that?

It sounds more like you want to feel superior, than have a rational discussion about this - so you can keep living in youre dreamworld for all i care




I'm just reaffirming that while y'all are getting your panties in a bunch over the article, there seems to be evidence to suggest this is almost entirely a male driven issue. Has anyone actually bothered to understand what the article is saying or did your brains just shut off at the title?



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 04:43 PM
link   

originally posted by: soberbacchus

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: soberbacchus

I'm not.

I am pointing out that we have whole threads here devoted to the subject of what's wrong with MEN. Feminists scream endlessly about toxic masculinity as if it is a disease, but it has a counterpart which is very much NOT a media phenomena.

Why is that?


A) "Toxic Masculinity" is not "Masculinity" anymore than sexual assault is consensual sex. Don't conflate the two.
B) "Toxic Masculinity" get's more airtime because it is expressed though power and Men rule the halls of power at this time in history. It often creates an echo chamber where bad behavior is applauded or concealed rather than confronted.


No.

It's not "toxic masculinity." Call it what it is -- sexual assault or sexual harassment.

When you label it "toxic masculinity" it opens the door to labeling all kinds of things boys do simply by virtue of being boys as toxic.



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 04:48 PM
link   
a reply to: CajunMetal

No.

I was never made fun of for being too masculine. I was called ugly, but that's not the same.

Why is it that people seem to always assume that if you were a girl into sports, you automatically had to look like an East German doping victim?



And, btw, you just engaged in the type of behavior I outlined.



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 04:48 PM
link   

originally posted by: Wayfarer


You have listed the statistics but apparently failed to formulate a logical assessment of them. All the numbers show is that roughly 96% of these events are perpetrated by males, which implies that there are factors indicative of gender that are playing a roll...



Right. So the question becomes is their gender that contributes or society.
Is it being a boy or is what American Culture teaches boys?

I would argue since China has 7X? the number of boys and virtually zero incidents of school shootings (or similar mass murders)

Ditto most countries?

It must be what American Culture teaches boys to value.
edit on 21-2-2018 by soberbacchus because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 04:53 PM
link   
a reply to: soberbacchus

Just boys?

I think the culture in general is broken.

I just think that boys react to it differently than girls do because boys and girls are different, behave different for the most part.

Social maladjustment manifests differently in the two.



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 04:54 PM
link   

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: CajunMetal

No.

I was never made fun of for being too masculine. I was called ugly, but that's not the same.

Why is it that people seem to always assume that if you were a girl into sports, you automatically had to look like an East German doping victim?



And, btw, you just engaged in the type of behavior I outlined.


Nah, I didn't assume anything about you, other than that it was a possibility because a girl doesn't have to be unattractive and into sports for that to happen, just into sports.
I asked if you were specifically to avoid assuming. I did make my point anyway, though, sorry if you felt I was assuming anything about you.



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 04:57 PM
link   
a reply to: CajunMetal

It didn't happen where I was at because my graduating class was stuffed full of over achievers of all kinds. Several of the most popular girls were highly athletic, so being athletic for a girl was no mark of shame. Honestly, neither really was being overly intelligent either.

The only real mark of shame was to not be actively involved in some way.

My graduating class was odd.



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 06:45 PM
link   
a reply to: ketsuko




I thought it was just because I was weird. Nope. It was just because I needed to move that much, and the other girls weren't like that for the most part.


Very interesting perspective.



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 06:46 PM
link   

originally posted by: IAMNOTYOU

originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: IAMNOTYOU

originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: TinySickTears

originally posted by: Wayfarer
Apologies if I've missed something obvious, but have there been any mass/school shootings perpetuated by females?


I don't like Mondays. Look it up

And op I don't envy any child or teen that has to navigate today's world. Been thinking about it a lot. My daughter is 5 so she is just starting. Could not imagine dealing with the social bull# of today.


www.statista.com...

I'm just reaffirming that while y'all are getting your panties in a bunch over the article, there seems to be evidence to suggest this is almost entirely a male driven issue. Has anyone actually bothered to understand what the article is saying or did your brains just shut off at the title?


So because 93 males has committed mass shootings, ALL boys are broken?? well, 3 females has also committed mass shootings, so ALL females must be broken too...
Maybe it is just humans that are broken?

How many incidents like the florida shootings was there if you go 100 years back? or even 50? cause maybe it is our society that is broken...

But yeah, it is so much easier to just generalize and make all out to be the same. Was he a male?, check, must be a male problem then, was he white? check, oh, must be white males then, did he have ears? check, then it most be all white males with ears that is the problem in our society, NOTHING else...

Cant have anything to do with the environment around the people that commits these horrible crimes, cause our society is perfect, right?


ETA: who raises the boys? their mothers you say? hmm, i smell a conspiracy here...




Nobody said all boys are broken (except you).

You have listed the statistics but apparently failed to formulate a logical assessment of them. All the numbers show is that roughly 96% of these events are perpetrated by males, which implies that there are factors indicative of gender that are playing a roll...

edit: Lol, i didn't even realize but you have (unbeknownst to yourself) actually affirmed what the article in the OP was saying, that the environment in which boys are raised is likely a contributing factor to what the author labels 'toxic masculinity'.


What YOU are saying, is that if a girl was given the exact same raising, raised like a boy, living the EXACT same life as the perpetrator, she wouldnt have done it, just because she is a female.

I ask you again, why didnt these sorts of things happen 100 years ago? guns where even easier to get a hold on back then, and there was lots of males around then to, so why is that?

It sounds more like you want to feel superior, than have a rational discussion about this - so you can keep living in youre dreamworld for all i care




I'm just reaffirming that while y'all are getting your panties in a bunch over the article, there seems to be evidence to suggest this is almost entirely a male driven issue. Has anyone actually bothered to understand what the article is saying or did your brains just shut off at the title?


That's not what I'm saying. I've presented statistical data that shows boys are disproportionately committing school shootings. I've surmised that toxic masculinity may play a role in that. A girl in the same conditions isn't subject to the same type of societal conditioning and (on the theory that toxic masculinity does play a role) may not react the same because of it. One could even make the argument that the scenario you have used is indicative of said toxic masculinity being a more weighty factor than gender even.

Regarding why this didn't happen 100 years ago, can you provide evidence that guns were easier to get a hold of as you suggested, or did you just pull that out of your ass?

I don't have any desire to feel superior or lord over anyone. I will not however, abide foolish statements reinforced with weak or nonexistent arguments.



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 06:53 PM
link   
Mother/Wife murders family and commits suicide

Granted...she’s older. But I think this counters the argument made in the OP. This is not a gender issue

ETA.... It is of my personal and current opinion that it is not a gender specific issue. I’d like to remain open minded about it. But I have yet to see enough to persuade me against that thought.
edit on 21-2-2018 by Assassin82 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 08:28 PM
link   
a reply to: Wayfarer


No, that would just be the rape/sexual exploitation of school-aged children under their care as a teacher at a rate of ~50:1

Either way, there is no such thing as "toxic masculinity." It is something jealous and pathetic feminists contrived to attack straight males. They can't imagine a person who is actually both happy and secure with who they are, so they invent pseudo-intellectual terminology and psychobabble to support an entirely untenable and unprovable position.

No thanks

edit on 2/21/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 08:30 PM
link   
a reply to: Wayfarer


Then you conversely concede toxic femininity plays a role in the disproportion molestation/rape of school aged males by adult teacher females, right?

Toxic femininity is a serious threat affecting young children, especially those aged 9-15 (the most impacted group by these sickos)
edit on 2/21/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 08:32 PM
link   
a reply to: Wayfarer


Guns were far easier to get ahold of. There were ZERO gun laws prior to 1934. It was completely legal for a child to bring an automatic gun to school, and you could order machine guns/explosives/suppressors out of magazines with zero regulation.

Gun rights were trampled first in 1934, and again in 1986. IN 1934, we had gun control laws for the first time in direct contradiction to the Constitution.

"Shall not be infringed" means "do not infringe under any circumstance for any reason" and this nation got along just fine for several hundred years with no gun control and especially no gun controllers.


Can't defeat a hypothetical future tyrannical government without top of the line military hardware, can you? That's the purpose of the second amendment. Not hunting. Not plinking. Last I checked, standing armies (virtually all) are unconstitutional. Therefore the need for a completely free second amendment is emphasized.
edit on 2/21/2018 by JBurns because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 08:45 PM
link   

originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: Wayfarer


No, that would just be the rape/sexual exploitation of school-aged children under their care as a teacher at a rate of ~50:1

Either way, there is no such thing as "toxic masculinity." It is something jealous and pathetic feminists contrived to attack straight males. They can't imagine a person who is actually both happy and secure with who they are, so they invent pseudo-intellectual terminology and psychobabble to support an entirely untenable and unprovable position.

No thanks


It doesn't sound like you know what toxic masculinity even is. Can you give me an example of what you think it is, and we can go from there?



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 08:46 PM
link   

originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: Wayfarer


Then you conversely concede toxic femininity plays a role in the disproportion molestation/rape of school aged males by adult teacher females, right?

Toxic femininity is a serious threat affecting young children, especially those aged 9-15 (the most impacted group by these sickos)


I won't discount that toxic femininity exists (as a concept I can understand it), however I'd like to hear an example of what you think it is and how you think it affects girls/women.
edit on 08pm18fpmWed, 21 Feb 2018 20:52:42 -0600America/ChicagoWed, 21 Feb 2018 20:52:42 -0600 by Wayfarer because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 08:52 PM
link   

originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: Wayfarer


Guns were far easier to get ahold of. There were ZERO gun laws prior to 1934. It was completely legal for a child to bring an automatic gun to school, and you could order machine guns/explosives/suppressors out of magazines with zero regulation.

Gun rights were trampled first in 1934, and again in 1986. IN 1934, we had gun control laws for the first time in direct contradiction to the Constitution.

"Shall not be infringed" means "do not infringe under any circumstance for any reason" and this nation got along just fine for several hundred years with no gun control and especially no gun controllers.


Can't defeat a hypothetical future tyrannical government without top of the line military hardware, can you? That's the purpose of the second amendment. Not hunting. Not plinking. Last I checked, standing armies (virtually all) are unconstitutional. Therefore the need for a completely free second amendment is emphasized.


Easy access is not the same thing as prevalence. Can you show me factual data to support that there were more guns proportionally than there are now?

Secondly (having worked in the defense industry) I have serious doubts that any amount of firepower you could amass would account for much if the Government wanted you dead. I'd be happy to entertain a hypothetical scenario of your devising with the understanding that the situation would have to be pretty outlandish to ensure your survival against a zero risk target of the governments choosing (think MQ-9 with a hellfire thats got your name on it). I would contend that the citizens of this nation would need free access to shoulder mounted missiles and other weapons of that level to be a serious threat to a government bent on killing its own civilians.



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 09:10 PM
link   
a reply to: Wayfarer

...um, because girls are lazy? No gun training? General lack of interest?



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 09:18 PM
link   

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: soberbacchus

Just boys?

I think the culture in general is broken.

I just think that boys react to it differently than girls do because boys and girls are different, behave different for the most part.

Social maladjustment manifests differently in the two.


That's fair. Yes boys and girls are different and react differently to what American Culture says they should be like.

But American Culture tells Boys and Girls different things too.

Girls end up with eating disorders and body image issues.
Boys end up isolated and violent.

The solution to both is strong parenting IMO. Don't let society tell your children what they should think or value.



posted on Feb, 21 2018 @ 09:23 PM
link   

originally posted by: vinifalou

originally posted by: loam

"I think it means that there is something going on with American men that is giving them the permission and space to commit violence," he said.



Yes, it's called Hollywood and lack of empathy.

If only ONE person had extended his arm to that kid when he was going through a rough time... Things could've go differently and these 17 kids could be alive right now.





new topics




 
36
<< 13  14  15    17 >>

log in

join