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Israeli F-16 down amid clashes in the Golan Heights

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posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 03:18 AM
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Two IAF pilots hurt after F-16 downed during retaliatory strike in Syria
www.ynetnews.com...

Sirens, clashes in north after IDF shoots down infiltrating Iranian drone
www.timesofisrael.com...

Possible video of pilot just after ejecting:
twitter.com...

Situation is yet unclear but Israel has confirmed the crash of one F-16 (either F-16D or F-16I) inside Israel, the pilots managed to ejcet but one was seriously injured.
There are conflicting reports about the crash, it either went down do to mechanical issues or was downed by Syrian AD, with the latest reports from the military indicating that it was indeed shot down.

The incident apparently began with an Iranian UAV entering Israel airspace which was subsequently downed by an Apache Helicopter. The Israeli Air Force retaliated by attacking Syrian and Iranian military sites in Syria but as it looks like, the other side was ready to met them.
The Syrians responded with a heavy barrage of anti aircraft fire and as said, one F-16 went down during it.

Not saying that is what happned but this almost sound like the Syrians and Iranians set up and elaborate trap, provoking the Israeli Air Force with the UAV to strike them. According to the Israeli Air Force, the initially went with a ‚complex, surgical‘ strike aimed against the facility the UAV was launched from but apprantely encountered more resistance than usual.

As it looks like, things heated up considerable after the crash of the F-16, with Israel attacking more than a dozen Syrian and Iranian targets in the area.

----------------------

Some additional thoughts. I guess it was bound to happen eventually with almost weekly IAF operations against Syria. Looks like this time the IAF didnt went in well prepared at a time and place of their choosing but instead responded immediately to the Iranian incursion and run into an prepared enemy.
Maybe the got overconfident after they got away with so many airstrikes recently, maybe they undererestimated the alertness of the Syrians in the region. Most Israeli strikes recently (as far as whats reported at least) are conducted through Lebanese airspace coming in from the Mediterranean Seain the west. This time it looks like the clash happened in the Golan Heights with Israeli aircraft attacking directly from Israeli airspace. This would put them up against the most heavy concentration of Syrian AD in the region, no wonder they run into trouble.
Previously Israel usually chose to employ Surface to Surface asssets for strikes in the Golan region, i dont think that was by accident.

We ll see what happens but i doubt this incident will escalate into general hostilities immediately. However with the increased Iranian presence in Syria and Lebanon there has been lots of talk in Israel about removing the threat by striking first with more than a couply of surgical air raids. This incident wont calm anyone down. If the government wants to, it can use the Iranian UAV aggression to push to war, similary with what happened at the start of the second Lebanon war. Netanyahu is not Olmert though, contrary to public opinion he actually isnt pushed for war too easily.
edit on 10-2-2018 by mightmight because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 03:38 AM
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Israel do have a tendency to rush in sometimes without thinking the situation through.Next time they will be prepared.Its a game they have been playing for hundreds of years.



posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 11:00 AM
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a reply to: Blackfinger
I wonder at what level the decision to immediately retaliate was made. Once more it looks like the IDF has standing orders to immdiately hit back with all neccessary force if provoked. If Syria and Iran increase their alert posture and activity in the area they need to change that.
Meanwhile the IDF says their follow up strikes against Syrian AD and Iranian Targets were the most signiciant attacks against Syria since the First Lebanon War in 82 and were successfull. Looks like both sides are satisfied atm.



posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 11:59 AM
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This is crazy...what business does Iran have attacking Israel with drones? Are they crazy?...probably yes. Sounds to me like a purposeful provocation...no way they just happened to do so. Also what business does Iran have in Syria? How could the international community allow that to happen? All this worry and talk about NK while Iran is quietly occupying Syria! This is a way bigger threat than NK can ever hope to be, Imho.



posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 01:56 PM
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a reply to: tiredoflooking

Iran and Israel have been in a Proxy war for decades at this point. The Iranian Regime hates Israel with pation for a number of political and religious reasons. They are close allies with Assad and the Syrian Civil War gave them the neccessary front to expand into the Levant. This is not only aimed against Israel, the Iranians are also in some sort of cold war with the sunni arab states headed by Saudi Arabia. They are fighting the Saudis in Yemen, control pretty much most of Iraq and Lebanon through Hezbollah, fund terror groups in Gaza and on Sinai Peninsula etc. etc.

In short they are very destabilizing actor in the great game to say the least but even without nuclear wepaons, they can cause enough damage if they have to for noone wanting to confront them directly. They were actually somewhat better contained five to ten years ago, but then President Obama wanted that nuclear deal of his to happen, so he lifted all major international sanctions against them, threw the opposition under the bus (there was an uprising in Iran during the Arab Spring which was crushed by the regime), gave them billions of US-$ (which they used to fund terror groups as was reported just recently) and didnt do much to curb their power grap in the region in general.
What we see today is the result of this failed policy. The most damaging move was to lift the economial embargo on them, these days European companies investing like crazy in Iran, providing them with a huge economical boost, enabeling the regime to stay in power and expand their military activities.

Things will only get worse in the short and long term, especially with regards to Israel. Nothing much happened on the Israeli-Lebanese-Syrian front during the Syrian Civil War since Irans Proxy Hezbollah needed to go all in in Syria to resuce Assad. But the Syrian Civil War is winding down and Hezbollah will soon be able to confront Israel once more. But this time not only in Lebanon but from the Golan Heights as well, with direct Iranian military support.
If someone thinks the last Lebanon War was bad, he'll be in for a rude suprise once the next one starts. A general conflict between Israel and its Northern Enemies will devestate Lebanon and also cause tremendous damage in Israel. Neither Iran or Syria has the capability to threaten Israels existence atm, but any future conflict wont be pretty.

Everyone with half a strategic thought in the head knows its coming but as usual, noone cares. The US is too weak (politically speaking) for another major war in the Middle East and the Europeans will ignore it as long as they can do buisness with Iran.
Of course the current situation is nothing compared to what it will look like ten years down the road when Obamas nuclear deal sunsets and teh Iranians built the bomb. Then it will get really bad.

Anyway, TheDrive has a good articale on todays clash:
www.thedrive.com...



posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 01:59 PM
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I can see future major battles between Hezbollah forces, Syrians and Iranians where the IDF is forced into defending itself by using nuclear weapons against specific targets in Syria. If Iran responds like they have promised then they could easily trip a nuclear confrontation with the IDF. If they do attack Iran they would most likely follow the battle plans already laid out by the Western Alliance against Iran. The death toll could easily top 20 million people and Iran won't be interested in taking on anybody when it's over. There won't be much left to worry about. My best,



posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 02:41 PM
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a reply to: tiredoflooking

Iran has as much business in Syria as Israel does.

Israel is the first to use offensive strikes under their insane policy that they are allowed to do whatever the f**k they want because they think the whole world wants to eradicate them.

Iran and Russia (and China quietly) are basically sick of Israel running ops into foreign countries and so are using Hezbollah and Iran rev guard forces to give them a few bloody noses, mainly in the hope of provoking Israel into some seriously stupid incursion somewhere like Syria or Iraq.

Unfortunately for Israel, they are now fast running out of friends on the world stage, they keep using emotional blackmail by shouting "holocaust" whenever anybody points out that they're acting like trigger happy nutters!

Having operated on the ground in Israel, Lebanon and Palestine I am still convinced that Israeli paranoia and arrogance may be the thing that kicks off a major conflict out there, possibly drawing in the bigger players.

I'm no fan of Iran or Russia but folks HAVE to start realising that Israel IS an instigator in many of the problems there, they've had 40 years of flaunting international law on borders, settlements and nuclear arsenals purely because they have so much influence in the US, they may find that coming to an end sooner than they ever though possible.



posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 03:42 PM
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Gee they want to exist in their national homstead after suffering a enormous collective trauma. You'd too start acting somewhat thin skined after 6 million of your people were murdered. Its so easy to condem them when you dont have to face their odds for national survival.

Anyway back to aircraft related topics, the drone the Israelis shot down was apparently an RQ-170 knockoff. Interestingly enough, the drone appears to be quite advanced and used emulated western technology according to the IAF:
www.timesofisrael.com...
On the other hand, looks like they had not issues tracking it, Iranian Stealth still sucks.

They are still not sure whether the F-16 was shot down or not but they assume it was hit by a missile.



posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 03:53 PM
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Something else, the IAF released this picture which allegedly shows an Iranian UAV taking off from an facility in Syria. If thats correct, how did they get the picture? It looks like drone footage based on the angle but they shoudlnt be able to get their recon drones deep into Syria. At least their known assets are not stealthy at all and probably pretty easy to detect and shoot down.
www.idf.il...



posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 04:14 PM
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a reply to: mightmight

This is actually a pretty big deal for a whole bunch of reasons, and the Israelis have started a level 1 callup of their army as well as instituted thorough media blackouts in the wake of the incident.

For very good reasons mind you because whoever hatched this little plan in Syria was actively looking to provoke Israeli strikes against the Syrian air defense network in the hopes of it killing Russians who also partially man many of these sites, thus forcing/motivating the Russians into helping them strike Israel back.

This was hardcore real politik dirty pool of the sort that can snowball extraordinarily quickly into a major regional or even larger scale shooting war!

In a way it was masterfully played by whoever was running this op on the Syrian side and only dumb luck and Russian leadership keeping a cool head has kept this from blowing up into something major UP TO THIS POINT!

Mind you, up to this point is key! This situation is far from over and still has massive potential to go extremely badly, likely with little to no warning.


edit on 10-2-2018 by roguetechie because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 10 2018 @ 04:21 PM
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I do understand the general history, a little. I'm just amazed that the international community is allowing Iran to occupy the vaccum space left as the Syrian civil war dies down. I do understand the great tension between Israel and Iran. Iran also has a great and widely expressed hate for the USA.

My reference to Iran being crazy is that currently it seems the US is widely supporting Israel, even more than they have historically, the news just reported an Israeli jet hasn't been shot down since probably the 1980s - I'm guessing that would have been during the Lebannon conflict.

I was aware of the lifted sanctions but didn't realize the extent of Iran's trade with Europe, but even so you think that connection alone would be enough for the EU to support Iran attacking Israel? It's one thing when they use a terrorist agency like Hezbollah, but to outright be flying drones into Israeli airspace and then to have Syrian forces shoot down an Israeli fighter jet in pursuit after a direct threat... seems very brave of Iran at this point in history.

The US may be depleted but there is no way , especially with the current administration, that they will stand by and watch Iran preemptively attack Israel.

I'm just also surprised the US and even others involved in the Syrian civil war would allow Iran to develop such a stronghold in Syria.

It is said they do not have nuclear weapons yet, can this really be proven? When I compare them to NK they seem like a much bigger threat to the stability of the middle East and the world even if it's true that they haven't yet acquired nukes.

I'm just surprised with this happening and wonder what purpose Iran could possibly have to start such a thing. If anything it would make sense for them to quietly build up forces in Syria and to quietly help Assad rebuild.

Maybe the story of the Iranian drone in Israeli airspace is a fabricated one, to draw attention to the growing threat of Iranian development in Syria. Just a guess...
edit on 10 by tiredoflooking because: Spelling



posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 04:15 AM
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a reply to: tiredoflooking

You have to remember that the ayatollahs who control Iran are directly working to bring about the conditions necessary to bring the 12th/hidden imam into the open and thus bringing about the Islamic version of revelations/armageddon basically...

It might seem completely insane to us, but to them this is a very worthy goal and something worth taking any and every risk necessary to achieve it.

The drone shoot down and subsequent destruction of the control vehicle were very much real and the video of them can easily be watched a thousand different places online. Not to mention that the drone which was shot down bears a striking resemblance to the copies they made of the American rq-170 drone they acquired pretty much fully intact several years ago.

Put simply, this was a very crafty and well executed complex operation which included the drone incursion, the ambush of the retaliatory 8 plane Israeli strike package, subsequent widescale strikes on the air defense network of Syria which has Iranians syrian and Russian participation, and the subsequent Russian brokering of the de-escalation.

My real question though is how you have missed Iran's extremely heavy involvement in both Syria and Iraq for several years now?

We literally cut off all maintenance and spares support for the Abrams tanks we gave Iraq more than a year ago due to at least two of them being handed over to Iranian militia units in Iraq!

Iran, Hezbollah, and Russia were also the only thing keeping Assad in the fight for multiple years!



posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 05:02 AM
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Such Iranian military provocations like this can easily and quickly escalate out of control.Is that what Iran wants?



posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 05:13 AM
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a reply to: roguetechie

I admit I did not know Iran was involved...most reports I've read have been about the proxy wars, certainly I knew of the other players, I somehow missed this fact. I will have to go do some more reading now. I'm surprised because it should have jumped out at me...maybe it's not been widely reported in regular mainstream, or I just missed it!

Would it be impossible to stage this drone entering Israel's airspace? By stage I mean for someone other than Iran to make it look like Iran?



posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 07:29 AM
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a reply to: tiredoflooking

So with the way this specific drone thing went down, not really.

The Israelis were observing both the vehicle with the control transmitter and operator on board as well as the UAV itself from the launch of it's mission from the sounds of it using various means (likely a combination of radio and data transmission intercepts, visual/ir surveillance, radar, and possibly other assets like satellites and informants/ground observers of some sort) and very patiently waited for it to cross the border into Israel proper before taking out the drone itself and it's command vehicle right after.

Due to the type of UAV it appears to have been (a "high end reverse engineered Iranian rq-170 based design) the sheer expense and complexity of such UAV'S and their command and control systems it's very unlikely to be of a type that anyone outside of maybe Hezbollah would be tied in tight enough with the Iranians much less theoretically capable of operating and supporting that class of UAV.

It's a pretty serious piece of kit just because of it's sheer size and turbine engine alone even if it was nowhere close to having a fully functional set of true rq-170 guts inside of it.

I can see why you'd wonder though, and in this Syria thing the lines of who is doing what who is on whose side this week and pretty much every other possible thing are extremely blurry and constantly shifting!

Also though the Iranians aren't exactly denying their involvement in this incident and both they and the Syrians have called what happened a strategic decision, which in this part of the world is them basically admitting it and gloating openly.

I personally am having a little bit of a hard time considering either Iran or Hezbollah the bad guys when it comes to Syria and Iraq and the fight against the head choppers of ISIS and their friends.

I feel the same about the Iranian support for the Houthis in Yemen (that Iran isn't the bad guy) in their fight against the GCC and absolutely murderous Saudis.

That's one of the trickiest things about this is figuring out who the bad guys are in this
basically undeclared and slowly spreading regional conflict that people are referring to as a bunch of separate wars even though they really aren't (there's pretty extensive fighting in Egypt Libya Lebanon Syria Iraq Yemen Saudi Arabia and I think one or two I missed and another one or two wars which are very likely to start in the next 3 years to boot though the news coverage on most of these are very scarce)

In some ways it's sunni versus shia with smaller groups ethnicities and religions teaming up mostly with the shia because the Sunnis (Saudi Arabia and friends) are murderous bastards to everyone including anyone they don't consider hardcore sunni enough!

This post is one big vast oversimplification in that every single thing I've covered in it is quite a bit more complex than the bare bones I've laid out for them in here.

But hopefully this can at least help you get a good enough start to getting yourself caught up on the situations that interest you.



posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 01:24 PM
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Bottom line is Israel crossed into Syria and attacked first, as they have done a hundred times
Iran and Russia are in Syria legally at request fulfilling their defence pact agreement.
Not once in the years of this war have Syrian reg forces attacked Israeli territory.
So the argument Israel is under threat is complete BS
They lost a bird and deserved it.
If Israel wants peace ,they need to stop attacking people.



posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 04:14 PM
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a reply to: roguetechie

What I was hinting at and wondering is if Israel might have been in control of the drone... covertly.

I'm not a big supporter of Iran or the Saudis...and Hezbollah, not them either. There is just too much hate projected from them onto others and each other. I know the history is long and complicated, and pretty next to impossible for the western world to even understand, especially with the biased views reported in what little coverage the mainstream even covers about these subjects.
I have to rely on the little amount of research I have done and what my gut tells me which is all of the above are too complicit with human rights abuses, and terror tactics. I do understand the argument of Hezbollah and why they feel it's necessary to use such tactics but it still doesn't make it OK in my books. Hey Israel is no angel either, I do think Israel would move towards a peaceful solution more quickly than the other side if given the choice.

I just find this incident to have been, let's say "packaged" very well and quickly for mass media release and I have a really hard time understanding why Iran would cross into their airspace, Israel's, knowing they would lose their expensive drone. I mean they could have been tracking someone or something we haven't been told about, sure. Also the fact that Syria shot down their jet, they have flown plenty of bombing missions and this is the first time they got taken out. If Syria knew they were retaliating because of the drone...why would they shoot them down?

Maybe I'm reading something into this that's not really there but something about it feels off to me. Is Israel above muddying the waters to bring attention to their cause? Not exactly sure...



posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 05:24 PM
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a reply to: tiredoflooking

Because the whole point was to trigger a retaliation which would fly right into a SAM kill box and pop at least one Israeli aircraft SPECIFICALLY to send the message that they are not going to tolerate Israeli incursions into their air space any longer.

Literally, the Syrians said that... It's not a guess, that's what happened



posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 05:29 PM
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a reply to: all2human

So an incident that started with an armed "Iranian"(defacto Syrian regardless of who was at the stick since it was a joint operation) UAV across the Israeli border on an attack mission and got shot down INSIDE ISRAEL is Israel crossing into Syria first?

Words have meanings, and the way you described the event bears zero resemblance to what actually happened yesterday!

This said, that makes your conclusion pretty worthless, laughable, and totally inapplicable to the actual situation.



posted on Feb, 11 2018 @ 05:50 PM
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Don't blame Israel , they are innocent !

Always/

The TV told me this !



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