House Intelligence FISA memo released: What it says

a reply to: theantediluvian


Sure, maybe they knew Trump was supportive of good relations with Russia (who wouldn't be). Trump has said all along he didn't believe sanctions were necessary, and perhaps Page was simply stating that position (Page exploiting it to his own benefit, even)

But when it comes down to it, what good does Page's word mean? He isn't the POTUS, or Trump. There is zero evidence Trump made any such statement, and there is zero evidence that any alleged crime/speculated event in the dossier even really took place. Regardless, it was a campaign document (conflict #1) written by someone with stated anti-Trump biases (conflict #2) exploited by agents in the FBI who were also provably anti-Trump/pro-Clinton (conflict #3). I'm sure I'm missing other conflicts, but those three glaring ones jump out.

a reply to: theantediluvian

It could very well be coincidence.

More likely an educated guess.

Steele knew that page went to russia, he knew he had dealings with business people there and state people before.

He also knew that roseneft was up for sale.

It would not be a huge stretch to guess Page may have talked to someone involved with roseneft.

But lets take that there was something to it, but as you say Steele fudged the details a bit.

That in its own right is horrible if this dossier was used for the warrant.

So we know that at the time of the warrant the dossier was far from totally verified, and that either steele was flat out wrong about some things or just was fudging it for more dramatic effect, so if it was used to spy on the people who paid for the dossiers opponent, it is outrageous.

originally posted by: Willtell

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: Willtell
This is just what we knew it would be

A defense of Trump by his defenders distorting reality

Like cutting up puzzle pieces to make them fit where they don’t belong.

Trump and everything he does is a LIE!

Trump and everything he touches is a LIE

Trump and everyone surrounding him is a LIAR

Your partisanship is unreal.

McCabe tetsified that there would have been no fisa warrant without the dossier.

That is a disgusting abuse of power. The fact that you and others have no problem with that is truly frightening.

If trump would use his FBI tp spy on his opponents based of a dossier he paid for that was known to not be corroborated, you would be screaming the loudest.

So what!

It’s a straw man argument.

Filled, I'm sure and loaded with distortions from a person who already has been caught colluding with, guess who?

Trump

We get that you won't ever believe the facts, as presented... But calling out Grambler as some kind of undercover political operative colluding with Trump and Russians ?!?!?

Wow I can't believe that response was allowed to stand.

originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: face23785
According to Catherine Herridge, the dossier wasn't just included, it was the top line item on the FISA application.

If that was their best evidence, they had nothing. Disgraceful. The judge they tricked has got to be furious.

Yeah, that must have been it, which would also explain how the original FISA warrant was signed years before Steele's portion of the document was included.......

You're confused. There was a separate FISA warrant from 2013 on Page that was expired. This is about the newer one that they got in 2016. The people who keep bringing up the 2013 one are purposefully misleading you.

The partisan positions on this are very predictable.

I am wondering whether there is a middle ground here in agreeing a full investigation via an SC is warranted... then we can all get the detail we need to get to a common conclusion. Surely all would be for that, given the seriousness of the report from the US GOVT.

It would be interesting to hear from people that think we should all ignore this, yet still progress with the Mueller investigation.

originally posted by: Wayfarer

Yeah, that must have been it, which would also explain how the original FISA warrant was signed years before Steele's portion of the document was included.......

Which demonstrates the failure of any agency to act in a timely manner,
The FBI had all of this information years ago, way before Trump was on the scene.

The only explanation is the Special Counsel is The Insurance Policy
that was tossed out in Andrew McCabes office.

Time will prove this, wait and see.

a reply to: Xcathdra

We now know the FBI took Kremlin and Hillary campaign information and used it to spy on Trump

This is something I've been saying since the revelation of the dossier. The only demonstrable Kremlin influence with demonstrable effects on American democracy was Steele's work with Kremlin sources.

I just cannot get over the lack of journalistic curiosity over this entire story over the last couple of years. It's becoming more and more clear that much of the media was in on it.

While this could be something with more context, it is seemingly not very much, and certainly not the rediculous claims made by the most ardent partisans.

The fisa process is a problem. There is no legal claim made in the memo.

The memo clearly states page was not the reason for the SC.

It also sounds like McCabe is not quoted properly but that's unknown.
Like all the info in this document.

What I get from it.
Time to restrict and closely monitor the fisa program.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
History is going to be HARSH on Trump and his supporters. You should pull your head out of the ATS echo chamber every now and then. The country is PISSED at him.

The country is ALSO completely out of touch with reality for the most part thanks to the MSM and 'King' George (Soros)...

Which is the sole reason WHY they are so pissed.

What I would like to know is WHY do you and the majority believe what the MSM is telling you when they have clearly lost any and all credibility.

originally posted by: burntheships

originally posted by: Wayfarer

Yeah, that must have been it, which would also explain how the original FISA warrant was signed years before Steele's portion of the document was included.......

Which demonstrates the failure of any agency to act in a timely manner,
The FBI had all of this information years ago, way before Trump was on the scene.

The only explanation is the Special Counsel is The Insurance Policy
that was tossed out in Andrew McCabes office.

Time will prove this, wait and see.

It's also irrelevant. That warrant was issued in 2013, Page was investigated, and nothing was done. That warrant expired. Then in 2016 they asked for a new warrant based primarily on this dossier. Even bringing up the 2013 warrant is irrelevant, it's misdirection. That's like using the fact that someone was convicted of theft 5 years ago to get a judge to sign off on a search warrant for that person's apartment in a new case, without any other evidence.

a reply to: UKTruth

I am wondering whether there is a middle ground here in agreeing a full investigation via an SC is warranted... then we can all get the detail we need to get to a common conclusion. Surely all would be for that, given the seriousness of the report from the US GOVT.

There's no middle ground to be had.

Trumps already been convicted in the kangaroo courts of public opinion.

And all it took as a $1,000,000 dossier based on shoddy work.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

And if they turn out to be true?

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: UKTruth

I am wondering whether there is a middle ground here in agreeing a full investigation via an SC is warranted... then we can all get the detail we need to get to a common conclusion. Surely all would be for that, given the seriousness of the report from the US GOVT.

There's no middle ground to be had.

Trumps already been convicted in the kangaroo courts of public opinion.

And all it took as a $1,000,000 dossier based on shoddy work.

In the end it was based on Russian propaganda to sew discord in the US.

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: AboveBoard

originally posted by: Grambler
If it is true that the fisa warrant on page wouldnt have been approved without the dossier, it is the biggest political scandal of my lifetime.

I have been saying for months, that this would be Obama using paid for oppo research from his own party to spy on his opponent with the intel community, which is far more serious than something like watergate.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Does the memo say anything about Carter Page already being under. FISA warrant since 2014, prior to the Steele Dossier due to his involvement with known Russian spies? The FISA warrant was renewed since then, and the dossier was merely corroborating evidence that Carter still needed surveillance.

Here. The Washington Examiner from August 2017: Link

The warrant from page in 2014 was long since done.

In fact, the FBI attempted to get a fisa warrant on page in the summer of 2016, and in an almost unprecedented move, was denied by the court.

So the 2014 warrant is irrelevant.

It would be like me getting a warrant in 2014 to go into a drug dealers house, and then using that as an excuse to be improper about getting another warrant in 2016.

Ok. If was not continuous...Sooo do you think that his former surveillance might have played a factor in reestabilishing it? Does this memo give us all the facts or cherry picked facts to allow the Right to go nuts over a conspiracy theory?

I’m betting the second. In which case it is a lie.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Xcathdra

We now know the FBI took Kremlin and Hillary campaign information and used it to spy on Trump

This is something I've been saying since the revelation of the dossier. The only demonstrable Kremlin influence with demonstrable effects on American democracy was Steele's work with Kremlin sources.

I just cannot get over the lack of journalistic curiosity over this entire story over the last couple of years. It's becoming more and more clear that much of the media was in on it.

The "journalists" in question have ethics that would raise eyebrows in the Court of Caligula.

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: UKTruth

I am wondering whether there is a middle ground here in agreeing a full investigation via an SC is warranted... then we can all get the detail we need to get to a common conclusion. Surely all would be for that, given the seriousness of the report from the US GOVT.

There's no middle ground to be had.

Trumps already been convicted in the kangaroo courts of public opinion.

And all it took as a $1,000,000 dossier based on shoddy work.

In the end it was based on Russian propaganda to sew discord in the US.

Russia as a snip load of faults.

I'd want to agree with that, but I just can't.

In the end it boils down to just one thing.

Trump haters are the only people that should be allowed to run this country.

Everyone else is just a Russian boogieman.

originally posted by: AboveBoard

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: AboveBoard

originally posted by: Grambler
If it is true that the fisa warrant on page wouldnt have been approved without the dossier, it is the biggest political scandal of my lifetime.

I have been saying for months, that this would be Obama using paid for oppo research from his own party to spy on his opponent with the intel community, which is far more serious than something like watergate.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Does the memo say anything about Carter Page already being under. FISA warrant since 2014, prior to the Steele Dossier due to his involvement with known Russian spies? The FISA warrant was renewed since then, and the dossier was merely corroborating evidence that Carter still needed surveillance.

Here. The Washington Examiner from August 2017: Link

The warrant from page in 2014 was long since done.

In fact, the FBI attempted to get a fisa warrant on page in the summer of 2016, and in an almost unprecedented move, was denied by the court.

So the 2014 warrant is irrelevant.

It would be like me getting a warrant in 2014 to go into a drug dealers house, and then using that as an excuse to be improper about getting another warrant in 2016.

Ok. If was not continuous...Sooo do you think that his former surveillance might have played a factor in reestabilishing it? Does this memo give us all the facts or cherry picked facts to allow the Right to go nuts over a conspiracy theory?

I’m betting the second. In which case it is a lie.

It shouldn't have played a factor at all, since the FISC requires new information to renew warrants every 90 days. Once one is expired you need new information to get a new warrant.

Again, anyone bringing up the 2013-14 warrant and investigation is misleading folks.

originally posted by: AboveBoard

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: AboveBoard

originally posted by: Grambler
If it is true that the fisa warrant on page wouldnt have been approved without the dossier, it is the biggest political scandal of my lifetime.

I have been saying for months, that this would be Obama using paid for oppo research from his own party to spy on his opponent with the intel community, which is far more serious than something like watergate.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Does the memo say anything about Carter Page already being under. FISA warrant since 2014, prior to the Steele Dossier due to his involvement with known Russian spies? The FISA warrant was renewed since then, and the dossier was merely corroborating evidence that Carter still needed surveillance.

Here. The Washington Examiner from August 2017: Link

The warrant from page in 2014 was long since done.

In fact, the FBI attempted to get a fisa warrant on page in the summer of 2016, and in an almost unprecedented move, was denied by the court.

So the 2014 warrant is irrelevant.

It would be like me getting a warrant in 2014 to go into a drug dealers house, and then using that as an excuse to be improper about getting another warrant in 2016.

Ok. If was not continuous...Sooo do you think that his former surveillance might have played a factor in reestabilishing it? Does this memo give us all the facts or cherry picked facts to allow the Right to go nuts over a conspiracy theory?

I’m betting the second. In which case it is a lie.

It sounds like the Obama admin was already spying on everyone and used the dossier as a last ditch effort to justify the spying when Clinton lost the election.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Of coarse Obama was spying on everybody. We knew this in 2012.

So was Bush and Ashcroft who has many fake fisa applications.

Fisa is a problem. It's the disease.