Immigration and the left.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: network dude


Here is another article from your linked website.

www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org...

Despite the abundance of evidence that immigration is not linked to higher crime rates, and that immigrants are less likely to be criminals than the native-born, many U.S. policymakers succumb to their fears and prejudices about what they imagine immigrants to be. As a result, far too many immigration policies are drafted on the basis of stereotypes rather than substance.

“Fears and prejudices” Hmmmm. That sounds a lot like “mah feels” to me. So tell me how these immigration policies are based in logic again?

are immigration laws not LAWS? Do you understand what a "Law" is?

And I was chastised for using murder and rape to make my point. LOL. Murder is against "the law". If you kill someone, and you get caught, you will likely face a penalty for breaking that law. Apparently, using such a dramatic example is needed to get through your "feelz".

a reply to: ManFromEurope


The fear comes from terrorism. 911, Boston Marathon.

a reply to: network dude

So you can’t tell me how immigration policies are always based on logic.

Didn’t think so.

a reply to: network dude

Wrong. There is intelligence in recognizing a waste of effort. Yes, with unlimited resources, time, effort, workforce, the blessings of the people living near the mountain, blessings of environmentalists, political capital, and all the many MANY factors and requirements needed to remove a mountain it may not look that bad, but that is theoretical talk. In real life, there is no accomplishing that task. I don't care who you are or how much money you have lying around. It is feasibly impossible.

I look at illegal immigration the same way. You aren't going to stop it as long as America remains a solid place to live and there exists 3rd world countries in the world. You might as well be trying to fight the tide or level a mountain. We should be working to make the people here live's better, and if we REALLY want to curb the influx of people then we need to address the reasons why they come here to begin with. Just closing the door is only treating a symptom, but the illness still exists.

a reply to: Krazysh0t


Big misunderstanding there; most people don’t want the door closed, they want to know who is coming here and why?

It is a well known fact, that terrorist have trained in Mexico, and have crossed over, not to mention the flow of illegal drugs that come into this country.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: network dude

So you can’t tell me how immigration policies are always based on logic.

Didn’t think so.

I can tell you that we as a nation, wrote, then voted on, then enacted a set of laws that govern our nation. If that part there is confusing to you, let me know, as it's vital to the discussion. Once you fully comprehend what I wrote there, we can move onto how your feelings might affect the laws that our nation has made. thanks in advance for taking the time to put aside your political bias in favor of making an informed post.

originally posted by: KTemplar
a reply to: Krazysh0t


It is a well known fact, that terrorist have trained in Mexico, and have crossed over, not to mention the flow of illegal drugs that come into this country.

Negative. That is a right wing media myth. Plus most terrorist attacks are perpetrated by white people in this country and of the ones done by Muslims NONE of them were immigrants of either the illegal or refugee persuasion. Bringing this up is just a distraction.

a reply to: Krazysh0t


Not a distraction; many have been caught at the border eliminating further attacks.

a reply to: network dude

All God’s children gots feels. Quit blaming one side of the country for having feels, when your side operates on the feels all the damn time.

Get my point now, skippy? Or do I need to put it in simpler terms for ya?

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Or you know just going through naturalization legally where they already perform those tests.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: network dude



So you want to know why I feel the way I do about illegal immigrants? Open a history book.

So you admit this is how you "FEEL"....

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: network dude

Wrong. There is intelligence in recognizing a waste of effort. Yes, with unlimited resources, time, effort, workforce, the blessings of the people living near the mountain, blessings of environmentalists, political capital, and all the many MANY factors and requirements needed to remove a mountain it may not look that bad, but that is theoretical talk. In real life, there is no accomplishing that task. I don't care who you are or how much money you have lying around. It is feasibly impossible.

I look at illegal immigration the same way. You aren't going to stop it as long as America remains a solid place to live and there exists 3rd world countries in the world. You might as well be trying to fight the tide or level a mountain. We should be working to make the people here live's better, and if we REALLY want to curb the influx of people then we need to address the reasons why they come here to begin with. Just closing the door is only treating a symptom, but the illness still exists.

I am not sure if you are doing this intentionally, or you really do believe this. First off, doing something that is hard or that others thing is impossible, are the defining moments in our history. Not the US history, WORLD history. Those who we consider to be great men and women, did things others thought impossible, for the benefit of mankind. I don't claim to be even close to that kind of person, but I admire and respect the drive and determination a person would have to be that great.

Second, yes, immigration is a problem and as long as we have the sh!t, others will want to be part of our sh!t. And there is a right way to go about that. If we give up and say protecting the borders is just way too hard, let's all just do a few bong rips and sing kum buy ya, then we aren't part of the solution, we are a YUGE part of the problem. Sadly, it's starting to sound like that's your position on this and that is sad to me. Being the kind of person who runs away from anything hard is not the kind of person I respect or even tolerate. Kids can learn how to overcome that mentality, adults just try to defend it. I sincerely hope that your statements on this are just based on your need to be a good partisan leftie and not how you really approach life.

originally posted by: KTemplar
a reply to: Krazysh0t


Not a distraction; many have been caught at the border eliminating further attacks.

Yeah. So? Many have also been caught domestically while already in the States too. Terrorism really isn't the bogeyman the right wing media makes it out to be.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: network dude

All God’s children gots feels. Quit blaming one side of the country for having feels, when your side operates on the feels all the damn time.

Get my point now, skippy? Or do I need to put it in simpler terms for ya?

Yea, I'm afraid your emotional outburst will need some clarification, skippy.

the "i'm rubber, you're glue" thing only works when there is context to go by, and an abundance of kindergarten kids around. The adults are having a talk right now, so hows about you run off and play. K?

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Or you know just going through naturalization legally where they already perform those tests.

Yeah, it's a shame that natural legalization is stupid expensive, takes many many years, requires access to traveling to and from your home country many times over the process, and CURRENTLY our government also wants to restrict legal immigration access to the country too. My Chinese buddy who has been trying to get a green card for the last decade and half has told me all the hang ups with that system. To be honest, it isn't surprising in the least that people skip it for how much bull# you have to go through.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
Uh yes, they are imaginary. Just because a bunch of men in suits decided that country A ends here and country B begins afterwards doesn't make them any less so. You can have all the paperwork in the world to back that up, but it doesn't change the fact that borders are a construct of the imagination. A bird isn't going to listen to those men saying the US ends here and Canada begins. Hell, it doesn't even stop people with a desire to relocate.

Just an FYI, birds aren't humans. Tricky, I know...

Until Nationalists stop trying to demonize every illegal in the country and kick them out I really don't feel like you guys have a leg to stand on as it pertains to them being exploited or not. If we had my way, they'd be legalized, put on the books, and made much harder to exploit. You, on the other hand, are just using their exploration as a talking point to defend why they shouldn't be here (of course ignoring how much worse their situation was where they came from).

Like I said earlier... "painted as victims."

Protest results in ugly actions from protestors. Nothing new here.

... and? I assume you are trying to justify bad behavior here?

For sure. All those pot smokers are TOTALLY destroying the country, right?

De-rail attempt. Bad one, too.

Not if you recognize their existence, legalize them, and get their wages to a competitive level. OR you could always target the businesses that actually employ these people, but I never hear you guys itching to blame them for anything.

No one is denying their existence, so drop that rhetoric right there.

They can be legally present without making them citizens, you know.

If they want to be citizens so bad, we have a legal process that they are expected to follow. No more handouts.

I just cut out the disease replies you had, because they were some of the most idiotic things I've ever seen you type. Mudpit, baby.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: KTemplar
a reply to: Krazysh0t


Not a distraction; many have been caught at the border eliminating further attacks.

Yeah. So? Many have also been caught domestically while already in the States too. Terrorism really isn't the bogeyman the right wing media makes it out to be.

while the poster you are replying to may have brought up terrorism, it's not the point of the OP, nor did I ever insinuate that those coming here are all bad people. I know a family personally, and know they are great people who are looking for a better life. I also know that that same family was deported due to our laws. If they went about their entry the right way, they would still be here. This isn't about how nice folks are or aren't this is about protecting our borders and enforcing our laws.

Am I to assume you won't be explaining you position on the yard issue?

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Or you know just going through naturalization legally where they already perform those tests.

Yeah, it's a shame that natural legalization is stupid expensive, takes many many years, requires access to traveling to and from your home country many times over the process, and CURRENTLY our government also wants to restrict legal immigration access to the country too. My Chinese buddy who has been trying to get a green card for the last decade and half has told me all the hang ups with that system. To be honest, it isn't surprising in the least that people skip it for how much bull# you have to go through.

So your answer is to just rubber-stamp everyone who wants in?

Tell you what, we'll let them in only if progressives proponents take their place in their country of origin to help turn those into utopias.

a reply to: network dude

Here is what I have learned from this thread. Laws, (particularly immigration laws) are subjective to feelings.

If humans are involved, feelings are always a factor.

Your OP is one example.

If that is not correct, then explain why immigration laws should not be followed.

I did not say they should not be followed. What I did say is that it is not that simple.

It appears you still cannot grasp that concept.

originally posted by: network dude
I am not sure if you are doing this intentionally, or you really do believe this. First off, doing something that is hard or that others thing is impossible, are the defining moments in our history. Not the US history, WORLD history. Those who we consider to be great men and women, did things others thought impossible, for the benefit of mankind. I don't claim to be even close to that kind of person, but I admire and respect the drive and determination a person would have to be that great.

For the THIRD time, I didn't say that leveling a mountain is impossible. I am a FIRM believer in the saying, "Where there is a will, there is a way." Of course it can be done if the desire and effort were there. The point I'm making is that the desire and effort AREN'T there. Instead we do things like build tunnels through mountains or cut valleys into the tops of them to make passage through easier. This is just an analogy anyways. There isn't exactly a need to level any mountains out there.

Second, yes, immigration is a problem and as long as we have the sh!t, others will want to be part of our sh!t. And there is a right way to go about that. If we give up and say protecting the borders is just way too hard, let's all just do a few bong rips and sing kum buy ya, then we aren't part of the solution, we are a YUGE part of the problem. Sadly, it's starting to sound like that's your position on this and that is sad to me. Being the kind of person who runs away from anything hard is not the kind of person I respect or even tolerate. Kids can learn how to overcome that mentality, adults just try to defend it. I sincerely hope that your statements on this are just based on your need to be a good partisan leftie and not how you really approach life.

I don't come to ATS looking for your respect or tolerance. Plus I've yet to converse with you where I got the feeling you were giving it to me to begin with. I've always spoken to you under the assumption that you have zero respect for me, my positions, and my thoughts. So your words and threats here are toothless.

For instance, in this very paragraph you have decided what I think without actually asking me if it is true all so you can use that as proof of why you shouldn't like me. Textbook example of your ongoing disrespect for me. You probably didn't even realize you were doing it either because you do it so naturally.