Immigration and the left.

a reply to: Sublimecraft

At it's core, I believe it's stems from a Nationalism versus Globalism mindset.

The problem is also people don't understand that there is more than one flavor for both Nationalism and Globalism.

I'm actually not opposed to Globalism where all countries help elevate each other for the betterment of humanity , by ensuring everyone has the basic needs around the world.

However, what we have and our gov't is expanding is CorpGlobalism where the few benefit and instead of bringing other countries standards of living to our level we are dropping to their level. In addition, our LIBERATED gov't regulations and policies are being thrown down their throat (ie: patriot act, Corporations are people,etc). Current Globalism also increases the slave labor pool and gives corporations even more power at a global world versus only nationally.

originally posted by: network dude
So please explain why you feel we should ignore the law on this topic. I would honestly like to know.

I'll let this guy explain


Soo inspirational, a man who crawled his way out of a craphole to escape to better lands, then once got there, sent for his family also so they too could have hope for a brighter future.


I have mixed feelings about the whole mess, but I don't pretend to not know whats in the hearts of those whom are fighting for the illegals to stay...and a entire house of politicians as far right as you can go also understands.

Ok I found it .... The post I mentioned above ....Itsa post by Grambler , in political madness .... Called.... " Dems worried census asking for citizenship will cost cali seat and money " .... Good post about what's going on behind the scenes with illegal immigration ....I don't kniw how to attach links ... Sorry ...but it makes a good
Point .

a reply to: network dude

Laws are supposed to reflect morality and laws shouldn't trump morality. Calling someone a criminal just because he crossed an imaginary line is stupid. We owe a great many things in this country that we take for granted due to immigrants, both legal and illegal. They aren't destroying the country, in fact the EXACT opposite is true. They have made our country great and continue to do so.

So you want to know why I feel the way I do about illegal immigrants? Open a history book.

a reply to: network dude

The U.S. was built on an invasion of immigrants. People just got onto ships and sailed over.

So what's the problem ?

a reply to: network dude

Yep they want "safe spaces" and "gun free zones" they wants guns gone. They want TSA making sure terrorist dont get on planes. They acyually say stuff like "its worth the wait because I dont want to get blown up."

They want more security everywhere so they can feel safe.

Except the damm border. It the dumbest shi ever lol.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Laws are supposed to reflect morality and laws shouldn't trump morality

LOL.LOl.LOL.LOL

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: network dude

So what's the problem ?

They were mostly Brits.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: network dude

Laws are supposed to reflect morality and laws shouldn't trump morality. Calling someone a criminal just because he crossed an imaginary line is stupid. We owe a great many things in this country that we take for granted due to immigrants, both legal and illegal. They aren't destroying the country, in fact the EXACT opposite is true. They have made our country great and continue to do so.

So you want to know why I feel the way I do about illegal immigrants? Open a history book.

I want to know why we still have to follow "laws"? They either matter, or the don't. If a law is wrong, then change it. Why did we bother to come up with immigration laws to begin with? Was it just mean folks with lots of money who did this?

Which country in the world has open borders? Please list them.

ETA:
I will applaud you for being honest and answering what you thought was the question.

originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: network dude

The U.S. was built on an invasion of immigrants. People just got onto ships and sailed over.

So what's the problem ?

LOL, and once those same immigrants all got together to form a nation, the enacted LAWS to govern how we would deal with Immigration. The fact that you and others don't seem to grasp that is "the problem".

a reply to: network dude

It’s not really about ignoring the laws—Obama, Schumer, etc were very hard on illegals—it’s about kicking the tough parts down the road so that they look good while republicans look bad.

a reply to: network dude

The only stance they have is "I hate Trump". Trump wants it its bad.

I mean he got 3 black kids out of a Chinese prison and they said it was his ego. LMAO.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: network dude

It’s not really about ignoring the laws—Obama, Schumer, etc were very hard on illegals—it’s about kicking the tough parts down the road so that they look good while republicans look bad.

it's today's talking points. I am aware that in 3-7 years, when Trump is gone and (providing the democratic party realizes that being against Trump isn't really a political strategy) and the democrats find a non criminal to run for president, they may decide that open borders is not quite the way to run a nation. But today, since Trump is "for" secure borders, they are not.

a reply to: Teikiatsu

The best part of your reply is this" being painted as victims". The majority of which is not victims. When they are deported over & over again and still find a way back in....big problem. I agree we're not Mexico & Canada....but those two countries enforce their immigration laws.....in a very strict manner. I love freedom and I'm all for being charitable...but there's a point to where our charity is being used & abused...we past that point years ago.

You know, what really gets me, is this wall thing.

In the early 2000's...05 or 06....both Senators Clinton and Obama voted to authorize building a border wall. All Trump is doing, is asking for the money to enforce that law. Like when he decided to recognize Jerusalem as the capital of Israel, which was passed into law and signed by then President Clinton, but never done. Or, like how he is trying to enforce laws on immigration that are already on the books, i.e., a city must inform ICE when they are releasing an illegal immigrant from custody.

To be very honest with you, if you look close enough, you will see that much of what Trump wants to do is already law, just not enforced.

a reply to: network dude

Change the laws? Look at the hoopla that we are going through now JUST to get DACA kids legalized and supposedly that has immense bi-partisan support.

As for why we bothered to come up with immigration laws, it is because there was a backlash against the wave of immigrants from the turn of the 20th century. People deployed anti-immigrant rhetoric similar to the rhetoric deploy today to argue about how these people were taking jobs away from Americans and things. If you want to get an idea for what I mean, watch the movie Gangs of New York.

But a movie is a poor source for historical accuracy, here is a Pew Research source that talks about these things.

A 1790 law was the first to specify who could become a citizen, limiting that privilege to free whites of “good moral character” who had lived in the U.S. for at least two years. In 1870, the right of citizenship was extended to those of African origin.

Starting in 1875, a series of restrictions on immigration were enacted. They included bans on criminals, people with contagious diseases, polygamists, anarchists, beggars and importers of prostitutes. Other restrictions targeted the rising number of Asian immigrants, first limiting migration from China and later banning immigration from most Asian countries.

By the early 1900s, the nation’s predominant immigration flow shifted away from northern and western European nations and toward southern and eastern Europe. In response, laws were passed in 1921 and 1924 to try to restore earlier immigration patterns by capping total annual immigration and imposing numerical quotas based on immigrant nationality that favored northern and western European countries.

(Source)

Noticing a pattern here with immigration law? When immigrants from places that Americans living here find "undesirable" come to the country in massive waves then we make laws trying to limit them coming in. At times we even juxtapose this with immigration from parts of the world that we prefer people to come from. All this has happened time and again throughout US history and it is repeating AGAIN today.

a reply to: network dude

Idont pretend to know the leftist answer as to why, but there may be a legitimate legal reason as to why now. If a law remains unenforced for decades, ignored except sporadicaly, the issuing authority may be said to have abandonned the law and its premise such that the law is no longer available to enforce.

Its kind of like adverse possession in property law. You openly squat on some ones land for 21 years, its yours. The US hasnt really enforced its sovereignty over the border since the 1950s.

At this point what does it matter, the barbarians are well past the gates and resding in Sanctuary Cities and States.

a reply to: theatreboy

Times change. So do opinions. 2005 was 13 years ago and the national discourse has developed and evolved immensely since then. Expecting people to believe and subscribe to the same thinking they did a decade and a half ago is silly and partisan talk.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t


Noticing a pattern here with immigration law? When immigrants from places that Americans living here find "undesirable" come to the country in massive waves then we make laws trying to limit them coming in. At times we even juxtapose this with immigration from parts of the world that we prefer people to come from. All this has happened time and again throughout US history and it is repeating AGAIN today.

If the laws were just written a few years ago, you might have a leg to stand on, you don't. Unless you can show that the nation as a whole is biased towards letting people from "desirable" nations enter, you are just using a logical fallacy. Appeal to emotion. Don't be that guy.

a reply to: network dude

What are you talking about? The laws DIRECTLY target people of certain nationalities or skin color.