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The Betrayal: The Cult of Trump turns on Chelsea Manning

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posted on Jan, 15 2018 @ 10:01 PM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

questions for you to think about;
what does 'seems female' actually mean?
standards and perception of both masculinity and femininity are different in different cultures, have changed drastically over the years, and will continue to do so. who is the final arbiter of what is and is not?
where is the line drawn, who draws it, and how do you measure it?
Cowboy posted after you about calling you ma'am, and i'm assuming it was a joke but it illustrates my point really well - you've got a given image of What Is A Woman in your head, but how many women have short hair and are still definitely women? how many women do you see in pants, or without pierced ears, or even with distinct facial hair?
Gender is tricky because there are lots of things we think of as signifiers, but none of them taken on their own are absolutes.
is it not simpler to accept that there will always be outliers who are nevertheless absolutely a part of a given group?
can't we just exercise a little empathy and let people have their dang pronoun?




posted on Jan, 15 2018 @ 10:33 PM
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originally posted by: dragonridr

Yeah hate America we get it. You know what's funny though when I see people hating America it occurs to me something I was told in Korea. I was told hate is just another form of jealousy people hate Americans because compared to most countries we have it well. Even are poor is better off thenany in other countries. Jealousy is a negative emotion which makes a person emotionally imbalanced.So sorry your life sucks so bad you have to hate on others.


I dont hate America. I hate what the Government / Military / Deep State / Corporatocracy does in my name and the patterns that never change because of blind loyalists wont stand up to tyranny all because that would be "America Hating".

* America's death toll on the world: 27,000,000++
*How Bush & Obama Devastated Chicago & Mexico with Mexican & Middle Eastern Narcoterrorists
*The 'Complete' Nexus of the Cold War - CIA Drug Trafficking - the War on Terror
*ObamaHillaryCo.'s TIMELINE OF TERROR In The Middle East
*Shock & Awe - When the Liberal Media Sold US 'Operation Iraqi Liberation'
*SHALL I GO ON???

If I could post the photos of the bomb splattered bodies that churn up the world over every year I would. 95% of them are 100% the results of "our" own ceaseless BS meddling that wont change because to criticize it is "America Hating". That is what I HATE.

The effing government isn't America.

The effing military isn't America.

Not until you make it so.

So either own up to its evils or stand up to it all.

Sheep or Patriot?

You can choose sheep.

I choose Patriot.
edit on 15-1-2018 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 15 2018 @ 10:54 PM
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a reply to: Southern Guardian

I don't appreciate your thread title lumping all Trump supporters into a group of mindless followers. While I voted Trump, I'd also vote for Chelsea Manning.



posted on Jan, 15 2018 @ 11:45 PM
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a reply to: proteus33


...when you volunteer for service you take an oath and he stomped all over his...


Nobody takes an Oath to cover up war crimes, and it’s that simple.

You lot can waffle all you like about Oaths and Allegiances, all that says to anyone with a lick of sense is that you have no idea what she swore to protect.
Or you do know but believe that criminal behaviour is part of the deal.

No.
The COTUS, against enemies, foreign and domestic.




I’d also like someone, in fact anyone who made the claim, to give us all a source confirming lives lost due to the releases.
Do hurry, I’d like to be informed as soon as possible if I’ve truly been defending someone with innocent blood on their hands.



posted on Jan, 15 2018 @ 11:49 PM
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originally posted by: Wardaddy454

originally posted by: IgnoranceIsntBlisss
a reply to: WarPig1939

Dude knew he'd eat snip for it kind of stokes the heroic patriot angle, no?

When evil needs to be exposed it needs to be exposed.

Blind loyalty, a virtue?


It wouldn't be an issue if Manning had gone the whistle blower route, but we know that Obama wasn't down with whistle blowers...


And yet you all continue to stick with the idea that “chain of command” was the way to go...
You all say this as if you’d then not be a detractor, but a supporter...

But you’re still all fully aware of Obama’s ethos regarding such, and fully aware she would probably have ended up in a river or a hole in the desert, with the cover up complete.



Illogical is the only way to describe what I’ve been reading here.



posted on Jan, 15 2018 @ 11:55 PM
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Every government is a representation of its people. So not sure what point you think your making.



posted on Jan, 15 2018 @ 11:58 PM
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a reply to: IgnoranceIsntBlisss

Honestly, it is really not worth an ounce of energy responding to people who say “you just hate *insert country*”...
It’s no more than a shaming tactic of Goebbel’s nature.

With that said, the way you did respond was perfect.


The effing government isn't America.

The effing military isn't America.


Brilliantly profound...

But sadly, not according to everyone, IIB...
Or we would never see these false accusations levied by emotional dimwits.



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 12:03 AM
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originally posted by: dragonridr
Every government is a representation of its people. So not sure what point you think your making.


What percent approve of the income tax and what it is used for?

Seems like a great place to start.



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 12:06 AM
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a reply to: JinMI

I believe the word representation in that post is a form of semantics.

Technically, Kim Yong Un’s government is NK’s “representation”.
But in no way does it truly represent them.


edit on 16-1-2018 by Hazardous1408 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 12:12 AM
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a reply to: Hazardous1408

Ah, true. The US isn't a communist association of states however. Yes, semantics but with a sharp point.

Freedom been regulated to the same definition methinks.



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 12:22 AM
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originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: Hazardous1408

Ah, true. The US isn't a communist association of states however. Yes, semantics but with a sharp point.

Freedom been regulated to the same definition methinks.


For sure, pal.

My only reasoning was that Poster A implied that a criminally infiltrated government is “not the USA”.
Of course Poster B knew this.
So either semantics was at play or Poster B actually feels those criminal elements represent him/her.
That would be strange though.



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 12:48 AM
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originally posted by: Hazardous1408

originally posted by: Wardaddy454

originally posted by: IgnoranceIsntBlisss
a reply to: WarPig1939

Dude knew he'd eat snip for it kind of stokes the heroic patriot angle, no?

When evil needs to be exposed it needs to be exposed.

Blind loyalty, a virtue?


It wouldn't be an issue if Manning had gone the whistle blower route, but we know that Obama wasn't down with whistle blowers...


And yet you all continue to stick with the idea that “chain of command” was the way to go...
You all say this as if you’d then not be a detractor, but a supporter...

But you’re still all fully aware of Obama’s ethos regarding such, and fully aware she would probably have ended up in a river or a hole in the desert, with the cover up complete.



Illogical is the only way to describe what I’ve been reading here.


What cover up do you think happened?? It's not a shocker that civilians die in military strikes. And yes in the video she released she was unaware thus same group attacked and killed US military before the air strike. Here was the shocking point she made in trialand her reason for exposing the video.she said "They dehumanised the individuals they were engaging and seemed to not value human life by referring to them as ‘dead bastards’, and congratulating each other on the ability to kill in large numbers.”

Wait US pilots were talking about there kills and wernt politically correct my god those animals. Since man first grabbed a spear wars have started and people have bragged about them

So I ask again what did she expose that everyone wants to claim was important for the public to know?



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 12:49 AM
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originally posted by: Southern Guardian
a reply to: Theprodicalson

Didn't read the OP.


She's a traitor now right?! Chelsea Manning? Yet Assange and Wikileaks used those exact classified materials to their advantage and we continue to praise them. But now Manning is scum because well she's American and a soldier? But praise Assange for releasing this information and exposing? Makes now sense? What the hell?!


People praise Wikileaks and their actions, but attack Chelsea Manning, the source of that very important information that keeps Wikileaks running. You praise one, attack the other. The latter is responsible for getting the information out there that you praise and insist needs to be released.

It's hypocritical. And claiming that she was a 'soldier' or 'american' doesn't change that hypocrisy.


It does make a difference.

Wikileaks is not beholden to the USA. It has no obligation to keep secret any information given to it.

Manning signed non disclosure agreements and took a oath. He made no attempt to use legal channels to complain about what he saw. IF he had tried to use legal channels. And got nowhere THEN i would be more sympathetic to him.



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 12:51 AM
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Anyone who gives out national secrets then runs as a Senator in the same country must have a large pair of...wait a sec maybe not.
edit on 16-1-2018 by khnum because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 12:57 AM
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originally posted by: continuousThunder

originally posted by: proteus33
a reply to: Southern Guardian

and him claiming transgender statis to dodge prison is a slap in the face to the trans community.


hello! actual trans person active in the trans community here, just letting you know that the only slap in the face we as a community feel in regards to this issue is when people insist on misgendering Chelsea and using her deadname over and over again through the course of entire threads by people who damn well know better but like to make cheap petty shots.

less of a slap in the face but also annoying is when people try to use us as some sort of proxy for their views, as if multiple of us haven't already spoken up in favour of her in this very thread.


Look.

Majority , including me dont except trans people as anything but the sex they where born with.

Thats not changing. You can rant, rave and apply labels such as "bigot" it will not make any diffrence.


Lets get one thing straight.

I dont hate you, i wont call you names like "tranny" , i wont hurt you or even deny a job to you.

I just view transgenderism as a mental health disease and I wont play into delusions.

You can feel free to dress up in skirts and women's clothing, i wont stop you or even agree to people who want you. But I wont view as anything but the gender you where born with.



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 01:00 AM
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originally posted by: Wardaddy454

originally posted by: continuousThunder

originally posted by: proteus33
a reply to: Southern Guardian

and him claiming transgender statis to dodge prison is a slap in the face to the trans community.


hello! actual trans person active in the trans community here, just letting you know that the only slap in the face we as a community feel in regards to this issue is when people insist on misgendering Chelsea and using her deadname over and over again through the course of entire threads by people who damn well know better but like to make cheap petty shots.

less of a slap in the face but also annoying is when people try to use us as some sort of proxy for their views, as if multiple of us haven't already spoken up in favour of her in this very thread.


Deadname?


Another liberal woo woo buzz word. Ignore it.



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 01:01 AM
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originally posted by: continuousThunder
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

who is the final arbiter of what is and is not?


XX and XY



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 01:03 AM
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Let's face it if manning was a blond straight corn fed boy many here would be singing his praises but seeing he is a trans person he will get more hate because trans folk are the new gay folk for some.
They gotta hate someone.



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 01:10 AM
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originally posted by: testingtesting
Let's face it if manning was a blond straight corn fed boy many here would be singing his praises but seeing he is a trans person he will get more hate because trans folk are the new gay folk for some.
They gotta hate someone.


Nope, principle is the same.

Manning made no attempt to go through correct whistlblower channels.
If he had and failed then I would agree to going to wikileaks, but even then only releases the needed information and not a indiscriminate data dump as Manning did.



posted on Jan, 16 2018 @ 01:14 AM
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a reply to: Theprodicalson


Majority , including me dont except trans people as anything but the sex they where born with...


Majority is not even close to the reality.

As for you, I don’t know how to break this to you, but no one cares if you “accept” the reality.

Science does, the doctors do, and most importantly the trans community knows who they are.



You’ll just have to deal with it.




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