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Bigelow, UFOs, MUFON and ‘DeLonge’ Road to AATIP

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posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 01:23 AM
a reply to: lakespirit

Interesting observation about 'stepping out for a smoke' !

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 03:17 AM
a reply to: lakespirit

There is a much more mundane answer your your query in my opinion and is a fact that most people that see unidentified lights are smokers and dog walkers...Purley down to the times of day this occurs..morning and nighttime

Grab a smoke and take the dog for a walk

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 04:58 AM
a reply to: pigsy2400

I would bet good money that at least half of all "cig based ufo sightings" are in some way related to the eye's natural normalisation process as it adjusts between day and night vision.

Try it yourselves.

Stand in a dark field looking at stars.
Now light a match/lighter and look at the flame for 3/4 seconds to replicate a cigarette lighting.
Now look back up at the stars

When you look at the flame in "night vision mode" a number of biological changes occur which instantly resets your vision to day light setting.
This can then take up to 30 minutes to revert back to night vision and it is normal for some people to experience strange lights/flashes/distortions etc whilst the process occurs.

Can be especially noticeable if you are looking at a large black object with multiple light sources.

edit on 1-11-2018 by Jukiodone because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 08:46 AM
Going back to Zondo And Tom's "No Place Like Rome"

Joe Murgia posted a full transcript :

Here's some random comments from Zondo's presentation

.... in the 1940s, we had the Roswell incident. I’m not going to speculate in this room what crashed at Roswell. But those of you who are familiar with the world of intelligence, know that a military response is usually symmetrical to the incident. A crashed weather balloon does not usually merit the response of a colonel, several flat bed, military vehicles and an armed force....

Where is the evidence that several flat bed military vehicles and an armed force ventured 70 miles off base in 1947? It is a nothing statement based on legend to make people think he's confirming something ET happened.

And then, late 1990s, once again, space shuttle missions continue to report interesting sightings. Furthermore, the United States gains additional access to former Soviet files. And what was made very clear to us, was what we were seeing on our side of the ocean, so was Russia.

Again the language used 'interesting sightings' could mean seeing the Great Wall of China from space. It is vague and meaningless. There are reports of UFOs from the Space Shuttle but they have either been explained or they are simply inflated by hucksters.

Last year around this time, its program director (that’s Lue) decided to leave the government in frustration, based on the bureaucracy. At no time was my office discredited. But having a conversation with senior leadership, proved to be near impossible. The stigma was simply too much. The next natural question is: Does the program still exist? And I am here to tell you right now, the effort is ongoing....

But Zondo actually took early retirement as we know. He even said he knew nothing about TTSA. Words games again? He'd spoke to Tom but maybe never actually heard "TTSA" mentioned. There he was on stage with Tom just days after 'leaving' the Pentagon.

In 2009 he was also messing around trying to create a maritime cargo ship venture just as Lue became head of AATIP. Sounds like he wasn't actually that committed from the get go. But he hung on for five more years and then just gave up. Or did he really? Is he still operative?

..... let’s pretend this pen is submarine. A submarine does not look like a plane or a rocket. In fact it has a propeller and uses a combination of water and air to create buoyancy. And that is why a plane does not look like a rocket and a rocket does not look like a submarine. And they all perform quite differently. Yet, what we are seeing are things that can operate as freely in the atmosphere, as they can in a vacuum as they can under water, without changing their physical properties. And from a military perspective, one can imagine how advantageous this would be.

Let's pretend this pen is a spaceship too....

There is more but I don't have time at the moment.

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 10:17 AM
a reply to: pigsy2400

That's how I take it too..

To 'summon' takes intention.. and most smokers would not
be using intention.

Still.. I like to encourage creative thought.

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 10:21 AM
a reply to: Jukiodone

we need all the good, solid, prosaic explanations that we can get,
to improve the signal to noise ratio.

I'm not a smoker myself, so that was not a factor in my own
'BTUFO' encounter.


posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 12:55 PM
a reply to: mirageman

All good points...

I can forgive TTSA and any other organisation for simple admin mistakes and errors, hell we all deal with companies that at some point have made a mistake etc. - Not that TTSA owe me anything nor anyone, however when the information that they are presenting is so inaccurate and full of amateur mistakes, it's actually in ridiculous territory now.

They have done nothing for their own credibility at all....

This is from TDL email to John Podesta in relation to what they want to achieve with their project;

"This project is about changing the cynical views of youth towards government."

Is it really about UAPs...... or is it a Marketing ploy to change the narrative and perception of government for the new generation of millennial voters that are all in the social media side of things... ?

If so, they would had people in the field of Ufology queuing up ready to jump on-board with the potential promise of "information" and a feeling of being important with their existing knowledge of the field. Knapp for example, wrote the thesis for the Sekret Machines novels. It was also highlighted in other TDL emails to Podesta about his involvement from the get-go - no wonder he doesn't like the "nit-pickers";

George Knapp is an multi-award winning Journalist, the one who famously broke the story of Area-51's existence many years ago. He's an incredible man. I've actually created a secondary advisory group with him included to help take the direction from my Primary Advisors and direct the info toward the youth. He helped me create my thesis (3 Sekret Machines NonFiction Books Coming out after the Novel) and that thesis is what gained my friendship with The very important General from Wright Patt that was on our call.

Its all a ploy to control "A Narrative" - what that narrative is and who the intended audience now is... is beyond me.... Who actually cares any of this stuff now, about from people in Ufology?

All the talk about "yeah, but they got world wide attention in the 3 articles posted in 2017 December" is pointless. The only reason those articles were posted, was pressure from TDL and associates in the first place. This is the reason there has been no followup from those media entities, it was for all intents and purposes, a Press Release.. pushed for and put together by TTSA and TDL themselves, it wasnt a story that those 3 entities thought worth pursuing...


When we release the trailer, with my foreword, we are planning on doing the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, or the Washington Post. My question is this: Do you know anybody at those institutions that you can put in a good word to consider the story? I think we can do fine on our own, but knowing a good journalist, somebody that would get the hint if you put out an email, we can set up the entire project credibly. I remember Leslie Keane, but I can't remember who she writes for... Or somebody else more elevated than her, that they can get this in the right publication.

Yes... I have been reading WikiLeaks again.. However I do feel that at times, things that we discover, discuss then disregard, can prove much use later down the line when other information comes to light..
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posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 01:40 PM
You wonder why they didn’t hire a legitimate knowledgeable UFOligist just to make their appearances professional and not amateurish like the Rome deal.

Actually, all of this doesn’t matter since it’s kind of clear they don’t have any inside information, and
that is what people thought they were getting with TTSA, not UFO amateur hour.

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 01:45 PM
a reply to: pigsy2400

All the talk about "yeah, but they got world wide attention in the 3 articles posted in 2017 December" is pointless. The only reason those articles were posted, was pressure from TDL and associates in the first place. This is the reason there has been no followup from those media entities, it was for all intents and purposes, a Press Release.. pushed for and put together by TTSA and TDL themselves, it wasnt a story that those 3 entities thought worth pursuing..

Here I kind of disagree with you. I doubt TDL had the juice to get those MSM outlets to give them the positive press they got.

A higher-up group, I believe, could only cause that and that’s the CIA.

If anything, without the government IC backing, TDL would have been mocked by the MSM.

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 01:46 PM
a reply to: pigsy2400

Great post.

We have covered this half a dozen times before.. but I guess we
all keep repeating ourselves, myself included, as we just can't
believe they are this stupid... so we try to find fancy
explanations for their behavior.

Maybe they are this stupid?

What's sad though, is that UFOlogy in general is falling into line..
even though there is nothing but 'stupid' involved.

I guess that should tell us something about our less criticaly-
thinking brethren?


posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:06 PM
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Well apologies kev if I am going over the same old stuff.

The reason I have was to try and find out a motive for doing by all this. It is amateur hour...

As it's ats of course...all of this is could be the same old left hand right hand thing.

Whilst we have all sat here debating, going over the differences in Zondos wardrobe, his flatulence levels and if it smells of cabbage or not...the real MIC has had a bit more peace and quiet on the real black program stuff, that just involves highly classified but earthbound propulsion systems. I bet they have probably had a right good chuckle...and we missed it all...

Who really is paying attention to TTSA et al? Ufology.... No-one else cares.....or gives a damn...IMO.... Perhaps a few interested Congress people's who liked x files back in the day but not much else.

Ar least it will give ufology something to talk about at all the Alienconinthedesert symposiums for the next 20 years...

I wish there was more crossover between the ufo forum and the aircraft forum. There are so many interesting points and posters in the aircraft forum that would probably shed some light on some things.

If I said the word "green lady" here most wouldn't know what I was taking about..shame as it's been seen as is technically a in most don't know what it is when they see it....Oh well...I'm a RAF boy at heart I suppose
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posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:20 PM
a reply to: Willtell

He asked podesta for help....and which publications Keane worked for...and who wrote one of the stories?? Leslie Keane....

It's tdl words... Not mine...
edit on p30225182400 by pigsy2400 because: (no reason given)

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:26 PM
Let me post something that ordinarily I wouldn’t because even though Michael Salla seems like a nice guy, I don’t really go for the Exopolitics angle.

But this is something important and dovetails with the Hillary Clinton, John Podesta angle and of course the Russians. His logic here seems pretty on the money…

He outlines the fact that TDLs group is basically promoting the Russia and US have their own antigravity machines and that that is what is behind the UFO phenomenon, these Sekret Machines.

Now recall, of course, Hillary was very anti-Russian and IF she were elected that would have gone hand in hand with the disclosure that Russia is the dirty dog behind a lot of the nefarious UFOs gallivanting around Nuclear weapon sites.

When the friendly-to-Russia Trump was elected we know all the talk about TTSA has held back because Hillary wasn’t elected.


All this suggests that the 2004 incident involving the USS Nimitiz will fit a narrative that is slowly emerging through DeLonge’s Sekret Machines book series and To The Stars Academy. This firmly points to the incident eventually being depicted as Russian antigravity craft taking a menacing posture to the Navy battle group. There are obvious political advantages in depicting Russia possessing a secret space program that menaces US warships in international waters. This would make it possible for the Pentagon to receive substantial increases in funding for its own USAF run secret space program, which is just as advanced as the Russian program, according to DeLonge. Depicting UFOs as national security threats posed by the Russians, with their steadily growing alliance with China, would enable programs created to deal with this threat to be kept highly classified. Indeed, the name of Elizondo’s Pentagon project, the “Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program”, alludes to such a process already being underway.

This isn’t in agreement with my disinformation theory directly but is similar and an explanation why TTSA from the start never really tried to promote UFOs, and as we see when they do look like rank armatures.

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:28 PM
a reply to: pigsy2400

No big thing. All I’m saying is I believe they couldn't get any positive UFO MSM press without permission from higher-ups in the IC.

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:41 PM
a reply to: pigsy2400

I"m tired of green lady talk, and talk like that..
that's why I personally don't discuss it here.

Nearly everything gets confused with UFOs,
when people have 'UFOs on the brain'.

But to your point.. we don't know which layers
of the people in TTSA are in the know, and which
are just dupes themselves.

I mean, we have a fair idea... who has worked
extensively with the CIA might be partially in the know,
while a 'regular' fringe scientist would be a dupe.

I don't know.. there is little hope for 'ufology'..
it's being voraciously turned into another modern
folklore religion.


posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:43 PM
a reply to: Willtell

My friend...

Do you really think that the large numbers of fever-brained
to see UFO crowds will actually BELIEVE that it was all just

That doesn't make sense to me one tiny bit.

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:50 PM
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

Put the pieces together and that possibility kind of fits. You have to look at the whole picture.

That’s why they said they aren’t after the UFO people

Lately, there have been some books by major authors starting with the book AREA 51 a few years ago bringing Russia into the Roswell flap.

Also, what UFO folks don't understand is they are a small minority...

posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:53 PM
a reply to: Willtell

Well if the Abrahamic faiths have suckered billions of people,
I guess anything is possible when it comes to duping the
non-critical thinkers.

It should be obvious in a few years, if this theory is correct.

But if this is ONLY about heating up the cold war, I'll be
very disappointed.


posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:56 PM
a reply to: Willtell

I have to say though... to repeat a theme that you have posted
about yourself..

if they truly want people to carry around cell phone apps, feeding
them 'ufo/uap' / experiencer info..

then that would have two benefits:

1) It would help track black project craft.. thus having intelligence value.
2) It would help find new experiencers, to examine their bodies for evidence.

In such a case... it's not the minds of believers they want...

they want their bodies...

and their intel on black project sightings.

I think this is actually the MOST likely theory.. but I don't know..
they might just be stupid.


posted on Nov, 1 2018 @ 02:58 PM
a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

I personally don’t necessarily believe it but it is possible. The idea is from Salla, not me, I'm just putting it out there, food for thought. It has a little logic to it.

TTSA is putting out such mixed signals.

Just think...
So we have TTSA coming out with a high-tech angle originally and having little or no UFOlogical info in their presentation.
Along with BIO technologist and IC members all in this academy and not one legitimate UFOligist of any repute
Then you have Zondo pretending to be some kind of objective no-nonsense scientist. That died pretty quick.
Then you have a John Keel type writer in Peter Levenda going the ultra-terrestrial angle
Then you have them going around making foolish UFO presentations
This represents a plethora of mixed signals or just a bunch of amateurs that don’t really care what the hell their doing…I doubt that’s the case
Because they’re not amateurs in regard to many other fields but UFOlogy there presenting nonsense

So what could it be?

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