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The gentleperson's guide to forum spies [and other disinformation actors]

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posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 10:09 AM
a reply to: UpsideDownWorld

I doubt there is a lot they can do to notice a well designed bot.

If you are talking about the Russian collusion stuff being fake news..


How anyone reads that email and HONESTLY thinks “ the fake news media is just out to get him!”

I have no idea..

“Russian government agent” and “ to show the Russian governments support for your father” are literally spelled out repeatedly..

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 10:23 AM

originally posted by: IgnoranceIsntBlisss
a reply to: tigertatzen

Oh they do it. It goes back to the 9/11 No Planer COINTELPRO squads.

You'd do a big detailed post that would just annihilate their disinfo drivel and they'd just steamroll the page over constantly re'iterating themselves as if they 100% had the entire debate all along, so that anyone clicking LastPost only ever saw them shining. And I mean brazen it'd end up turning into pages of calling them out on it and they'd still push on. They'd all just talk right over all their detractors even as if none of us were even in the room, just constantly re-confirming their BS to each other for any newcomers to the "BS Loop". Of course with the data its a more specific type of debating there. Everyone could see it was pure cooridinated though, yet it still killed the movement after a year of that BS in parallel coupled with Obama winning and all the liberals turning into sheep again.

These days its more about just derailing the threads that damage your partisan / hate group, making the posts extremely annoying and tedious to try and respond to if possible, and just talk in pointless endless demagogue bigot bait if possible circles until there only ever was the partisan last word times five and YOU "WIN". Never any actual intent on intellectual discourse, nope, just damage control via deflection & derailment, all you gotta do is not name call or cursed word and get away with it for years even...

Nailed it! I have seen this over and over again. It’s partly why I’ve hardly bothered posting to ATS, you think you’re debating someone with logic and reasoned arguments, then you realise they have no interest in any of that and you’re effectively wasting your time. Pfft...

BTW I really admire the work of the genuine contributors to these forums, the ones trying to bring to light what’s really going on out there. You’re efforts aren’t in vain!
Also it just goes to show with all the trolling and disinfo going on, there’s a certain faction that are scared of the truth getting out...

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 10:51 AM
a reply to: surfer_soul


So let me get this right..

The people pointing to accredited news organizations are the ones refusing to have logical conversations...

While those sourcing infowars, newsmax and other compilation sites THAT DO NOT EVEN EMPLOY JOURNALISTS, they just copy paste msm stories after putting their own spin on them all while screaming “fake news” to any fact they do not like, are the ones who are posting heartfelt introspective arguments?!?!

Really lol,!?!

It is so impossible to get a logical conversation out of a conservative on here that the one conservative person who will have a logical point and counterpoint conversation (JBurns) instantly gained a fan base and nothing but praise....

Just the fact from ANY angle you can come to that conclusion blows my mind...

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 11:16 AM
a reply to: JoshuaCox

WHAT!!!? Indeed! I never said anything of the sort fella.

I’m not a conservative either, in fact I don’t fall for any of the political BS as I know none of them actually live up to their promises. It’s just rhetoric and spin.

Come to what conclusion exactly? I have no idea what you are talking about?
The thread was about trolling in general, why should everything come down to politics?

Also if you believe the MSM doesn’t spin stories to suit whatever agenda they have you’re entirely deluded.

I believe you gained quite a bit of praise yourself in this thread judging by the stars you received... so stop acting like a bear with a soar butt.

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 11:21 AM
There are days when I go to "recent" and it seems a bunch of related topics are all clustered on page one with about the same time stamp in creation but different authors.

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 11:29 AM
I don't think forum sliding works on ATS, as each new comment brings the thread right back to the top of the charts.

There are no negative votes either. It's more a reddit thing I think.

It isn't hard to recognise those who have a hidden agenda though, you see they deny having one, while doing everything they can to push the agenda they say they haven't got.

edit on 7-1-2018 by Jonjonj because: added a word

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 01:19 PM
a reply to: Jonjonj

The ATS version of the forum slide is the poster who, as Tiger says, "will just start replying to every single person who commented with these inane one liner replies, and they do it until they've at least made another page roll over." Yes it bumps the thread but it also moves meaningful, well sourced replies to previous pages thus making them invisible to anyone who only looks at the recent page of a thread.

I don't think it's so much a problem of "hidden agendas" as it is adherence to a hard partisan line and an unwillingness to even consider anything that the 'enemy' promulgates. It allows them to dismiss arguments simply because they don't confirm a (oftentimes unconscious) bias.

There's a poster or two in the thread who seem to think this was aimed at them. The OP did not imply any such thing in his initial discussion, the ones who have come off as offended did that on their own.

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 03:05 PM
a reply to: surfer_soul

If I misinterpreted your post I apologize.

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 04:40 PM
a reply to: JBurns
He, there are more then Trump or political group though, for or against trollorinos on here. Some even have rule books, in fact some years ago 5 or 10 think there were a few threads with there rules of engagement were linked, it was a few hundred pages. Now who's going to read all that? Dis info strategy, which for the greater part comes down to saying the same things over and over, fancy tech and such is no match for boots on the ground. I find it all hilarious, but its all nonsense for the most part and part and parcel of just what humans do.

Most if not all, I would say 99% of things are kind of no brainers and been done before, but hey I see why they do it, like one ze German once said, repeat things over and over and over, then you win by default, merely for the fact that you have saturated things in so much crap for generations nobody knows any different they have practically been raised by it.

Must be why ATS has been on a decline for years now, there is little to anything new on this site now, and even years ago if there was actually anything supper interesting, well it got 404'd. Yup, "poof, presto, gone" just like that, it disappeared. Its not hard to bury information and just add crap on top, its the internet after all. But now its so lame there is nothing even worth 404ing on this site anymore. Oh well such are the times.

Political shenanigans is pretty much the least of it, amusing at most, retarded at best, sometimes maybe even hilarious. But boring on all accounts, must be why this site is taking a dive headfirst, its just oh so, so, so boring here now a days.

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 04:53 PM
a reply to: JBurns

Thanks always good reminders.

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 04:59 PM

originally posted by: Jonjonj
I don't think forum sliding works on ATS, as each new comment brings the thread right back to the top of the charts.

There are no negative votes either. It's more a reddit thing I think.

It isn't hard to recognise those who have a hidden agenda though, you see they deny having one, while doing everything they can to push the agenda they say they haven't got.

You just REPLY to a bunch of topics to "slide" the undesired topic DOWN the "recent" list.

As you SAID...replies "bump" threads to the top.

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 06:15 PM
a reply to: JBurns

Intelligence wise, we engage in so much disinformation (as a nation) that countering their lies with truth is off the table (we already saturate with lies). Our only real option is educating the public about information/cyber warfare, and how it pertains to our lives in the early 21st century

That right there, highlighted, is the precise problem I've been wrestling with in recent months. We as Westerners using the internet are faced with such a mountain of garbage being put out by bad actors & shill-bots, that it's becoming damn near impossible to glean the most important, truthful bits of information on any given subject which is relevant to the positive progress of our societies.

It's seriously got me so frustrated & upset recently that I've found myself metaphorically banging my head against the screen of my laptop, furious that so many supposed citizens of the free world are deliberately seeding false, misleading, or malconstructed information in such huge quantities that it's actually damaging the basics wellbeing of people throughout our civilisation. It's a #ing disgrace. But what can we do? Is this the 'post-truth' society?

I can only hope that an organic revolutionary movement springs up - not from the masses, who are so painfully controlled now, so dependent on the bull# systems which have gradually taken a higher & higher percentage of their real terms wealth over the past forty years, that they have no chance of breaking away & organising any meaningful & constructive changes to the structure, function & experience of society. No, I hope for White Hat aristocracy, or at least industrialists & spooks working in tandem according to a set of human-friendly ethics, ready not only to change the fabric of our civil & social infrastructure, but also to guide, teach, inform & lift up those who have had no means to ever experience the benefits of true, creative freedom, to find out what it is to be human when machines have finally taken over all of the underlying manual jobs. It's a gargantuan task, which begins, no less, with the removal of strictures which put a glass ceiling above any & all who seek out a future which consists of something more than consumerism.

Long, hard road. We may need an act of God, to get all those wonderful black research technologies out for the benefit of all Mankind. But strong leadership & instruction would be required, otherwise the train would derail within a few years...

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 06:18 PM
a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

Forgot to say: In the Chinese Book of Changes, the I Ching, it says that when society is run by unjust & foolish people, then the virtuous must retreat from society & live in seclusion, waiting for a time when changes can occur. Because of the risk of pollution of one's values, standards, and ethics. Maybe all who seek a better way of life would be best to adopt such a posture in regards to mainstream propaganda. There must be ways to go off-the-grid, yet remaining online somehow, without exposing oneself to the wrath of the System..?

posted on Jan, 7 2018 @ 08:02 PM
a reply to: galadofwarthethird

That is because conspiracy theories hide in the dark corner of what we do t understand. In the modern world that corner has gotten smaller and smaller.

It is just WAY harder to fake something supernatural now and mistaken identity tends to get explained almost instantly thanks to the internet.

What does that leave???

Phrophecy and political corruption..and phrophecy no one cares about because it hasn’t happened yet.

posted on Jan, 8 2018 @ 11:11 AM
There are a lot of trolls in this world. However there are those few that have a clear cut agenda when they participate in a forum.

posted on Jan, 8 2018 @ 11:50 AM
I think this needs to published here on ATS:

Eight Traits of the Disinformationalist

1) Avoidance. They never actually discuss issues head-on or provide constructive input, generally avoiding citation of references or credentials. Rather, they merely imply this, that, and the other. Virtually everything about their presentation implies their authority and expert knowledge in the matter without any further justification for credibility.

2) Selectivity. They tend to pick and choose opponents carefully, either applying the hit-and-run approach against mere commentators supportive of opponents, or focusing heavier attacks on key opponents who are known to directly address issues. Should a commentator become argumentative with any success, the focus will shift to include the commentator as well.

3) Coincidental. They tend to surface suddenly and somewhat coincidentally with a new controversial topic with no clear prior record of participation in general discussions in the particular public arena involved. They likewise tend to vanish once the topic is no longer of general concern. They were likely directed or elected to be there for a reason, and vanish with the reason.

4) Teamwork. They tend to operate in self-congratulatory and complementary packs or teams. Of course, this can happen naturally in any public forum, but there will likely be an ongoing pattern of frequent exchanges of this sort where professionals are involved. Sometimes one of the players will infiltrate the opponent camp to become a source for straw man or other tactics designed to dilute opponent presentation strength.

5) Anti-conspiratorial. They almost always have disdain for 'conspiracy theorists' and, usually, for those who in any way believe JFK was not killed by LHO. Ask yourself why, if they hold such disdain for conspiracy theorists, do they focus on defending a single topic discussed in a NG focusing on conspiracies? One might think they would either be trying to make fools of everyone on every topic, or simply ignore the group they hold in such disdain.Or, one might more rightly conclude they have an ulterior motive for their actions in going out of their way to focus as they do.

6) Artificial Emotions. An odd kind of 'artificial' emotionalism and an unusually thick skin -- an ability to persevere and persist even in the face of overwhelming criticism and unacceptance. This likely stems from intelligence community training that, no matter how condemning the evidence, deny everything, and never become emotionally involved or reactive. The net result for a disinfo artist is that emotions can seem artificial.

Most people, if responding in anger, for instance, will express their animosity throughout their rebuttal. But disinfo types usually have trouble maintaining the 'image' and are hot and cold with respect to pretended emotions and their usually more calm or unemotional communications style. It's just a job, and they often seem unable to 'act their role in character' as well in a communications medium as they might be able in a real face-to-face conversation/confrontation. You might have outright rage and indignation one moment, ho-hum the next, and more anger later -- an emotional yo-yo.

With respect to being thick-skinned, no amount of criticism will deter them from doing their job, and they will generally continue their old disinfo patterns without any adjustments to criticisms of how obvious it is that they play that game -- where a more rational individual who truly cares what others think might seek to improve their communications style, substance, and so forth, or simply give up.

7) Inconsistent. There is also a tendency to make mistakes which betray their true self/motives. This may stem from not really knowing their topic, or it may be somewhat 'freudian', so to speak, in that perhaps they really root for the side of truth deep within.

I have noted that often, they will simply cite contradictory information which neutralizes itself and the author. For instance, one such player claimed to be a Navy pilot, but blamed his poor communicating skills (spelling, grammar, incoherent style) on having only a grade-school education. I'm not aware of too many Navy pilots who don't have a college degree. Another claimed no knowledge of a particular topic/situation but later claimed first-hand knowledge of it.

8) Time Constant. Recently discovered, with respect to News Groups, is the response time factor. There are three ways this can be seen to work, especially when the government or other empowered player is involved in a cover up operation:

a) ANY NG posting by a targeted proponent for truth can result in an IMMEDIATE response. The government and other empowered players can afford to pay people to sit there and watch for an opportunity to do some damage. SINCE DISINFO IN A NG ONLY WORKS IF THE READER SEES IT - FAST RESPONSE IS CALLED FOR, or the visitor may be swayed towards truth.

b) When dealing in more direct ways with a disinformationalist, such as email, DELAY IS CALLED FOR - there will usually be a minimum of a 48-72 hour delay. This allows a sit-down team discussion on response strategy for best effect, and even enough time to 'get permission' or instruction from a formal chain of command.

c) In the NG example 1) above, it will often ALSO be seen that bigger guns are drawn and fired after the same 48-72 hours delay - the team approach in play. This is especially true when the targeted truth seeker or their comments are considered more important with respect to potential to reveal truth. Thus, a serious truth sayer will be attacked twice for the same sin.

Bolding mine. I've noticed this among several posters I suspect of being shills. On another board I used to go to, I called this type of person "the space alien." They seem to have no understanding of the emotions that normal people experience. Like it was Mr. Spock from Star Trek writing the post, and your emotion are totally illogical.

posted on Jan, 8 2018 @ 12:18 PM
the downside?.....when you question everything, you trust nothing......common ploy used for thousands of years by those (propagandists) that wish to disrupt cohesive societies, and create an atmosphere of distrust.....this opens up the populace, looking for simple solutions, to gravitate toward a charismatic leader who echoes their own suspicions

posted on Jan, 8 2018 @ 04:08 PM
a reply to: JBurns

What if like, a spy posted a thread about how to detect spies to trick ppl into thinking they weren't also a spy?

Hmmm JBurns?
What do you think about that technique?
Was it that effective?

posted on Jan, 8 2018 @ 04:16 PM
a reply to: AndyFromMichigan

My conspiracy theory is that all the shill accounts would want to come into the counter-shill thread and agree that shills need to be countered.

This would "wash" those shill accounts by leaving a phoney paper trail showing those people were big anti-shill types, even though in reality they were all shills creating a clever guise.

That means anyone agreeing that their are shills and they are bad is probably actually a shill laundering their fake account.

Me, I have no comment because it doesn't matter either way to me what they say. I'm just making this particular tactic well known for discussion sake. Whatcha think?
edit on 1/8/2018 by muzzleflash because: (no reason given)

posted on Jan, 8 2018 @ 04:19 PM
I hope everyone is both totally paranoid and laughing their rears off about this now.

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